Hive Build Times

Chickenbomb

<div class="IPBDescription">Timing for various boosts</div>Well, AngryChild, HeatSurge, and I did some tests with the Hive build times. Enzyme is a 3 second buff for 2 Res that boosts attack speed by 25%.

Default build time: 180 seconds

1 Gorge/No shift: 115 seconds

1 Gorge/With Shift: 95 seconds

1 Gorge/With Shift/With Enzyme: 85 seconds.

As you can see, having a shift makes a pretty big difference, but Enzyme does not for 1 gorge. In fact, enzyme is a pretty big waste of rez considering it only boosts the speed by 10 seconds. Now with a 2nd gorge, it might be a much bigger difference.

Hopefully we can get some more tests later with 2 gorges and see how much difference it makes.

thipp

Seems like Enzyme would stack per gorge. At least, that's what would make sense. I guess if you were in a huge rush...

Desther

I think anything more than a single gorge is too cost-inefficient. Not much point in spending res to speed up a hive then have no res to buy the upgrades when it's done.

Wake

Although the shift will probably useless thereafter, 20 seconds can make a big difference on the second hive.

Worth the chamber imho

Amb

a shift is worth the res because other than helping the gorge to speed up the hive, it also gives the alien comm the option make some eggs in case of a rush.

Chickenbomb

The shift is also useful when defending against pushes, especially for energy intensive lifeforms.

AlphaWolf

Any data on two gorges with no shift and no enzyme?

Wake

<!--quoteo(post=2053283:date=Dec 30 2012, 10:26 AM:name=Amb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Amb @ Dec 30 2012, 10:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053283"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->a shift is worth the res because other than helping the gorge to speed up the hive, it also gives the alien comm the option make some eggs in case of a rush.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Absolutly right

PimpToad

I thank you for confirming with numbers what I already know, but some people I've met on servers STILL insist Gorge spray doesn't speed up Hive maturation (usually an NS1 vet). And I think having a shift near the Hive also helps out the defense in case marines come strolling in later OR your initial defenders get wiped out before the Hive is completed.

Though I do wish they would change the mechanic as it's pretty damn boring spending nearly 2 minutes staring at a Hive. The extra minute you gain spraying is a godsend, but sheesh holding down right-click for a rather lengthy period of time isn't exactly fun.

TychoCelchuuu

You can also teleport the shift somewhere else when it's at 100% maturity if you want to do something with it after your hive is done.

CrushaK

Did anyone actually try out already if you can teleport a Hive to a different spot with an upgraded Shift? Would be hilarious to grow a Hive on a secure tech point and then instantly move it to a marine base after capturing it.

Chickenbomb

<!--quoteo(post=2053384:date=Dec 30 2012, 11:57 AM:name=AlphaWolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AlphaWolf @ Dec 30 2012, 11:57 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053384"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Any data on two gorges with no shift and no enzyme?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Yeah, we're going to test that too next time.

Makenshi

Elementary algebra shows roughly 85 seconds for 2 gorges without shift and 65 with if the 115/95 are accurate

Chickenbomb

<!--quoteo(post=2053521:date=Dec 30 2012, 08:53 PM:name=Makenshi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Makenshi @ Dec 30 2012, 08:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053521"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Elementary algebra shows roughly 85 seconds for 2 gorges without shift and 65 with if the 115/95 are accurate<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Well, we would want to see if there's diminishing returns, or if the healing spray stacks.

Ness_FrogKing

<!--quoteo(post=2053436:date=Dec 30 2012, 04:17 PM:name=PimpToad)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PimpToad @ Dec 30 2012, 04:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053436"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I thank you for confirming with numbers what I already know, but some people I've met on servers STILL insist Gorge spray doesn't speed up Hive maturation (usually an NS1 vet).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So far as I know, it doesn't, though Nutrient Mist does. It does speed up build time, however.

Maturity is a mechanic that improves max health and armour of structures over time after they're built, to a cap (and also allows certain upgrades or abilities on some structures). It is not the act of building them.

Yes, I realize that you probably meant building the hive, but given that there actually is a mechanic called maturity, one needs to be careful with their terminology :-)

<!--quoteo(post=2053521:date=Dec 30 2012, 10:53 PM:name=Makenshi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Makenshi @ Dec 30 2012, 10:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053521"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Elementary algebra shows roughly 85 seconds for 2 gorges without shift and 65 with if the 115/95 are accurate<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/2012/8/ns2_build_216_changelog" target="_blank">Build 216</a> changed gorge spray so that multiple gorges weren't so effective. "Heal spray no longer builds structures at a simple fixed rate of .6. It now adds .25 + a scalar between .25 and .7, depending on the last time it was sprayed. This makes multiple Gorges helpful, but increasingly less effective."

So, 2 gorges are probably slower than those estimates, though I really would like to see the actual times for them.

Makenshi

The values stack for at least 2 gorges. My buddy and I dual gorge to build up extractors quite often and you can see the percentage go up with every healspray. Again, I took no value recordings on my own, so the 85/65 figure (actually closer to 84.5 and 64.7 or something if I recall) is purely based off of the figures you provided.

Edit: As for how I arrived at the values, I simply set up the equation 180=(1+x)t, where t equals time and x is equal to the percentage increase in maturity rate with a gorge healspraying the hive. You end up with roughly a 57% increase for a shiftless gorge and a 89% increase with shift. Now, I did not in fact take into the account the change in maturity rate due to gorge running out of energy without shift, but the 65 seconds with shift should still be somewhat accurate, while dual gorging hive without a shift is probably slightly shorter than 85 seconds (not by much though, say, around 80 seconds).

OnosFactory

"You can also teleport the shift somewhere else when it's at 100% maturity if you want to do something with it after your hive is done. " +15 res and upgrade time.

Healspray has had many changes during Beta so thats where alot of misinformation filters in from [as they come back from hiatus, expecting the same game as they remember but with the advertised performance upgrades], plus lack of visible effect on a hive compared to a res node (it just seems to not show as often) doesn't help.

The funny thing about people who say healspray doesn't work on hives .... they never go gorge and never go khaam, only comm.

AlphaWolf

When you go gorge and healspray a growing hive, you can easily tell it is building faster by watching the percentage indicator rise a bit faster when you are hitting it.

waflz

Ah dam man this post would be handy somewhere else...