Defensive structures.
grazr
Join Date: 2012-10-12 Member: 162195Members
Join Date: 2012-10-12 Member: 162195Members
So i understand that the game is supposed to be asymmetrical but i've noticed some imbalances in regards to alien vs marine commanders play.
Off the bat alien com is easier to deal with as it requires zero coordination with your players unless you want them to take a dual resource spot first like lava falls or nano. Usually experienced players will instinctively do this anyway.
Secondly alien com has a crotch of being able to spam whips, crags and shades along with any other hydras left behind by gorges (who might not even be playing gorge anymore).
It's frustrating as a marine to enter a room to be attacked by 3 invisible hydra's, X amount of whips and a spray of your rifle revealing 4 additional crags and a shade when the marines only get 3 un-upgradable sentries with limited FoV's.
I really feel like there should be a structure limit per cyst. As if say, each cyst can only provide so many "nutrients" if we have to have a narrative explination too. So alien coms are more likely to make tactical decisions like 3 crags, or 2 crags and a shade, or 2 whips and a shade, etc. In any one room corner (not that's still more structures per room vs sentries as the com can still place several cysts into a single room).
Not only does the alien passive mobility advantage provide overall initial map control, but it seems more fair to me when half an alien team can have as much assault effectiveness as an entire ball of marines... and a single skulk is far more of a nuisance than a single marine.
Off the bat alien com is easier to deal with as it requires zero coordination with your players unless you want them to take a dual resource spot first like lava falls or nano. Usually experienced players will instinctively do this anyway.
Secondly alien com has a crotch of being able to spam whips, crags and shades along with any other hydras left behind by gorges (who might not even be playing gorge anymore).
It's frustrating as a marine to enter a room to be attacked by 3 invisible hydra's, X amount of whips and a spray of your rifle revealing 4 additional crags and a shade when the marines only get 3 un-upgradable sentries with limited FoV's.
I really feel like there should be a structure limit per cyst. As if say, each cyst can only provide so many "nutrients" if we have to have a narrative explination too. So alien coms are more likely to make tactical decisions like 3 crags, or 2 crags and a shade, or 2 whips and a shade, etc. In any one room corner (not that's still more structures per room vs sentries as the com can still place several cysts into a single room).
Not only does the alien passive mobility advantage provide overall initial map control, but it seems more fair to me when half an alien team can have as much assault effectiveness as an entire ball of marines... and a single skulk is far more of a nuisance than a single marine.
Comments
All I can say is læwlz.
Whips are probably the worst waste of res, right after marine sentries and the robo factory. They can be soloed by unloading 3-4 clips into them no problem (1 t.res to kill them + 40 seconds) and they cost 15 t.res each.
All I can say is læwlz.
Whips are probably the worst waste of res, right after marine sentries and the robo factory. They can be soloed by unloading 3-4 clips into them no problem (1 t.res to kill them + 40 seconds) and they cost 15 t.res each.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Except in practicality, ie the live game environment that never actually happens. A surprise whip can keep a single marine from ninja'ing a res tower long enough for a skulk to finish the job and long enough that the still standing res tower produces resources that covers the purchase of the whip in the first place and maintains initial map control.
Though i admit it's situational, whips in nano or lava falls are more effective than whips anywhere else, etc. Whips are far from useless and whip spam may not be the most effective use of res, but as i said my discussion doesn't just apply just to whips.
If you want to be rewarded for doing horribly the entire match, I'm sorry to say that will never happen.
Marine bases are far more vulnerable than their counter parts. Especially if there's a forward alien position.
the end.
With regard to whips and crags and shades and all that jazz... just be thankful the commander isn't spending all that res on extra onos eggs. At the moment resources spent on lifeforms and upgrades are much better spent than on such structures, even if you feel it makes it a pain in the ass to siege a hive. It's not like marines can't get grenade launchers, or arcs, or scan to find the shade etc. You have the tools at your disposal.
Though i admit it's situational, whips in nano or lava falls are more effective than whips anywhere else, etc. Whips are far from useless and whip spam may not be the most effective use of res, but as i said my discussion doesn't just apply just to whips.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Trust me, as you play more you'll find that they are useless. The only situation where they are semi-useful is if there's a gorge with hydras with them, healing them. Otherwise, they're an extremely expensive meat shield - kinda like a clog wall that costs 15 res.
Remember that by dropping whips, aliens are foregoing or delaying other (FAR more useful) upgrades or egg drops. Also you should realize that if you've lost the RTS game, you deserve to be punished for it :-) . That's kind of the nature of NS2.
As far as comparing vulnerabilities? I think a Power Node is far less of a vulnerability up until late game than Cysts are the entire game. Can I kill one marine structure in a few hits that causes half the map's structures to die? No.
You're wrong on this one, Brosif. Aliens simply can't turtle effectively, while Marines turtle exceptionally well.
Also, in your example, that aliens base cost upwards of 100 T.Res with a minimum of two hives if not three. If a stock Marine could just walk in and destroy the whole thing it would be a bit unfair right? <i>Only you can do just that from far away by breaking Cyst chains.</i>
Oh well, live and learn.
Right now the arc seems essentially useless and is ignored by most players in games I've seen since... oh... since maybe the exo came in, or gorge got bile bomb? Not sure which.
But yeah, I think once marines get their [reasonably effective] ARCs back then whip spam will have an immediate counter.
Right now the arc seems essentially useless and is ignored by most players in games I've seen since... oh... since maybe the exo came in, or gorge got bile bomb? Not sure which.
But yeah, I think once marines get their [reasonably effective] ARCs back then whip spam will have an immediate counter.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I actually see the Marines using ARC's pretty frequently with Jet Pack support and MAC units. It's incredibly effective if you ping along their route first to clean out any drifters. Also, it's faster than an Exo push.