Melee Combat
SoulSkorpion
Join Date: 2002-04-12 Member: 423Members
Join Date: 2002-04-12 Member: 423Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Tips & tricks</div> OOkay. Time to bestow the arcane and ancient martial arts techniqus of melee combat pwnage. I learnt most of this playing years and years of Perfect Dark N64, by dodging enemy gunfire. I currently "train" for NS by playing with one knife only.
Anyway, enough of the preamble. Basically, nothing compares to good ole practise (again, practise with PD will do more than practise with NS\TFC\FA\any other HL mod, but any practise is good practise) but I'll list a few points...
1: Always bear in mind is that in a melee your primary objective is NOT to kill your enemy. It is to keep yourself alive. In other words, attack your targets with the aim of dodging fire, rather than closing the distance as fast as possible and killing them.
2: Continuing with the first point, NEVER "rush" your target". By rush, I mean run right up to them when they're firing at you. Always circle them, circling inwards to dodge fire. You only ever run right at them when you are sneaking up on them or they're reloading (and when reloading they might pull their pistol on you...) The reasons why you should never rush are that you will likely not kill as quickly as you think you will, no matter how little health you think they have, and that even if you pull off the attack and lose health in a rush you are weakened for the next marine.
3: That which does not hit you does not kill you. It doesn't matter whether they're using light machineguns or heavy machineguns - if they can't hit you, they can't kill you! Keep moving!
4: When you are circle strafing, do not cross in front of them. I'll say that again: DO NOT CROSS IN FRONT OF THEM! By crossing, I mean changing direction and running back into the stream of fire. Only cross when you have no alternative (you've run out of room to move).
5: Stalk your targets, if you can. If you get behind someone, don't draw attention to yourself with parasite and such. Quietly close the distance and then chew their head off. When they turn, be careful to stay out of their field of vision. This scenario doesn't happen all that much in NS, but it does happen (particularly in the opening of the game).
Ok, now for the NS - specific stuff.
1: ALL Kharaa move faster than turrets can track. It is possible to circle strafe a turret with, say, a fade and take minimal damage from it. I find it incredibly frustrating when I see a fade standing still next to a turret, pounding away at it. Don't.
2: (Here it comes again.) Humans can wipe out alien turrets easily because they HAVE to. Kharaa don't. Having said that, go for the turret factory, NOT the turrets, and keep moving so that you minimise damage. When the turret factory goes down, so do the turrets. You should be doing this right as a skulk, not just as a fade. A SINGLE skulk with carapace is enough to take your average turret factory down to yellow health in one attack.
3: As a skulk, if you're having trouble seeing what you're doing through those bloody huge jaws, don't hold down your attack key. Instead, press it when you've got a target (as if you're using a knife in other games.) It's much easier to see what you're doing.
4: All heavy armour means is that you have to work longer, and all HMGs mean is that you are allowed fewer mistakes. Don't be discouraged by your opponents being seemingly invincible, you ARE wounding them. It's quite normal for the guy with the most kills on your team to also have the most deaths, as well.
5: You can use enemy structures for cover. This means that sometimes you can crouch behind a turret factory and attack it, even though there are still turrets - the turrets are sometimes unable to hit you because there's the TF in the way.
....that's all I can think of for now. Oh, I really mean it about Perfect Dark <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
SoulSkorpion
Anyway, enough of the preamble. Basically, nothing compares to good ole practise (again, practise with PD will do more than practise with NS\TFC\FA\any other HL mod, but any practise is good practise) but I'll list a few points...
1: Always bear in mind is that in a melee your primary objective is NOT to kill your enemy. It is to keep yourself alive. In other words, attack your targets with the aim of dodging fire, rather than closing the distance as fast as possible and killing them.
2: Continuing with the first point, NEVER "rush" your target". By rush, I mean run right up to them when they're firing at you. Always circle them, circling inwards to dodge fire. You only ever run right at them when you are sneaking up on them or they're reloading (and when reloading they might pull their pistol on you...) The reasons why you should never rush are that you will likely not kill as quickly as you think you will, no matter how little health you think they have, and that even if you pull off the attack and lose health in a rush you are weakened for the next marine.
3: That which does not hit you does not kill you. It doesn't matter whether they're using light machineguns or heavy machineguns - if they can't hit you, they can't kill you! Keep moving!
4: When you are circle strafing, do not cross in front of them. I'll say that again: DO NOT CROSS IN FRONT OF THEM! By crossing, I mean changing direction and running back into the stream of fire. Only cross when you have no alternative (you've run out of room to move).
5: Stalk your targets, if you can. If you get behind someone, don't draw attention to yourself with parasite and such. Quietly close the distance and then chew their head off. When they turn, be careful to stay out of their field of vision. This scenario doesn't happen all that much in NS, but it does happen (particularly in the opening of the game).
Ok, now for the NS - specific stuff.
1: ALL Kharaa move faster than turrets can track. It is possible to circle strafe a turret with, say, a fade and take minimal damage from it. I find it incredibly frustrating when I see a fade standing still next to a turret, pounding away at it. Don't.
2: (Here it comes again.) Humans can wipe out alien turrets easily because they HAVE to. Kharaa don't. Having said that, go for the turret factory, NOT the turrets, and keep moving so that you minimise damage. When the turret factory goes down, so do the turrets. You should be doing this right as a skulk, not just as a fade. A SINGLE skulk with carapace is enough to take your average turret factory down to yellow health in one attack.
3: As a skulk, if you're having trouble seeing what you're doing through those bloody huge jaws, don't hold down your attack key. Instead, press it when you've got a target (as if you're using a knife in other games.) It's much easier to see what you're doing.
4: All heavy armour means is that you have to work longer, and all HMGs mean is that you are allowed fewer mistakes. Don't be discouraged by your opponents being seemingly invincible, you ARE wounding them. It's quite normal for the guy with the most kills on your team to also have the most deaths, as well.
5: You can use enemy structures for cover. This means that sometimes you can crouch behind a turret factory and attack it, even though there are still turrets - the turrets are sometimes unable to hit you because there's the TF in the way.
....that's all I can think of for now. Oh, I really mean it about Perfect Dark <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
SoulSkorpion
Comments
haven't done solid circle strafing since pre-CS :S
i tend to try and close the distance as fast as possible, and thus die.. alot. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
will try these suggestions
Good points. Something to add. I can't seem to be able to bite someone when i'm literally on top of them. So don't drop from the ceiling on your target...wait till he passes then sneak up behind him. DON'T UNDERESTIMATE SILENCE!
I agree with Liquid Fusion on silence : it is incredibly effective. Sure adrenalin lets you attack longer but with silence they'll never know where it came from.
I'd like to add another point to Skorpion's post, ambush points. Ambush points are infinitely valuable and silence will only further enhance the value of these. You needn't stalk too much if you can hide (preferably above) a vital chokepoint. For some odd reason many Marines do not seem to learn from their mistakes and you'll obtain repeated snacks from a single Marine with a dim bulb. However, there are some undoubtedly proficient Marine players with prescience of mind and they <b>will</b> look up and intercept you. It is imperative that you be ready for this and not become complacent in waiting to strike from behind. The classic DFA (BattleTech!) maneuver is guaranteed to work most of the time. You needn't hide from above, you can find nifty hiding spots on ground level sometimes, such as behind boxes. Odd hiding spots are the best, due to the fact that people don't suspect that sort of maneuver. Sounds like a rehash but keep it in mind, instead of hiding on the ground in the corner, use your sticky footpads to hide above the normal swivel stack height.
Addressing the turret factory issue, a single skulk with full carapace should be able to take down a turret factory if the player is adept enough at playing with skulks. Using speed and obstacles to your advantage to block fire. Pity Skulks aren't used as much late-game.
what sensitivity do you all use (people who use circle strafe)
any tips for practing the strafe?
as for this <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->practise with PD will do more than practise with NS\TFC\FA\any other HL mod, but any practise is good practise) but I'll list a few points...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> First off it's spelled practice... It's not a hard word to spell and learning it will improve how people think of you from your spelling. second: How can you say practice is more important in PD than it is in these games??? I think these games are much more complicated and require a lot of practice.... as when PD can be picked up and the user will not have too much trouble. Any adult game with a keyboard and mouse combo is probably more complicated than any game with just a controller(not to say it's bad)
Good job though! I really suck at fighting off anything as a marine
I'll just check... 8.
[edit] While we're at it, I'm using a ball mouse too, and have done all my gaming life (eight years now). It's just a matter of practise <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->[/edit]
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> First off it's spelled practice <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Whoops...
[edit] /me gets out the dictionary
Ok, if we want to get technical, "practise" is the verb and "practice" is the noun. So you half got me <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> [/edit]
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How can you say practice is more important in PD than it is in these games??? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because depending on how you play it, PD actually forces you to learn how to dodge. You can see your enemies holding out their guns, and so learn to dodge them easier. (oh, just to clarify, I'm referring to PD singleplayer). Also the fact that it's singleplayer means that you always have opponents to train against - while NS or TFC might be a fight, wait, wait, wait, fight, wait wait (with respawning\finding targets\etc) PD is pretty much one constant battle. I used to play TFC as a spy; I played about a year and a half, then stopped to play tons and tons of PD, then came back again - it was like that bit at the end of The Matrix when Neo can see that the world's made up out of numbers. Everything was just so CLEAR. Melee combat was suddenly so easy. But my point is, I didn't pick up the skills from TFC, I picked them up from PD.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Any adult game with a keyboard and mouse combo is probably more complicated than any game with just a controller.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's not the point. When you are experienced enough at games in general you don't think about what you're doing - you just do it. You know how when you're brushing your teeth you don't think about what muscles you need to move to move the brush? Experienced gamers don't need to think about what buttons to press. Whether it's a keyboard or a controller makes little difference <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<b>:edit: Fixed a typo. There sure is a big difference between "there is no locational damage" and "there is now locational damage."</b>
Developing your controls to become "an extension of yourself' is very important to become skillful at these sorts of games. You want pin-point aim? You have to be so in-tune with your mouse's sensitivity that you don't even have to look at it any more to know EXACTLY where it is...
You have to know your keyboard layout so well that you can jump from any other bound key back to your movement keys in a flash. The ability to touch-type really helps that (I mean proper touch typing, not your own personalised version). I know I have a weakness in not being able to do this with the right hand side of my keyboard (I have to look to find the brackets and my backspace key). Once you can jump on your keyboard and start typing away without even having to look at the keyboard and line up your hands before you get started (you know the old trick, look at the keyboard, put your fingers on the home keys (asdf jkl;) and then look at the screen) you will be on your way to being <i>one</i> with your setup. As corny as it sounds, it's what is going to get you the kills.
Moral of the story: Learn to touch-type, and find as many quirky little reflex games on the internet as you can find. The more random the better, and constantly changing the reflex games you play better prepares you for the randomness of a skulk circle strafing your marine butt.
PS - I can touch type but I don't do the reflex games. It is reflected in my decidely average gaming ability.
/me wonders if I've taken the Kharaa too far.... <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Allah Akbar! *Splat!*
Yep. This is why they need to <b>remove scores from the game entirely</b>. They already do this for marines, why did they bother putting scores on the aliens?
I got accused of cheating only yesterday, because by the time they had armour (thus making Skulks largely redundant, damage wise) I had the same kill count as the entire marine team combined! <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <- This was me.
Anyway how will I actually get to a TF which is backed by a wall and surrounded with a bunch of turrets,I wasn't able to but one was able to get rid of the thing,and there were no blindspots(Up aginst a wall)
:/ I wanna get better so I can kick Freaq's arse to the next 10 NS versions.Besides Im just right now a tagger skulk.:/