B222 Alien Spawn Mod

RyneRyne Join Date: 2012-02-25 Member: 147408Members, NS2 Map Tester
<div class="IPBDescription">in the workshop</div>Flayra has posted a proposed alien spawn system that is currently planned for B222.

I have installed it on the All-In #2 server....anyone want to come help test it?

Also a small changelog would be nice...

Comments

  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    I'm guessing he didn't include a changelog intentionally, so that people will judge it from a blank slate of sorts.
  • bEEbbEEb Join Date: 2012-03-24 Member: 149317Members, NS2 Map Tester
    I can tell you right now that its got some issues............
  • HeatSurgeHeatSurge Some Guy Join Date: 2012-09-15 Member: 159438Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    edited October 2012
    What issues? What's it like? I may try it tonight - does it install automatically when joining All-In #2 or do I have to do it manually before loading the game?
  • RyneRyne Join Date: 2012-02-25 Member: 147408Members, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--quoteo(post=1987713:date=Oct 5 2012, 07:34 PM:name=HeatSurge)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (HeatSurge @ Oct 5 2012, 07:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1987713"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What issues? What's it like? I may try it tonight - does it install automatically when joining All-In #2 or do I have to do it manually before loading the game?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    all mods a server has running autodownload now.

    I recommend not subscribing to any mods other than crosshairs or alien vision. I.e. dont subscribe to maps, NS2c, etc.
  • HeatSurgeHeatSurge Some Guy Join Date: 2012-09-15 Member: 159438Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    I joined late tonight and it was already turned off. I asked someone about it, and he said aliens were spawning every 2 seconds. He played some game where they had 7 IPs?

    LOLwhut?

    That bad?
  • hakenspithakenspit Join Date: 2010-11-26 Member: 75300Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1987775:date=Oct 6 2012, 07:22 PM:name=HeatSurge)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (HeatSurge @ Oct 6 2012, 07:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1987775"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I joined late tonight and it was already turned off. I asked someone about it, and he said aliens were spawning every 2 seconds. He played some game where they had 7 IPs?

    LOLwhut?

    That bad?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    For aliens to be spawning every 2 seconds they would also have to be dieing at an equal rate (unless they also snuck babblers in....) and I am presuming 1 at a time (again otherwise there where issues)

    The fact marines had 7 ip's just shows that the marines can scale up to re-spawn as quickly as needed...aliens cant.

    Alien spawns broken now, you should not have to get shift hive to be able to spawn at a decent rate.

    Ryne, can you advise as to whether its still on or what issues you found?
  • DarkScytheDarkScythe Join Date: 2012-08-30 Member: 156876Members
    I played on the server for a few rounds last night, though I was not consciously looking for any changes.
    As a result, I don't really know what the change is, but anecdotally, it felt I was spawning a bit slower. I don't know why though, and I wasn't paying close enough attention to see if we were still wave spawning, lol.
  • _Necro__Necro_ Join Date: 2011-02-15 Member: 81895Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    I haven't tested the new spawn system, but I'm worried about the direction the Marine <-> Skulk gameplay heads.
    I liked the builds where a 1vs1 fight was fair. Now I have read that the direction this will take is the same NS1 was. With underpowered skulks, but faster respawn than marines to compensate. This shall create a feeling of an overwhelming swarm of weak aliens.

    This worries me. I think Flayra was it who said, that the faster respawn will compensate the alien player for the frustration of being underpowered against the marines. I don't think that will work out. Asymmetry is a good and important point of NS2. But at least the battles between the default classes / lifeforms should be equal and fair.

    TL;DR: I liked the builds where there was "skulk domination" (That means in reality skulks were equal to marines.)
  • fanaticfanatic This post has been edited. Join Date: 2003-07-23 Member: 18377Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
    No idea what this mod does, but both marine and alien spawn times need to be significantly longer, and the current wave spawn is a disaster (basically no penalty for dying unless you've been dying over and over for five minutes).
  • RyneRyne Join Date: 2012-02-25 Member: 147408Members, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--quoteo(post=1987775:date=Oct 6 2012, 12:22 AM:name=HeatSurge)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (HeatSurge @ Oct 6 2012, 12:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1987775"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I joined late tonight and it was already turned off. I asked someone about it, and he said aliens were spawning every 2 seconds. He played some game where they had 7 IPs?

    LOLwhut?

    That bad?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    Whoever talked to you was trolling; the mod is still in place and hasn't been removed (look at the server name, it mentions the mod)
  • XariusXarius Join Date: 2003-12-21 Member: 24630Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    If it means alien's can no longer get egg-locked easily early on in the game then I'm all for it.
  • HeatSurgeHeatSurge Some Guy Join Date: 2012-09-15 Member: 159438Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    If it was on I when I played, I noticed no difference whatsoever o_0 .
  • sad. Clownsad. Clown Join Date: 2012-02-25 Member: 147407Members
    I was playing last night as well, and I didn't notice a difference in alien spawn. What exactly are the B222 changes?
  • 1dominator11dominator1 Join Date: 2010-11-19 Member: 75011Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1987852:date=Oct 6 2012, 10:44 AM:name=Xarius)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Xarius @ Oct 6 2012, 10:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1987852"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If it means alien's can no longer get egg-locked easily early on in the game then I'm all for it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    If they spawn faster they will get egg locked much easier.
  • XariusXarius Join Date: 2003-12-21 Member: 24630Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    Not necessarily, depends on whether or not the egg-spawn rate is adjusted.
  • FlayraFlayra Game Director, Unknown Worlds Entertainment San Francisco Join Date: 2002-01-22 Member: 3Super Administrators, NS2 Developer, Subnautica Developer
    Hrm.

    I was having development problems on Friday, trying to get his mod to work. I didn't realize I had uploaded it at all. I don't know what's up here, but I have no idea if it even works. Looking into it!
  • RyneRyne Join Date: 2012-02-25 Member: 147408Members, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--quoteo(post=1988542:date=Oct 8 2012, 10:24 AM:name=Flayra)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Flayra @ Oct 8 2012, 10:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1988542"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hrm.

    I was having development problems on Friday, trying to get his mod to work. I didn't realize I had uploaded it at all. I don't know what's up here, but I have no idea if it even works. Looking into it!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    It runs and plays, not sure what all it does though!
  • DarkScytheDarkScythe Join Date: 2012-08-30 Member: 156876Members
    Perhaps it did run, but was broken to the point where it didn't actually change anything?

    I honestly can't say I felt any difference, and it seems many others didn't either.
  • bEEbbEEb Join Date: 2012-03-24 Member: 149317Members, NS2 Map Tester
    I thought it was working when it was first put on the server but it just turned out to be a well coordinated skulk rush. It felt like the spawns were shorter but it was probably just the placebo effect. Im starting to think that it doesnt even work. Has anyone looked at what the changes were in the files?
  • RyneRyne Join Date: 2012-02-25 Member: 147408Members, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--quoteo(post=1988544:date=Oct 8 2012, 10:28 AM:name=DarkScythe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DarkScythe @ Oct 8 2012, 10:28 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1988544"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Perhaps it did run, but was broken to the point where it didn't actually change anything?

    I honestly can't say I felt any difference, and it seems many others didn't either.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I didn't personally peak into the code, but was told some values were changed at the least. I'll do a comparison tonight and report back.
  • BensonBenson Join Date: 2012-03-07 Member: 148303Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    As far as I can tell, the biggest change is that 1 guy can keep a hive egg locked. The egg spawn rate is really low
  • schkorpioschkorpio I can mspaint Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16635Members
    why not just borrow the spawn system zerg use?

    alien comm, buys eggs at each hive, to maximum of 10 eggs at each hive. (they also slowly spawn automatically up to 10).


    this would subtley control where the majority of the alien team would spawn after a big encounter or ongoing battle.

    eggs would be very cheap - equivalent to the cost of an IP.
    so if IP = 20res, then 1 egg could be 1 res, if you are assuming an IP is good for 20 spawns.


    This way both teams can up their spawn rate as needed.
  • Cat-PokerCat-Poker Join Date: 2012-08-28 Member: 156670Members
    edited October 2012
    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->alien comm, buys eggs at each hive, to maximum of 10 eggs at each hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Do you really want a game mechanic where the khamm has to place eggs every ten spawns? That idea just seems repetitive and annoying.

    EDIT: Oh, and no, I have not tried the mod. Servers with mods installed lock my game up, a problem detailed in the technical support <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=121538" target="_blank">thread</a>.
  • schkorpioschkorpio I can mspaint Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16635Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1988639:date=Oct 9 2012, 12:46 PM:name=Cat-Poker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cat-Poker @ Oct 9 2012, 12:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1988639"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Do you really want a game mechanic where the khamm has to place eggs every ten spawns? That idea just seems repetitive and annoying.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Well its not quite every 10 spawns, since the eggs slowly regen on their own, and also once you have two hives its every 20 spawns, and 30 spawns with a 3rd hive etc
    So it wouldn't be as repetitive as you make out.

    And I dont think it annoys any zerg players in SC2 where you have even less larvae per hive :)
  • _Necro__Necro_ Join Date: 2011-02-15 Member: 81895Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Agreed. The kham should be able to drop additional eggs without being forced to go shift hive.
    The shift could instead of creating eggs, get a small-echo ability before it's mature. It would be able to (only) beam eggs everywhere at infestation and make this beamed eggs preferred to spawn from, by the aliens.
  • ArgathorArgathor Join Date: 2011-07-18 Member: 110942Members, Squad Five Blue
    There is a problem, which _Necro_ alludes to, which is not discussed enough. Aliens need more control over where they spawn (what happened to choosing the egg?), at the moment it is currently random but there are far too many options (eggs) meaning you would need far more aliens to get an even distribution of spawns.

    It is similar to marines having 100 IPs spread across the map, you would, too frequently, get marines spawning on one side of the map. This would not be such a bad thing for marines with phase gates, but Aliens do not have that luxury. Currently the strange distribution of alien spawns does impact gameplay, this should never be the case.
  • fanaticfanatic This post has been edited. Join Date: 2003-07-23 Member: 18377Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
    Agree with Arga that it should be easier to choose the hive location you spawn in, but I guess that is something that will have to wait until after 1.0. Spawning in the "wrong" hive wouldn't be such a big problem if the aliens weren't so horrendously slow, though. I did some tests on travel times a while ago; the alien movement advantage over marines in NS2 is less than half as large as it was in NS1. That obviously has significant implications on both balance and gameplay.
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