Gorge Nerf?
SlamHannigan
Join Date: 2012-07-06 Member: 153952Members
Join Date: 2012-07-06 Member: 153952Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Details within</div>Just got out of a game won completely with gorges. Now that's not to discredit the obvious advantage of well-played fades and agile skulks, we were clearly up against a very good alien team. What I mean is, gorges carried the entire victory, and they definitely need a nerf.
The HP and armor the gorge has is about where it ought to be, I feel, and carapace scales very well for them. Their movement speed and slide speed are fine, and I have exactly no issue with free clogs. What I do have an issue with is this: heal spray is far harder than it should be to out-damage, and hydras are far too durable for something the aliens can construct, deconstruct, and move around for free. They should either cost p-res, or get a significant HP nerf to make up for the fact that they can be placed indefinitely. Marines have no such luxury with static defense.
As far as the heal spray goes, as I said, I was in a match shooting a gorge point-blank with a level 3 shotgun. He continued to heal-spray himself and the hydras he had, to the degree that none could be killed. I ended up having to retreat (Yes, my shots were landing, no I'm not a baddie. Except for marine command, I'm kind of garbage at that.) I'm sorry, but if I'm a marine rocking level 3 weapons and armor, and I'm facing a gorge one-on-one, I should be able to thoroughly destroy him.
Gorges are meant to be support units, which not only means the team needs their support, but it also means they need the support of their team. As it stands now, gorges can run off and do their own thing and be virtually assured that they won't die. It needs to be changed.
The HP and armor the gorge has is about where it ought to be, I feel, and carapace scales very well for them. Their movement speed and slide speed are fine, and I have exactly no issue with free clogs. What I do have an issue with is this: heal spray is far harder than it should be to out-damage, and hydras are far too durable for something the aliens can construct, deconstruct, and move around for free. They should either cost p-res, or get a significant HP nerf to make up for the fact that they can be placed indefinitely. Marines have no such luxury with static defense.
As far as the heal spray goes, as I said, I was in a match shooting a gorge point-blank with a level 3 shotgun. He continued to heal-spray himself and the hydras he had, to the degree that none could be killed. I ended up having to retreat (Yes, my shots were landing, no I'm not a baddie. Except for marine command, I'm kind of garbage at that.) I'm sorry, but if I'm a marine rocking level 3 weapons and armor, and I'm facing a gorge one-on-one, I should be able to thoroughly destroy him.
Gorges are meant to be support units, which not only means the team needs their support, but it also means they need the support of their team. As it stands now, gorges can run off and do their own thing and be virtually assured that they won't die. It needs to be changed.
Comments
Gorge is already boring to play as it is and making them die easier is not a good solution.
Healspray is fine, being able to defend against 2-3 marines once you are setup is fine. Only problem is gorges tearing down and setting up hydras extremely aggressively.
All that said, I find gorges easy to kill. 1 clip, and if you were a bad shot follow up with the pistol. If they are setting up then charge the gorge, run past the hydras and finish him. Gorges having a cog wall is the only reason you can lose to it 1v1.
Gorges are meant to be support units, which not only means the team needs their support, but it also means they need the support of their team. As it stands now, gorges can run off and do their own thing and be virtually assured that they won't die. It needs to be changed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sounds like the good ol' hit reg problems?
Anyways, I think one marine (whatever weapons level) should not be able to own a good gorge with 3 hydras while healing. Because if he could, hydra bases would be useless. Right?
Gorge with 3 hydras vs marine lvl3 weapons
1vs1 = gorge wins
1vs2 = ?
1vs3 = gorge loses, needs team backup.
I'd handle the balance like that.
The only reason it wouldn't is due to the fault of the marine or the gigantic hydra hitbox atm.
Gorge is supposed to always need backup. That's the purpose of a support role lifeform.
The only reason it wouldn't is due to the fault of the marine or the gigantic hydra hitbox atm.
Gorge is supposed to always need backup. That's the purpose of a support role lifeform.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wat.
What is the point of the gorge then if it cannot secure against a single marine? Hope you aren't giving the devs these terrible ideas.
I agree with what another poster said:
1v1 - Gorge wins and holds the position
2v1 - Gorge can hold if skilled and bunkered up.
3v1 - Marines overwhelm position unless they are morons.
This is the current state of things, and how it should stay. Besides grenades, a lone marine should not win vs a fortified gorge.
What is the point of the gorge then if it cannot secure against a single marine? Hope you aren't giving the devs these terrible ideas.
I agree with what another poster said:
1v1 - Gorge wins and holds the position
2v1 - Gorge can hold if skilled and bunkered up.
3v1 - Marines overwhelm position unless they are morons.
This is the current state of things, and how it should stay. Besides grenades, a lone marine should not win vs a fortified gorge.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Depends on the position. I wouldn't want a gorge to be able to secure courtyard in docking with just hydras. In a small corridor sure, I feel a gorge should be able to defend itself.
^this
It REALLY says something if 3 hydras + a gorge are not designed to hold off a 0/0 marine. That should never be the case, since that would prove completely that hydras are worthless. WTF would hydras be able to do on their own... or ever?
And they had a reasonable and believable range on bilebomb, contrary to the NS2 version going farther than GL!
+1
oh my.. im still laughing
And they had a reasonable and believable range on bilebomb, contrary to the NS2 version going farther than GL!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I used to play celerity Gorge very much in NS1 and I think doing the dance of death around an alien RT with a marine was a form of art. I killed countless marines with spit and healing spray that way. So in my opinion, the spit damage at 40 is a tad too high and carapace grants too much armor early game. Just like it does almost with every lifeform. <i><insert comment about replacing cara with a passive armor boost somehow related to number of hives></i>
And I too think that bile bomb range should be reconsidered.
What is the point of the gorge then if it cannot secure against a single marine? Hope you aren't giving the devs these terrible ideas.
I agree with what another poster said:
1v1 - Gorge wins and holds the position
2v1 - Gorge can hold if skilled and bunkered up.
3v1 - Marines overwhelm position unless they are morons.
This is the current state of things, and how it should stay. Besides grenades, a lone marine should not win vs a fortified gorge.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah i'd have to agree with that, and I also think that it should stay like that too.
Yes but they are making it so the gorge needs to use pres for hydras again, which should be good news for you.
( in the early game )
but as soon as GL´s are out, gorges become kind of useless, you cant even support an onos, because only 1 Gl will own
you very fast.
If my gl didn't kill the gorge i'd be extremely concerned