Shadowstep bug?

Koruyo

Before this patch you could jump and shadowstep after, now you have to wait until the jump was at its highest peak to be able to shadows step.
Feels like this is broken, a hidden delay, or a very very bad way to fix that you get a tiny bit increased range by combining jump with shadowstep.

Ppl want to be able to jump and use such abilitys, and not be possibly killed for doing it because it suddenly didnt shadowstep(if you didnt know that you have to wait or spam shadowstep to make it work with jump since this build) - or at least took a important second longer to do

PsiWarp

There was a height dependent requirement added in B214 for Shadow Step, where it will not trigger if too high off the ground. To my knowledge, it has since been removed in B215 :)

Look out for more movement related changes for next build!

rantology

Not really a fan of it, just makes it feel flat out unresponsive and/or buggy (I mash my shift key to make sure it goes off because it's impossible to time the height thing properly).


:/

bLink`

atleast shadow-step is free.

xorex

<!--quoteo(post=1953160:date=Jul 22 2012, 05:09 PM:name=bLink`)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bLink` @ Jul 22 2012, 05:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953160"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->atleast shadow-step is free.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wish fades had to be skillful to be hard to kill. Mashing shift as hard as you can is apparently the way we're supposed to play fade now and on top of that you get adrenaline for your blink :| :| :|

bLink`

<!--quoteo(post=1953195:date=Jul 23 2012, 04:32 AM:name=xorex)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xorex @ Jul 23 2012, 04:32 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953195"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I wish fades had to be skillful to be hard to kill. Mashing shift as hard as you can is apparently the way we're supposed to play fade now and on top of that you get adrenaline for your blink :| :| :|<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

skillful fade + free shadow step + more armor & health = unstoppable

i like the fade before lol.

xorex

<!--quoteo(post=1953230:date=Jul 23 2012, 07:09 AM:name=bLink`)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bLink` @ Jul 23 2012, 07:09 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953230"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->skillful fade + free shadow step + more armor & health = unstoppable<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
dont forget feign death just incase you manage to put 100 rounds into it

countbasie

<!--quoteo(post=1953230:date=Jul 23 2012, 03:09 PM:name=bLink`)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bLink` @ Jul 23 2012, 03:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953230"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->skillful fade + free shadow step + more armor & health = unstoppable

i like the fade before lol.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
decent client performance + decent server performance + decent mouse sensitivity implementation = many dead fades.

{GGs} Chicken

<!--quoteo(post=1953247:date=Jul 23 2012, 09:55 AM:name=countbasie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (countbasie @ Jul 23 2012, 09:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953247"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->decent client performance + decent server performance + decent mouse sensitivity implementation = many dead fades.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

You're forgetting feign death, where fades that you would solo are now living forever

bLink`

<!--quoteo(post=1953247:date=Jul 23 2012, 11:55 AM:name=countbasie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (countbasie @ Jul 23 2012, 11:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953247"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->decent client performance + decent server performance + decent mouse sensitivity implementation = many dead fades.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

bad fades.

IronHorse

<!--quoteo(post=1953248:date=Jul 23 2012, 09:58 AM:name={GGs} Chicken)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE ({GGs} Chicken @ Jul 23 2012, 09:58 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953248"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You're forgetting feign death, where fades that you would solo are now living forever<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thats been fixed.

ellnic

Fade now reminds me of fade before the onos was here, Bloody hard to kill

GORGEous

3 reasons the new fade survivability is so high compared to previous builds:

1) The new shadow step is free with a very short cooldown (0.5s?). Unprecedented mobility.
2) Recent health buffs (200hp -> 300hp, 80armor -> 100 armor, effective hp gain of 39% against normal damage)
3) Carapace's increased benefit (included in #2) is supposed to be countered by its recent penalty. The speed penalty is completely irrelevant because of shadow step.

#3 is also a problem with the new skulks. A skulk with carapace now has 20 extra armor (31% effective hp gain versus normal) and leap completely nullifies the supposed tradeoff of the increased carapace armor. The result is that both fades and skulks with leap are far to powerful with the new carapace because the new carapace is balanced based upon a penalty which is nullified by shadow step and leap.

rantology

Shadow step used to have diminishing returns as well. :/ used to.

xDragon

The biggest problem IMO is shadowstep which requires absolutely no skill to just spam endlessly, and honestly requires a ridiculous amount of focus and aim to actually beat even with a jetpack shotgun. Then add feign death and you have arguably one of the most frustrating classes to fight I have played against in a while. I still am a big believer in blink for hive 1, and shadowstep as a hive 2 ability that costs energy to use. The fade should also be more visible while in blink, and blink should be a little faster. That and some HP changes to maybe say 250/50 base should help fix the class.

The fade's play style should promote effective use of its movement for evasion while closing the distance, and then for killing targets quickly. It should not promote spamming of movement around marines just being as difficult to hit as possible. Its a similar problem to the original wallhop that skulk had, with full aircontrol.

Typhon

Having been on the receiving end of some fades spamming shadow step last night, I gotta agree that something needs to change there. Short cooldown, no cost: bad stuff.

Locke504

I think the all-in server was testing some balance fixes. Not sure if this was a dev release or just a mod, but they worked out pretty well where the fade was concerned.

250/80 with carp.
SS costs energy
Energy recharge slowed.

Made it so fades can't go regen feign without having serious energy issues, resulted in making early fades pretty easy to kill as they don't always have energy to SS escape, or if they have adrenaline, making them pretty squishy for 2-3 rines to focus down.

I didn't like the changes to hive drop time and expansion for aliens though. Changes like that leave aliens holding their ######s waiting for a timer to go off before they can continue expanding, regardless of map control or income.

_Necro_

I'm not that type of guy, that demands to remove a feature that does not work. But ShadowStep was and is absolutely redundant with blink. It was only needed to give the fade an option to escape a flame thrower. I don't think this is necessary. The Fade is very difficult to balance. Either he is to powerful in skilled hands or he dies super fast and is frustrating to play. Having the options of either make it slightly op and give it a hard counter or make it weak but frustrating to play, I prefer the first. That results is the removal of shadow step and the flamethrower becoming the hard counter of the fade.

Jer9-Carver

I think removing shadowstep is going to add just as much balancing issues as when keeping it. Because if you remove shadowstep, the fade won't have any other abilities apart being a slow slashing machine with more health. This means that blink has been already there for him to make him useful and fun to play, which results that vortex is the only thing that can be researched. We'll get vortex earlier and fades can then disable bases faster and earlier in the game. I don't think we want that either. I do agree that there must be a some changes to the shadowstep to make it less powerful. Perhaps flamethrowers can disable or give a bigger cooldown to shadowstep if fades are on fire?

_Necro_

<!--quoteo(post=1953613:date=Jul 25 2012, 02:46 PM:name=Jer9-Carver)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jer9-Carver @ Jul 25 2012, 02:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1953613"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->... which results that vortex is the only thing that can be researched. We'll get vortex earlier and fades can then disable bases faster and earlier in the game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Nah, Vortex can stick to be a hive 3 upgrade. There are many other ideas out there for a hive 2 ability. Like Acid Rocket...

Typhon

What if focus became the hive 2 fade ability?