Shadowstep doesn't cost any energy

oldassgamers

Just a heads up, shadowstep can be spammed constantly in the game now because it doesn't cost energy.

And why did developers remove holding shift and then a direction (ex: shift + a, -''- w, -''- s, -''- d). Now you have to constantly click on shift and then a/w/s/d , when doing shadowstep.

Angelusz

Those two changes were made in synergy. I think this is much better as it gives the fade a way to escape, without energy. The only thing that does need some tweaking, is the shadowstep cooldown.

Raza.

I don't see your point, the second change (not being able to hold shift anymore) is not synergetic with the first.
It sounds* like a clear step backwards in usability.

*I couldn't test it yet.

AurOn2

Once again, cooldowns over energy usage? (or PLAYER CONTROLED cooldowns, as it sounds cooler this way)
once another backwards step. :/

Huze

It makes sense that it does not cost energy. It actually is useful even after blink is researched, and none of the other alien 'shift' movement abilities require energy. (onos charge, gorge belly slide, lerk roost, skulk stick-to-wall)

Keldorn

I prefer it being the way it is right now, I was slightly disappointed in the build where Shadowstep had gotten an energy cost. Right now it is distinct enough from Blink (fast insta movement, no energy cost but less control direction wise and can be combined with Blink). It gives a means of escaping flamethrowers. Shadowstep shouldn't be a weaker version of blink and I think it accomplishes this right now by being more distinct. Kudos to UWE !

GORGEous

I enjoyed this fade in the gathers that I played, though I fear he is a bit too tanky. (mostly due to poor hit reg)

IronHorse

Not being able to hold shift came from accidentally shadow stepping when unintended, as in from shadow stepping twice instead of once. Which may not have been desired, considering the second step isn't as effective for spamming reasons.
That change happened a while ago I thought..?

oldassgamers

<!--quoteo(post=1951555:date=Jul 14 2012, 07:06 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Jul 14 2012, 07:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951555"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Not being able to hold shift came from accidentally shadow stepping when unintended, as in from shadow stepping twice instead of once. Which may not have been desired, considering the second step isn't as effective for spamming reasons.
That change happened a while ago I thought..?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


So you're saying that you'll fix so you don't have to spam shift and then a/w/s/d for shadowstep? :) Great news :D

Hopefully this will be fixed in the next build ???

Right now its a littlebit frustrated when spamming shift button. :/ I counted for 30min of fading, about 899-1003 shift clicks. Lol :D


I love when holding shift and then choose a direction :D :D :D

elodea

<!--quoteo(post=1951610:date=Jul 15 2012, 12:23 PM:name=oldassgamers)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (oldassgamers @ Jul 15 2012, 12:23 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951610"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So you're saying that you'll fix so you don't have to spam shift and then a/w/s/d for shadowstep? :) Great news :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Exactly. I have to tab out to disable sticky keys every once in a while lol.

IronHorse

Actually, I meant that we changed it intentionally because hitting shift once for long enough meant you would shadow step again unintentionally. I.e. you held shift and forward for too long accidentally, because you naturally held it during the duration of the shadow step.

But I suppose a better compromise would be hitting the direction as the activating agent, instead. Will suggest to play test this, as there might be issues with such a design, as holding shift will still bring that annoying windows pop up, even sooner and easier than occasionally clicking it.

1dominator1

<!--quoteo(post=1951540:date=Jul 14 2012, 12:32 PM:name=AuroN2)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AuroN2 @ Jul 14 2012, 12:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951540"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Once again, cooldowns over energy usage? (or PLAYER CONTROLED cooldowns, as it sounds cooler this way)
once another backwards step. :/<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Id rather not have all my mobility be reliant on something which flamers and alien vision put a serious dent in. There is such a thing as being TOO punishing and loosing a 50 res lifeform in such a humiliating way (that makes you feel so helpless) because of a split second miscalculation (or just some bad luck) is weak.

oldassgamers

<!--quoteo(post=1951744:date=Jul 15 2012, 08:10 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Jul 15 2012, 08:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951744"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Actually, I meant that we changed it intentionally because hitting shift once for long enough meant you would shadow step again unintentionally. I.e. you held shift and forward for too long accidentally, because you naturally held it during the duration of the shadow step.

But I suppose a better compromise would be hitting the direction as the activating agent, instead. Will suggest to play test this, as there might be issues with such a design, as holding shift will still bring that annoying windows pop up, even sooner and easier than occasionally clicking it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

No no no no no no. There nothing annoying about that. I never had that problem. I strongly suggest you should ask the community what they belive is the smoothest experience.<b><!--sizeo:4--><span style="font-size:14pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo--> I dislikes hitting shift 435843985943574587358374578 times <!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec--></b>. You do realize that it's exstremly frustrating? :( :( my little finger hurts after few hours of gameplay as fade :( :( So to hold shift and the choose a direction with a/w/s/d is so much smoother. :)

If you decide to keep it like this, then it will be like the onos charge. A horrible clumsy ability :(

IronHorse

Its been like this for quite a while??
If it were such an issue I'm surprised you didn't notice it sooner?

Idk about hitting a key for a special movement being against a smooth experience... Spinning your minigun as a heavy in TF2 is the same method and it works out just fine. Holding the key not only creates alt tabbing windows pop ups, but also means that you wouldn't be able to wait to use shadowstep while walking...

in other words:
If holding shift was used, as you suggested, how would you implement when you walk and when you shadowstep? <b>You'd still have to remove your finger from shift to walk</b>, else you would shadowstep again when your shadowstep was not fully ready, and thus would get a weaker, shorter shadowstep that comes from spamming it... ?

Like i said, there might be a better method, but i dont see holding shift as fixing problems, it only adds to it. Unless you have an idea?
Also you can rebind the key just fyi.

GORGEous

<!--quoteo(post=1951776:date=Jul 15 2012, 05:15 PM:name=oldassgamers)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (oldassgamers @ Jul 15 2012, 05:15 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951776"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No no no no no no. There nothing annoying about that. I never had that problem. I strongly suggest you should ask the community what they belive is the smoothest experience.<b><!--sizeo:4--><span style="font-size:14pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo--> I dislikes hitting shift 435843985943574587358374578 times <!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec--></b>. You do realize that it's exstremly frustrating? :( :( my little finger hurts after few hours of gameplay as fade :( :( So to hold shift and the choose a direction with a/w/s/d is so much smoother. :)

If you decide to keep it like this, then it will be like the onos charge. A horrible clumsy ability :(<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


But you would never want to hold shift to use shadowstep.... It's not nearly as effective if you spam it compared to timing it which you have to press and release shift for anyway.

rantology

edit: jk, the change this patch was actually that shadowstep fails to activate while jumping, that was what was messing me up.


I'm very used to jump+ shadowstep (to keep momentum from the air as you continue hopping) but this patch shadowstep will not go off if you're jumping and so it feels very unresponsive (I've been spamming shift every time I want to shadowstep this patch to make sure it actually works :/ )


Was it intentional to nerf shadowstep "hopping"? Would much rather it cost energy (it should, really) and go back to being usable in the air than the current mechanics. It's a very big nerf to 1 hive fade and it just feels inconsistent currently.

IronHorse

ehh.. i think you're remembering incorrectly. Its not in the changelog, publicly or internally.. and i recall playing like this since stab was removed from shadowstep?? Maybe everybody is just now noticing because they are trying out the new fade mechanics?

Hmm.. idk?

Also, if you tried playing with shift holding you would have tons of accidental shadowsteps. Although that was with the 1st person effects, which almost encouraged you to hold it for the duration, incorrectly. And we have removed those effects. Once again: how would you implement it? holding shift annndddd??.. pressing forward would make you shadowstep everytime instead of walking, <b>while using a nerfed distance of shadowstep?</b>

I think we will be adding a visual indicator of a shadowstep cooldown meter or something, as i dont think players realize when they have a nerfed shadowstep or not..

rantology

there's 2 different shadowstep changes being discussed in this thread:

1. You can't hold down shift to spam it (but you should never spam SS because of the DR anyways)
2. there's some wonky half second cooldown before you can use it after jumping that makes it feel unresponsive

oldassgamers

I havent tested out all the fades features, thats why I notice everything now.

Shadowstep spamming is overpowered. 4v1 , no chanse with my spamming shadowstep. I never use blink now, because shadowstep is for the win :)

Maybe add 2 sec delay for each shadowstep?

IronHorse

<!--quoteo(post=1951844:date=Jul 15 2012, 06:23 PM:name=rantology)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rantology @ Jul 15 2012, 06:23 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951844"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->there's 2 different shadowstep changes being discussed in this thread:

1. You can't hold down shift to spam it (but you should never spam SS because of the DR anyways)
2. there's some wonky half second cooldown before you can use it after jumping that makes it feel unresponsive<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

1. has been there for a while, and i see no way around it as long as we dont want to prevent spamming of it by utilizing a nerfed version of shadowstep? open to ideas tho?
2. yea.. i agree about this being wonky. believe me its the lesser evil of the version we dealt with in some play tests hehe.. It used to be "no shadowstep while off the ground" to what it is now.. which is based on height i think.. meaning you can still do it, just not at the %15 top peak of your jump, or off high ledges.. i am not sure how i feel about this as its not communicated clearly to the player.

@oldassgammer: yea theres a cooldown for using the "full" shadowstep, otherwise its a nerfed, shorter version.. but yea i agree it needs to be increased.