Sentries
Runteh
Join Date: 2010-06-26 Member: 72163Members, Reinforced - Shadow
Join Date: 2010-06-26 Member: 72163Members, Reinforced - Shadow
<div class="IPBDescription">Design log thinking...</div>I really like the thinking that is going on in the design log regarding sentries. Pushing them towards being more tactical structures.
My issue however is that still they look to have issues.
The image in the screenshot suggests that you are pushing them more towards those in Aliens and I think it is an interesting concept.
Rather than blocking up rooms, instead they are used to block paths to play to strategy. Possibly a way of relocating for Marines or setting up well defended outposts. With games consisting of perhaps 5 max a level due to cost, and cost due to HP + firepower.
Personally I see this as the only way to balance them effectively.
Some argue that they should not be able to stop everything.
My issue with that (to a degree) is that then you require more (spam) or baby sitting.
I'd argue that if you had 5 very effective turrets, that you can't cover the whole map. That placement and use is more tactical, and that aliens have more room to negociate their way behind them. A greater loss once destroyed.
I love the RTS element, but spam certainly takes away the sophistication.
I worry that you mention dropping the power. If they are too weak people will demand more. Too cheap and people will demand less.
Strong & expensive always made sense to me.
I also like the emphasis on player vs player combat, issues with cysts & the like.
I think there are clever ways of doing this without reducing the rts/structure element.
Looking forward to the next patch.
My issue however is that still they look to have issues.
The image in the screenshot suggests that you are pushing them more towards those in Aliens and I think it is an interesting concept.
Rather than blocking up rooms, instead they are used to block paths to play to strategy. Possibly a way of relocating for Marines or setting up well defended outposts. With games consisting of perhaps 5 max a level due to cost, and cost due to HP + firepower.
Personally I see this as the only way to balance them effectively.
Some argue that they should not be able to stop everything.
My issue with that (to a degree) is that then you require more (spam) or baby sitting.
I'd argue that if you had 5 very effective turrets, that you can't cover the whole map. That placement and use is more tactical, and that aliens have more room to negociate their way behind them. A greater loss once destroyed.
I love the RTS element, but spam certainly takes away the sophistication.
I worry that you mention dropping the power. If they are too weak people will demand more. Too cheap and people will demand less.
Strong & expensive always made sense to me.
I also like the emphasis on player vs player combat, issues with cysts & the like.
I think there are clever ways of doing this without reducing the rts/structure element.
Looking forward to the next patch.
Comments
Hey, wait a minute, that's great
it would be difficult to have limits when they're tied to a dynamic feature that is the res nodes. Even with a soft cap, you could have a moment where you control a large amount of nodes for just 1 minute and within that time drop as many turrets until you reach the cap (granted you have the res). for simplicity's sake, a cap would be better off tied to base upgrades, evening if not directly related to sentries ie. first advance armory upgrade grants +2 turrets to the cap.
If that were to happen, it should simply prevent the marine commander from building more and/or replacing destroyed turrets until the number of turrets drops below the new cap. This is how its handled in many games.
I like the cap tied to res node since it encourages marines to have map control if they want more turrets. However more map control means more territory to protect with turrets. This will force marines to spread them and will prevent over spamming in one location.
If we simply tied it to base upgrades, the same thing we have now will happen just with an added step. Marines will upgrade their turret cap, and then spam them at the end of a one base stalemate.
1+
As OutlawDr mentioned, it would make the marine comm focusing on defending the res nodes too, and not just spam all of the turrets at the base.
As OutlawDr mentioned, it would make the marine comm focusing on defending the res nodes too, and not just spam all of the turrets at the base.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes. However I would add that it should be 'per node, per player/opponents'. Turrets are one of those things that needs to scale with team size...otherwise they are they less effective in larger games, and too effective in smaller games.'
So say...
Turret cap = (#Res Nodes x #Opponents)/2
So in a 6v6, its 3 turrets per res node.
8v8, 4 per res node
..and so on...though turrets need to be payed with a resource that scales up with the number of players, but that is a whole other thread.
I do like the idea of them overheating, though, and it seems like this could easily be managed by giving them Energy. Sentry guns in a powered part of the map regenerate energy over time. Firing sentry guns burn through energy fairly quickly. Commanders get a notification when a sentry gun hits 0 energy ("Sentry Overheating!") and as the regen rate is substantially lower than the consumption rate while firing, a sentry which is stuck in a prolonged engagement becomes less effective at doing it's job. Taking out the power to an area wouldn't immediately cripple the sentry guns there (although there could be a sort of "parasitic draw" which would mean sentries that were unpowered for a while would run out of energy), but it would make an assault on that area noticeably easier as the sentry guns would overheat that much more quickly.
This would essentially make them good at what I consider their job: cleaning up stray skulks and forcing the aliens to make a concerted effort to push into an area. At the same time, it'd make them less good at withstanding a concerted attack, and might speed up some of the late-game sieges where the marines have dug in and are now trying to turret farm their way out of spawn.