RFK idea.
Papayas
Join Date: 2010-07-01 Member: 72219Members
Join Date: 2010-07-01 Member: 72219Members
I was playing NS2 and the RFK system doesn't seem to be that good. I get 1-3 res and it is random. That shouldn't be the case.
<u>So my idea is:
</u>
Killing a Tier 1 unit gives you 1 res (Skulk, lerk, rifle marine etc)
Killing a Tier 2 unit gives you 2 res (Fade, GL, Flamer marine etc)
Killing a Tier 3 unti gives you 3 res (Onos, E.X.O. Jetpack(?), etc)
And it will be constant and not random anymore.
<u>So my idea is:
</u>
Killing a Tier 1 unit gives you 1 res (Skulk, lerk, rifle marine etc)
Killing a Tier 2 unit gives you 2 res (Fade, GL, Flamer marine etc)
Killing a Tier 3 unti gives you 3 res (Onos, E.X.O. Jetpack(?), etc)
And it will be constant and not random anymore.
Comments
I like it.
because as you tier up the things to buy will cost more but you will also get more res if the opposite team are doing as well as you.
3 res for tier 3 will be kind of useless unless you keep on dying and wasting your res. killing tier 3 would be used more to re-buy your items than to tier up.
Basically anything that cost more than 10 pres is "tier 2" and gives +2. Anything that cost more than 50 pres is "tier 3" and gives +3.
I would also add giving +0 pres for killing a newly spawned player. Basically spawning gives players a 15 sec rfk grace period buff. This would prevent farming newly spawned players that don't even have a chance to respond (not a huge problem....but you really shouldn't get points for that). More importantly, it also allows defending players to aggressively push attackers out of a base...without letting the other side farm points. Upgraded or buying anything immediately cancels the grace period. This would allow for comebacks, since attackers drain their pres conducting the assault, while defenders can keep banking it for a counter attack.
<u>So my idea is:
</u>
Killing a Tier 1 unit gives you 1 res (Skulk, lerk, rifle marine etc)
Killing a Tier 2 unit gives you 2 res (Fade, GL, Flamer marine etc)
Killing a Tier 3 unti gives you 3 res (Onos, E.X.O. Jetpack(?), etc)
And it will be constant and not random anymore.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This hardly scales properly with the buy cost of these units or the difficulty to kill one. Better off to use their assigned point value as some sort of multiplier (obviously with a ratio less than 1 since the weakest unit is 5 points). This doesn't take into account the weapon a Marine has on him, but then I don't think it should.
Also, no disrespect, but "the RFK system doesn't seem to be that good; it's random and that shouldn't be the case," seems like sort of a shallow argument and doesn't do much to convince anyone of that fact.
I believe you get points for building if you are the player that contributed the most. Building assists don't get points.
+1 pres for assisting to kill a Onos or Exo is an interesting idea. It would fit in with the comeback incentives defenders should get. Everyone gets points for killing one of these ultimate game finishers, but they don't get points for killing freshly spawned players. I like it.
Marines should receive +1 res for building new structures. Doesn't matter if they were the top contributor or assisted with only 1%. This is to reward defenders and commander 'helpers'. I think its perfectly fine if 7 marines at the start of the game stick around for 30secs to help build the IP, armory, plus one other building... and then all receiving +3 pres for the their trouble. The drawback is that they are not scouting and preventing alien expansions (and getting kills). It can't be abused, since its limited by Tres. It would be horribly inefficient for a commander to spend Tres on building for the purpose of just to giving his players some extra pres. It promotes marines to stick together and work together. Its a win-win.
The opposite should be true for aliens. Aliens receive +1 pres for helping to destroy a marine structure (maybe +2 for larger structures). Doesn't matter if they were the top damage dealer or assisted with only 1% damage. It promotes aliens to be more aggressive than marines, but also to stick together. On the flip side marines should receive pres anytime an ARC destroys an alien structure, and the marine is close by defending the arc. Marines escorting an ARC to an alien strong point and defending it is the ultimate in Marine teamwork, and it should be rewarded.
I just think RFK+ can be used as a carrot to encourage players to do things they should be doing, and it can be much more than just random res points for kills.
The slight extra RFK for higher tiers can be used if the endgame res demand is bigger and the devs want to speed things up or so though. It all depends on how they want to build the late game, I think.
The randomization depends on the rest of the game, I think. In optimal case the game itself allows enough variation in timings and such through build orders, stable RFK and all that and there's no need for randomization. However, if the game itself doesn't allow enough variation, slightly randomized RFK becomes an option to create some manageable variation. Whatever suits the plan, I guess.
Sure, giving +2 pres for killing SG, FT or GL wielding marine may not be percisely scaled... but current RFK doesn't take anything into account. A fade can get +3 for killing a marine as pops from an IP.
Im not sure how scaled RFK would further drive down a dying team. A dying team is probably not going to have many high tier units anyway compared to the winning team. Plus high tier units seem like they are geared for assaulting and ending sieges, and not necessarily for defending them. End result is that the dominating team will get less res per kill, compared to the dying team.
<!--quoteo(post=1852607:date=Jun 14 2011, 11:30 AM:name=Bacillus)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bacillus @ Jun 14 2011, 11:30 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852607"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The slight extra RFK for higher tiers can be used if the endgame res demand is bigger and the devs want to speed things up or so though. It all depends on how they want to build the late game, I think.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is true.
But it needs to be said that there is a difference between a boring drawn out stalemates, and long close games. Stalemates are already decided games, but the players are going through the same repetitive motions ..until the "losing" team finally dies...though usually never ending (currently that is marines at final base with turret spam, while aliens send wave after wave of fades). A long close game with comebacks, would be marines trapped at their base, and the aliens assault with fades and onos. If marines lose, they lose (no turret spam to keep the game alive). If the marines win, its a huge momentum shift, and marines push the aliens back. Quick games can still happen, but we shouldn't encourage quick blowouts.
If random RFK is needed to make the game varied, then then we have problems. It not going to appeal to the competitive players. Scaled RFK would also be casual friendly, since it mitigates complete steam rolls by hardcore players.
Nobody's gonna one shot any of those, thus having one person take all the credit makes little sense.
Yeah, that's a good point. In general I don't like the idea of preventing a team from falling down too much, but it can be useful sometimes. At least for me it goes to the fine tuning and how volatile and merciless you want the game to be.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If random RFK is needed to make the game varied, then then we have problems. It not going to appeal to the competitive players.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As a competetive player I don't particularly like the idea of randomization, but then again I'm somewhat willing to let things go in NS' case if that's necessary. NS economy isn't very complex in general, so a lot of the timings were very simple and rigid when you knew how to calculate. Randomizing the timings is never the nicest thing to do, but at least it added quite a bit of extra challenge to commanding and adaptation within a game.
It's great if they can keep the commanding challenging and rewarding without resorting to such trickery. However I think given the history of random RFK in NS1 and the necessity of finding challenges in strategy and commanding I don't see it as a completely horrific no-go as it would be in most other games. But as said: preferrably no randomization.
Also, no disrespect, but "the RFK system doesn't seem to be that good; it's random and that shouldn't be the case," seems like sort of a shallow argument and doesn't do much to convince anyone of that fact.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, I think the OP is a good first approximation, and maybe that's all that is necessary.