korvoJoin Date: 2009-11-19Member: 69427Members, Squad Five Blue
edited February 2011
I'm unable to upgrade! I start NS2 via steam - in releases before a window poped up and loaded the new release. This time nothing happens and Build 162 is starting up.
Edit: Oh... just a presentation without delivery...
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Where is this exploding Drifter idea coming from? Finally the Gorge has a nice addition to it's role on the battleground again, and all of a sudden we want Drifter to imitate that by exploding? Just have it grow from structures or Hives even...
<!--quoteo(post=1832909:date=Feb 17 2011, 07:30 PM:name=korvo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (korvo @ Feb 17 2011, 07:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832909"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm unable to upgrade! I start NS2 via steam - in releases before a window poped up and loaded the new release. This time nothing happens and Build 162 is starting up.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It isn't out yet. This is just a preview video, their will be a new post later with the full changelog.
163 is looking awesome! I can't wait to get in there later tonight and check it all out. I love how you guys used the "sound wave" animation when you first turn on this alien flashlight, too. You were really able to take the best of both worlds from those various styles. :)
I understand that this DI prototype is exactly that - a prototype. I'm happy to try this build, and who knows? Maybe I'll love the gameplay just as it is this way. That aside, I do have one suggestion for future DI mechanics.
I don't like the idea that the commander can just drop infestation patches. It seems kind of bland. I'd much rather have the DI grow on its own, with *maybe* seeing the commander direct where it goes. I do think aliens should be able to drop small remote patches of DI, but I think that should be left solely to the gorges.
But hey, for all I know, Gorges will have their hands full just repairing flamethrower damage, and the style you have in 163 might work best. :D
Ever since I first heard of DI, I always had it in my mind that it never actually had to be built and I'm still not sure why it does now. I always assumed just owning a hive naturally spreads out the DI slowly over time, and the more hives you own the faster it spreads and the more it spreads, so if you have three hives it will fill the entire map.
Also with the gorge able to drop and spit out DI, I'm not sure why this is a commander feature, can't it just spread naturally from the hive, and any tactical spots you want the DI, just have the gorges do it, encourages more team work that way as well.
How so? Either way DI is spreading, one way by a commander clicking and another by it happening naturally, not sure how or why this would be more of a resource hog considering it's doing the same exact thing without the clicking.
Walking whips are so cute!! <img src="http://forum.twinsmagazine.com/images/smilies/Love%20my%20twins-smiley-026.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<!--quoteo(post=1832923:date=Feb 17 2011, 07:58 PM:name=TheGivingTree)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TheGivingTree @ Feb 17 2011, 07:58 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832923"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->How so? Either way DI is spreading, one way by a commander clicking and another by it happening naturally, not sure how or why this would be more of a resource hog considering it's doing the same exact thing without the clicking.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> If it's done dynamically the server has to calculate where the DI is going to have to create a new patch next from each existing patch every tick, this way a player sends "create a patch at these coordinates" and it just expands the diameter every tick. Much cheaper and simpler.
Having DI waypoints seems ideal to me. You can sort of "draw" the route the DI takes (though not actually draw, it should preview the path the DI will take from the nearest patch to the location you're hovering over and the cost to grow that DI path).
I hate the idea of drifters exploding, removes the gorges' tactical DI vomit. It'd be cool is DI gave off a mist as well, that would be so spooky. Kinda like how the hive does, but better. :P
<!--coloro:white--><span style="color:white"><!--/coloro--><b>Random DI Mesh (Unanimous Client Calculation)</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> Also, to people wondering about how the DI mesh could be calculated, it's just my guess but a pre-set seed could be communicated between client and server (4-byte long should add enough variety and it's a tiny amount of data to send) and each DI "patch" could would have a unique ID (assigned and directed by server and received by client) the mesh randomization would be calculated by the seed + ID.
This would provide a light-weight random DI mesh calculation/communication that would be unanimous across all clients and the server. This enabled the ability to have collisions with the mesh too, if needed/wanted.
<!--quoteo(post=1832841:date=Feb 17 2011, 01:21 PM:name=Paul-Hewson)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Paul-Hewson @ Feb 17 2011, 01:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832841"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Honestly, i am not really impressed by DI. But i know you've worked hard on it and i don't ###### on your heads, that's just my feeling of the current implementation as seen in the video.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--quoteo(post=1832843:date=Feb 17 2011, 01:29 PM:name=weezl)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (weezl @ Feb 17 2011, 01:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832843"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i hope this is not the final DI <i>MECHANIC</i><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The video says PROTOTYPE. Charlies exact words in the video were "Now the visuals you see here are temporary". So, no, this is not the final DI by any means. When Max is able to take some time away from bug fixing and performance optimizations he will be doing a big pass on the DI to try to get it looking as good as that old test video, and maybe even better. Gameplay mechanics of it are going to be changing quite a bit, as well, based on testing and feedback. <!--quoteo(post=1832857:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:37 PM:name=Yotopia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yotopia @ Feb 17 2011, 02:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832857"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->great video and great ambient music in the background.was this choosen by simon ?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Unfortunately there wasn't time to have Simon involved in this patch video, which is why the sound mixing is not up to the same quality as videos that he works on. The track used was chosen by Charlie and its the latest track from David John, our music guy, and will be on the soundtrack, when its finished.
Love the format of the video, love the mention of the other team members work.
The implementation of the turret pointing is much much better.
Another bonus I noted. Both commander UIs are looking FAR more crisp and polished.
Feedback on the DI. I am not concerned with level of polish ... you UW guys are excellent at refining look and feel. One thing that concerns me is the dependence on DI for buildings. I am not throwing the idea out, it actually intrigues me but it raises some chewy questions.
1) A marine can walk in with a flamer and simply sever the DI between hive and resources. A dedicated commander would notice and replace this but repeating enough would cause the commander to run out of juice.
2) No forward bases. In a couple of areas there are long connecting hallways between techpoints. In really good games the alien commander built a small forward base in such a hallway using a crag and some whips so the aliens could attack then recede and heal. To build such a thing the DI would have to extend all the way from the last hive (sometimes the previous room is just resources).
Another thing that concerned me is the gorges involvement in DI was very limited. I hope his(/hers?) role grows more with either more abilities. I do like that the gorge seems to be vomiting both DI and hydras now, I find this very amusing.
IeptBarakatThe most difficult name to speak ingame.Join Date: 2009-07-10Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
edited February 2011
I think only the gorge be able to manually handle infestation.
If you could have the infestation from multiple hives slowly meet up and form a network automatically that would be awesome.
Maybe have the infestation use an ai path between hive locations. Having the infestation act defensively on it's own while the gorge can spread it to advance.
<!--quoteo(post=1832920:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:55 PM:name=TheGivingTree)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TheGivingTree @ Feb 17 2011, 02:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832920"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Ever since I first heard of DI, I always had it in my mind that it never actually had to be built and I'm still not sure why it does now. I always assumed just owning a hive naturally spreads out the DI slowly over time, and the more hives you own the faster it spreads and the more it spreads, so if you have three hives it will fill the entire map.
Also with the gorge able to drop and spit out DI, I'm not sure why this is a commander feature, can't it just spread naturally from the hive, and any tactical spots you want the DI, just have the gorges do it, encourages more team work that way as well.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree with this sentiment. Hopefully this is the way it will end up eventually.
As far as directing the growth, it really doesn't need to be any more complex than specifying a direction out of the hive for it to naturally spread in. (if at all) Either it spreads dynamically and automatically in all directions or you set an infestation direction on a hive (like a sentry) and let it find its own way.
gorge dropping infestation, with that red circle, I did not like this. I know its work in progress but I have some ideas you can improve this.
bile bomb comes into play, gorge can spit large infested ball anywhere he wants, this will trigger infestation to grow! but if he throws it on marine buildings, infestation would grow as well but since infestation harms marine buildings, they will start taking damage very quickly!!
bile bomb is big ball of infestation if you think about it, it harmed marine builds in ns1, and now having this ability trigger to grow infestation would be amazing. It also gives gorges ability to drop infestation without constantly trying to select an area to drop it. Bile bomb creates big splash when dropped, so that would help it spread it!
QuovatisTeam InversionJoin Date: 2010-01-26Member: 70321Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Obviously I haven't seen it in action with the real patch yet, but I always thought DI would slowly grow outwards by itself. Seems like a lot of micro-management from the commanders now. But we'll see how it plays out.
Perhaps the aliens need something similar to the marine portable power node--a structure that maintains DI that is cut off from hives. This would allow for fast offensive pushes to be viable long enough to properly connect the DI.
A thought about sounds. Forgive that I kinda TL;DR'd the thread since I'm in a bit of a hurry. I'd recommend very limited or no sound with DI growth/recession. Living things don't, as a rule, make noise as they grow. Sure, this is more fast paced, but it'd be kinda creepy to see this infestation silently crawling over a corridor :P I also really like the idea of the gorge assisting in networking. Kinda brings back some of its builder/support role.
QuovatisTeam InversionJoin Date: 2010-01-26Member: 70321Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
It seems that if aliens rush and take hives, then quickly link them back to the first hive, the marines pretty much lose, even if they take the expansion hives down. The marines can only destroy the DI with a flamethrower, which requires level 2 tech, but they can't build a second CC until they kill the DI with a flamethrower. So the aliens can completely shut down marine tech expansion with a few "sacrificial" hives. The marines need some other way to kill DI than the flamethrower that doesn't require level 2 tech. Instead of gorge rushes, we'll have DI rushes, making it impossible for marines to expand, and ultimately lose. Gorges could make little carpets of DI to each res node, completely shutting down the marine resources until flamethrowers are out.
I must admit the comm adding bits of DI wasnt what I thought would happen either.
I thought the DI would grow out of Hives automatically into areas not powered by powernodes, and would require the nodes to be destroyed before the DI could contine advancing, and area infested by DI would need have at least the area around the node socket cleared before the node could be repaired.
I also thought the Gorge DI additions was a small patch the Gorge spat out and the Comm could build on it away from the main DI body, as a manner to build a forwartd area ( possibly the Hydras couldnt be built unless on a Gorge DI or the main DI body ).
Having the Comm slap down areas of DI isnt ... dynamic really , its more closer to Dune 2's needing concrete slabs on the floor before you could place structures mechanic, a extra chore for the Comm. Thats just an opinion though and without actually playing the patch yet , a uneducated opinion :P
I disagree. Sound is 'extremely' important in games.
The problem is that sometimes you may have to cut corners, or things might not look how you want them to compared to 'real life'.
Sounds are something that give life and soul to games, because you can effectively and realistically mimic them. They are extremely descriptive in how they narrate a scene for which a person is viewing.
Once the final DI pass is done by Max I can't imagine not having some sort of sound effect for such a great feature, especially as it grows so quickly.
Also, in respect to an 'extra chore for the comm' statement. The Alien commander does not have to work half as hard as the Marine commander, so it will actually give them something to do now - as well as coordinating with their team, which will force them to talk over the comm to the Gorge.
<!--quoteo(post=1832936:date=Feb 17 2011, 08:42 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Feb 17 2011, 08:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832936"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=1832841:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:21 PM:name=Paul-Hewson)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Paul-Hewson @ Feb 17 2011, 02:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832841"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Honestly, i am not really impressed by DI. But i know you've worked hard on it and i don't ###### on your heads, that's just my feeling of the current implementation as seen in the video.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--quoteo(post=1832843:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM:name=weezl)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (weezl @ Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832843"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i hope this is not the final DI <i>MECHANIC</i><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The video says PROTOTYPE. Charlies exact words in the video were "Now the visuals you see here are temporary". So, no, this is not the final DI by any means. When Max is able to take some time away from bug fixing and performance optimizations he will be doing a big pass on the DI to try to get it looking as good as that old test video, and maybe even better. Gameplay mechanics of it are going to be changing quite a bit, as well, based on testing and feedback. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't appreciate a part of my post getting taken out of context and implied a very different meaning than it really has! I knew very well the visual effect is just a placeholder, that's why i emphasized MECHANIC, as opposed to EFFECT or VISUAL (nor did i mean GAMEPLAY MECHANIC)! It served to answer a question, fine, but please don't do this again.
here's my post in it's full: <!--quoteo(post=1832843:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM:name=weezl)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (weezl @ Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832843"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i hope this is not the final DI <i>MECHANIC</i> the DI seems to consist of individual "patches" that behave like buildings, place it, it grows to full size, has HP.
this is just fine for trying out gameplay mechanics, but in the future, will we see something continuous (non-discrete) like in the prototype video?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Day of the Whipids!!! I have been waiting for infestation to come back and it already looks pretty good! Whip walking looks fantastically eerie and i think should have an equally eerie sound to go with it, like burbling or whispering.
Comments
Edit: Oh... just a presentation without delivery...
It isn't out yet. This is just a preview video, their will be a new post later with the full changelog.
I understand that this DI prototype is exactly that - a prototype. I'm happy to try this build, and who knows? Maybe I'll love the gameplay just as it is this way. That aside, I do have one suggestion for future DI mechanics.
I don't like the idea that the commander can just drop infestation patches. It seems kind of bland. I'd much rather have the DI grow on its own, with *maybe* seeing the commander direct where it goes. I do think aliens should be able to drop small remote patches of DI, but I think that should be left solely to the gorges.
But hey, for all I know, Gorges will have their hands full just repairing flamethrower damage, and the style you have in 163 might work best. :D
Also with the gorge able to drop and spit out DI, I'm not sure why this is a commander feature, can't it just spread naturally from the hive, and any tactical spots you want the DI, just have the gorges do it, encourages more team work that way as well.
Also, DI should now stand for "diarrhea infestation" due to the squishing sound it emits when spreading :D .
If it's done dynamically the server has to calculate where the DI is going to have to create a new patch next from each existing patch every tick, this way a player sends "create a patch at these coordinates" and it just expands the diameter every tick. Much cheaper and simpler.
I hate the idea of drifters exploding, removes the gorges' tactical DI vomit. It'd be cool is DI gave off a mist as well, that would be so spooky. Kinda like how the hive does, but better. :P
<!--coloro:white--><span style="color:white"><!--/coloro--><b>Random DI Mesh (Unanimous Client Calculation)</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
Also, to people wondering about how the DI mesh could be calculated, it's just my guess but a pre-set seed could be communicated between client and server (4-byte long should add enough variety and it's a tiny amount of data to send) and each DI "patch" could would have a unique ID (assigned and directed by server and received by client) the mesh randomization would be calculated by the seed + ID.
This would provide a light-weight random DI mesh calculation/communication that would be unanimous across all clients and the server. This enabled the ability to have collisions with the mesh too, if needed/wanted.
<!--quoteo(post=1832843:date=Feb 17 2011, 01:29 PM:name=weezl)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (weezl @ Feb 17 2011, 01:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832843"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i hope this is not the final DI <i>MECHANIC</i><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The video says PROTOTYPE. Charlies exact words in the video were "Now the visuals you see here are temporary". So, no, this is not the final DI by any means. When Max is able to take some time away from bug fixing and performance optimizations he will be doing a big pass on the DI to try to get it looking as good as that old test video, and maybe even better. Gameplay mechanics of it are going to be changing quite a bit, as well, based on testing and feedback.
<!--quoteo(post=1832857:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:37 PM:name=Yotopia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yotopia @ Feb 17 2011, 02:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832857"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->great video and great ambient music in the background.was this choosen by simon ?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unfortunately there wasn't time to have Simon involved in this patch video, which is why the sound mixing is not up to the same quality as videos that he works on. The track used was chosen by Charlie and its the latest track from David John, our music guy, and will be on the soundtrack, when its finished.
--Cory
I am so excited.
Love the format of the video, love the mention of the other team members work.
The implementation of the turret pointing is much much better.
Another bonus I noted.
Both commander UIs are looking FAR more crisp and polished.
Feedback on the DI.
I am not concerned with level of polish ... you UW guys are excellent at refining look and feel.
One thing that concerns me is the dependence on DI for buildings.
I am not throwing the idea out, it actually intrigues me but it raises some chewy questions.
1) A marine can walk in with a flamer and simply sever the DI between hive and resources. A dedicated commander would notice and replace this but repeating enough would cause the commander to run out of juice.
2) No forward bases. In a couple of areas there are long connecting hallways between techpoints. In really good games the alien commander built a small forward base in such a hallway using a crag and some whips so the aliens could attack then recede and heal. To build such a thing the DI would have to extend all the way from the last hive (sometimes the previous room is just resources).
Another thing that concerned me is the gorges involvement in DI was very limited. I hope his(/hers?) role grows more with either more abilities. I do like that the gorge seems to be vomiting both DI and hydras now, I find this very amusing.
If you could have the infestation from multiple hives slowly meet up and form a network automatically that would be awesome.
Maybe have the infestation use an ai path between hive locations. Having the infestation act defensively on it's own while the gorge can spread it to advance.
Also with the gorge able to drop and spit out DI, I'm not sure why this is a commander feature, can't it just spread naturally from the hive, and any tactical spots you want the DI, just have the gorges do it, encourages more team work that way as well.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree with this sentiment. Hopefully this is the way it will end up eventually.
As far as directing the growth, it really doesn't need to be any more complex than specifying a direction out of the hive for it to naturally spread in. (if at all) Either it spreads dynamically and automatically in all directions or you set an infestation direction on a hive (like a sentry) and let it find its own way.
I do have some problems though.
gorge dropping infestation, with that red circle, I did not like this. I know its work in progress but I have some ideas you can improve this.
bile bomb comes into play, gorge can spit large infested ball anywhere he wants, this will trigger infestation to grow! but if he throws it on marine buildings, infestation would grow as well but since infestation harms marine buildings, they will start taking damage very quickly!!
bile bomb is big ball of infestation if you think about it, it harmed marine builds in ns1, and now having this ability trigger to grow infestation would be amazing. It also gives gorges ability to drop infestation without constantly trying to select an area to drop it. Bile bomb creates big splash when dropped, so that would help it spread it!
Perhaps the aliens need something similar to the marine portable power node--a structure that maintains DI that is cut off from hives. This would allow for fast offensive pushes to be viable long enough to properly connect the DI.
I thought the DI would grow out of Hives automatically into areas not powered by powernodes, and would require the nodes to be destroyed before the DI could contine advancing, and area infested by DI would need have at least the area around the node socket cleared before the node could be repaired.
I also thought the Gorge DI additions was a small patch the Gorge spat out and the Comm could build on it away from the main DI body, as a manner to build a forwartd area ( possibly the Hydras couldnt be built unless on a Gorge DI or the main DI body ).
Having the Comm slap down areas of DI isnt ... dynamic really , its more closer to Dune 2's needing concrete slabs on the floor before you could place structures mechanic, a extra chore for the Comm.
Thats just an opinion though and without actually playing the patch yet , a uneducated opinion :P
The problem is that sometimes you may have to cut corners, or things might not look how you want them to compared to 'real life'.
Sounds are something that give life and soul to games, because you can effectively and realistically mimic them. They are extremely descriptive in how they narrate a scene for which a person is viewing.
Once the final DI pass is done by Max I can't imagine not having some sort of sound effect for such a great feature, especially as it grows so quickly.
Also, in respect to an 'extra chore for the comm' statement. The Alien commander does not have to work half as hard as the Marine commander, so it will actually give them something to do now - as well as coordinating with their team, which will force them to talk over the comm to the Gorge.
Brilliant :)
<!--quoteo(post=1832843:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM:name=weezl)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (weezl @ Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832843"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i hope this is not the final DI <i>MECHANIC</i><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The video says PROTOTYPE. Charlies exact words in the video were "Now the visuals you see here are temporary". So, no, this is not the final DI by any means. When Max is able to take some time away from bug fixing and performance optimizations he will be doing a big pass on the DI to try to get it looking as good as that old test video, and maybe even better. Gameplay mechanics of it are going to be changing quite a bit, as well, based on testing and feedback.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't appreciate a part of my post getting taken out of context and implied a very different meaning than it really has!
I knew very well the visual effect is just a placeholder, that's why i emphasized MECHANIC, as opposed to EFFECT or VISUAL (nor did i mean GAMEPLAY MECHANIC)!
It served to answer a question, fine, but please don't do this again.
here's my post in it's full:
<!--quoteo(post=1832843:date=Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM:name=weezl)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (weezl @ Feb 17 2011, 02:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832843"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i hope this is not the final DI <i>MECHANIC</i>
the DI seems to consist of individual "patches" that behave like buildings, place it, it grows to full size, has HP.
this is just fine for trying out gameplay mechanics, but in the future, will we see something continuous (non-discrete) like in the prototype video?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Also, do Hydras need infestation to be placed? I only saw some around the Whip walking part, and they're on infestation.