<!--quoteo(post=1803880:date=Oct 30 2010, 08:21 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Oct 30 2010, 08:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1803880"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Overseeing external playtests, getting enough players together at the same time to test who are in many different time zones, and making sure the feedback is useful, vetting people to insure that they are trustworthy (we've had some issues with leaks), is a surprisingly complicated and time consuming process.
We understand the current process was not working out well, however, and have taken some significant steps to get a process in place that should work much better now.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good stuff. I suspect his new system is more about releasing often to us which gives you the biggest base to gather information and faster more reliable results (generally).
IronHorseDeveloper, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorJoin Date: 2010-05-08Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
<!--quoteo(post=1804374:date=Nov 3 2010, 03:19 PM:name=Price)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Price @ Nov 3 2010, 03:19 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804374"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->update out now? Steam update the game! And i already got 152 since this news!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1803838:date=Oct 30 2010, 04:01 AM:name=TychoCelchuuu)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TychoCelchuuu @ Oct 30 2010, 04:01 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1803838"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Current system: right click and release to aim, left click to blink, right click to cancel. It takes two clicks no matter what you do.
Suggested system: right click to aim, release to blink, left click to cancel. It takes one click to blink, two clicks to cancel.
So worst case scenario it's just as fast, during normal usage it is faster.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't like the suggested system because it involves having the right button depressed while your moving the mouse around to aim. This can be an uncomfortable arrangement for peoples hands because we usually deal with left-clicks-predominantly, right-clicks-sometimes, left-click-drags-sometimes, and right-click-drags-<u>never</u>. So while stressing your hand by holding that right mouse-button down, plus moving to aim, your asking that a left-click-muscle-impulse be the cancel-input? Really? Because i honestly don't think i would do any considerable blinking in this configuration. (btw, sometimes a person has so much trouble with these depressed-drag operations that they unintentionally let go of the mouse-button, or the game or mouse glitches, which turns into blinking in the wrong direction with the proposed approach). [the only way the proposed system could work is if we could map the depressed buttons to other buttons where this could be done comfortably, hundreds-to-thousands of times a game, as is common]
Just the same, i think the current system has the flaw that in certain circumstances the right click may not be registered correctly, i.e. in the heat of battle, and then you can be easily rendered a walker fade because your adrenaline-powered-right-clicking-frenzy has brought you to an unknown state. "Where's the on-screen indication?!, where's the ghost?! you'll be screaming into the mic until you realize that you're not in blink mode... which initiates another series of right-clicks xD.
My suggested system:
1. Left click = primary attack, which will also cancel any pending blink operation (also the "e"-interaction key, and probably some other key presses can cancel the blink). Maybe even have walking as a trigger to cancel a blink.
2. Right click+release (or if you want to nerf the fade then you can have Right click+hold-(for-charge-up-delay)+release) = power up the blinking-thrusters, (causes on-screen indication: the ghost, and possibly smoke emission from feet as the fades eye glow so brightly that you see two yellow circles on the wall in front of you >:D)
3. Now Aim with mouse (note: point (1) which means you can still kill someone if needed with conventional attacks, [unlike the current system where left-click -> blink only if your right click properly got registered to get you out of attack mode and into blinking mode])
4. Right click+release = launch the intruder.
Clean simple works, and none of the problems of either of the other approaches. Although i may have missed something because the first i'm hearing about how blinking works in ns2 is from the thread i'm quoting.
<!--quoteo(post=1804507:date=Nov 4 2010, 02:48 PM:name=FocusedWolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FocusedWolf @ Nov 4 2010, 02:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804507"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->stressing your hand by holding that right mouse-button down, plus moving to aim, your asking that a left-click-muscle-impulse be the cancel-input?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hold down right click for blink, left click for swipe was the best thing that ever happened to fade controls in NS1. I don't think it is too difficult to use 2 fingers at once.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->"I understand that there are some die-hard fans whom's toes I stepped onto but I call it like I see it. Releases like these just shouldn't happen. I am only waiting for the lag issues to end so I can do some decent testing. I'm a fan as well , and I don't mind waiting but I don't like how my confidence in Unknown World is smashed with releases like these."<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm a die-hard fan and my confidence in UWE is just fine. I consider the alpha release of NS2 an alpha marketing test. When they finally pull this off, and NS2 is in gamma release, then we can see if it was a good idea or not.
bumping, just wanted to say that i finally realized what that white horizontal stripe was for when a gorge pops out a hydra.
I always thought it was a graphics glitch, but no, it's not. It's actually the targeting range circle that comes up e.g. when you select a sentry gun as a commander.
I think there needs to be a better visual indication of this, some sort of 3-d sprite instead of a flat circle that doesn't always appear like it's supposed to.
<!--quoteo(post=1803880:date=Oct 30 2010, 08:21 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Oct 30 2010, 08:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1803880"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Overseeing external playtests, getting enough players together at the same time to test who are in many different time zones, and making sure the feedback is useful, vetting people to insure that they are trustworthy (we've had some issues with leaks), is a surprisingly complicated and time consuming process.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I realise there are a few factors to think about, but why can't your group of testers who are playing these internal patches in a LAN environment just play the same patch on a server hosted on the internet whilst still in your office/test room? Is it because of a slow broadband connection or something meaning the 4-6 (or however many are testing for you at LAN) can't go online and play at the same time?
Hahah, watching all the die hard nerds go crazy trying to defend this is ludicrous.
Nothing makes me chuckle more than to hear about a new release from the team, only to download it, log on and see absolutely empty servers across the board.
The fact anybody has any legitimate confidence in this development team anymore is quite sad to me. They're certainly capable of quality physical work, if directed or given a helping hand (like an engine), we've all seen this, but apparently nobody on the team has any idea how to actually run a development process or game release.
The development is scattered and piecemeal. Why does this build need a flamethrower when you've got zero players due to netcode and all manner of issues? Really? A flamethrower? Try getting the game in a playable, or at the very least, testable state before you move onto superfluous content.
This has been like, what, two, three months since the original paid alpha release?
Development. It's a pretty complex process, that's usually why professionals are the ones guiding it.
<!--quoteo(post=1804950:date=Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM:name=Obibun)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obibun @ Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804950"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hahah, watching all the die hard nerds go crazy trying to defend this is ludicrous.
Nothing makes me chuckle more than to hear about a new release from the team, only to download it, log on and see absolutely empty servers across the board.
The fact anybody has any legitimate confidence in this development team anymore is quite sad to me. They're certainly capable of quality physical work, if directed or given a helping hand (like an engine), we've all seen this, but apparently nobody on the team has any idea how to actually run a development process or game release.
The development is scattered and piecemeal. Why does this build need a flamethrower when you've got zero players due to netcode and all manner of issues? Really? A flamethrower? Try getting the game in a playable, or at the very least, testable state before you move onto superfluous content.
This has been like, what, two, three months since the original paid alpha release?
Development. It's a pretty complex process, that's usually why professionals are the ones guiding it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i like how there's rage on both sides... only the more obvious rage is taken into account.. the other rage is more subtle, but nonetheless rage and flame (last 3 posts for example).
<!--quoteo(post=1804978:date=Nov 9 2010, 01:01 AM:name=Baron_Bad_Egg)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Baron_Bad_Egg @ Nov 9 2010, 01:01 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804978"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i like how there's rage on both sides... only the more obvious rage is taken into account.. the other rage is more subtle, but nonetheless rage and flame (last 3 posts for example).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
actually i just posted because it felt wrong not to have troll scores go 3->2->1. i didn't even read the guy's post.
<!--quoteo(post=1804982:date=Nov 9 2010, 12:10 AM:name=Wheeee)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wheeee @ Nov 9 2010, 12:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804982"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->actually i just posted because it felt wrong not to have troll scores go 3->2->1. i didn't even read the guy's post.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1804983:date=Nov 9 2010, 01:12 AM:name=Baron_Bad_Egg)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Baron_Bad_Egg @ Nov 9 2010, 01:12 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804983"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->isn't that sorta the definition of being a troll?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
not really. i'm not sure what point you're trying to make anyway. somehow you're trying to paint all pro-UWE posters as...something negative, i guess. can you please clarify, besides stating an ill-defined dissatisfaction with UWE's release schedule and/or quality of product? If you have a problem with people drinking kool-aid, i suggest you chill out because there will always be people like that.
<!--quoteo(post=1804984:date=Nov 9 2010, 12:19 AM:name=Wheeee)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wheeee @ Nov 9 2010, 12:19 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804984"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...somehow you're trying to paint all <i>pro-UWE posters</i> as...something negative, i guess. can you please clarify, besides stating an ill-defined dissatisfaction with UWE's release schedule and/or quality of product? If you have a problem with people drinking kool-aid, i suggest you chill out because there will always be people like that.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
...? ne of that? try again plz? I said rage was on both sides. but if that means taking sides then i guess im guilty..? and the trolling thing is joining a topic, not knowing what "the guy" was talking about, and making a post (which was on the negative side for some other poster). and then continuing this. you posted here for no reason but to insult a person by calling them a troll, define urself as a troll, then act like one.
10/10 for having the dedication to post negatively in every thread on a consistent basis and having 'bad egg' in your username. This is how it's done people.
<!--quoteo(post=1804950:date=Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM:name=Obibun)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obibun @ Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804950"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The fact anybody has any legitimate confidence in this development team anymore is quite sad to me. They're certainly capable of quality physical work, if directed or given a helping hand (like an engine), we've all seen this, but apparently nobody on the team has any idea how to actually run a development process or game release.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't agree with this. The team has done a good job to get an engine, game play stuff and artwork well on the way to being alpha material.
<!--quoteo(post=1804950:date=Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM:name=Obibun)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obibun @ Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804950"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The development is scattered and piecemeal. Why does this build need a flamethrower when you've got zero players due to netcode and all manner of issues? Really? A flamethrower? Try getting the game in a playable, or at the very least, testable state before you move onto superfluous content.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I completely agree with this. The priorities at the start of alpha seamed so weird. The counter argument I've heard to rebut this is - "the game play art and engine development seam to be happening in different 'threads' so to speak". Although recently I've seen quicker patches given to the public (which is good because play testing on a LAN with <32 players is pointless. I've also seen very small advancements in hit detection and net code... but nothing that I feel is where it needs to be. Although if the latest twitter post is something to go off, perhaps 154 will be solid enough to finally play.
Nothing is more important then getting a free to download and run without steam dedicated server that can run 16x16 people on the same server without lag, disconnects and with spot on hit detection and a client that can run a decent frame rate when played on decent mid-level hardware.
Server hosts shouldn't need steam and the absolute most important thing right now is to be able to get a decent amount of players into a server, with net code and hit detection that works from a 54k dialup user to a 100 mbit fibre user working properly and on a decent FPS.
No point in all this great art and game play stuff being fixed if the engine stuff takes 6months+ to sort out is there? Oh except for the NS2HD guy who can keep us frothing at the mouth by making more videos with his brother on a LAN. (Awesome vid about power nodes btw, was rad... completely see the atmosphere we might have going on there - how very aliens - 'what do you mean they cut the power?')
why do *some ppl* not get that this is (probably) how game development usually works. BUT the difference here to all other games developed is that UWE shares the process outside of the studio.
work can go slow, work can go fast, but it's easy to sit on your FAT ASS, at home, infront of the computer, not doing anything and complain/troll!
i vote UWE all the way, keep up the good work guys, and balance it so you CAN keep it up all the way!
<!--quoteo(post=1805007:date=Nov 9 2010, 07:30 AM:name=Supernorn)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Supernorn @ Nov 9 2010, 07:30 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1805007"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->10/10 for having the dedication to post negatively in every thread on a consistent basis and having 'bad egg' in your username. This is how it's done people.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
10/10 for being negative and being exactly what i said in my last couple posts.
<!--quoteo(post=1805080:date=Nov 9 2010, 09:30 PM:name=scorpydude)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (scorpydude @ Nov 9 2010, 09:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1805080"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't agree with this. The team has done a good job to get an engine, game play stuff and artwork well on the way to being alpha material.
I completely agree with this. The priorities at the start of alpha seamed so weird. The counter argument I've heard to rebut this is - "the game play art and engine development seam to be happening in different 'threads' so to speak". Although recently I've seen quicker patches given to the public (which is good because play testing on a LAN with <32 players is pointless. I've also seen very small advancements in hit detection and net code... but nothing that I feel is where it needs to be. Although if the latest twitter post is something to go off, perhaps 154 will be solid enough to finally play.
Nothing is more important then getting a free to download and run without steam dedicated server that can run 16x16 people on the same server without lag, disconnects and with spot on hit detection and a client that can run a decent frame rate when played on decent mid-level hardware.
Server hosts shouldn't need steam and the absolute most important thing right now is to be able to get a decent amount of players into a server, with net code and hit detection that works from a 54k dialup user to a 100 mbit fibre user working properly and on a decent FPS.
No point in all this great art and game play stuff being fixed if the engine stuff takes 6months+ to sort out is there? Oh except for the NS2HD guy who can keep us frothing at the mouth by making more videos with his brother on a LAN. (Awesome vid about power nodes btw, was rad... completely see the atmosphere we might have going on there - how very aliens - 'what do you mean they cut the power?')<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
you don't expect a plumber to perform maintenance on your car. why would you expect non-engine-coders in the NS team to code the engine?
It's funny how anytime something negative is posted, it's a troll.
I was a member of these forums long before 98% of people here had ever even heard of the game. It's on the left people, take a look. Member number 490-something.
If anything, I should by rights be the most hardcore fan here. But I don't have my head up my ass about how miserable this development process is going. When you build a house, you lay a solid foundation before you install windows and doorknobs. This isn't a foundation, it might as well be Jenga.
I don't buy all of this "finding and organizing testers is such hard work" garbage either. Really? A game with such a tight-knit community following as NS2, and you can't find a few dozen dedicated people to test internally? Give me a break. Excuses, excuses, excuses.
Please feel sorry for us, everyone. We're trying our best. Sorry we took your money and gave you something that's been unplayable for the better part of three months. Sorry! Development is hard! Sympathize with us, please.
I'm excited, but I have to admit it was also expected at one point sooner or later. I don't have any doubts with the team. I'm curious to how big these framerate advances are. Everytime they release new things to make the game look better I'm dying for documentation on the LUA and new editor stuff.
I have a question for anyone in the know, is there currently some type of lighting that hasn't been implemented yet?
obi don't worry. u'll soon be attacked by flame. and u'll be to blame. seems to happen on these forums. as long as you have a fanboy hard-on and insult people personally (without swearing) you're ok.... but if u make a general statement of dissatisfaction u will be attacked personally (which is fine... on the attacker's end).
<!--quoteo(post=1805098:date=Nov 10 2010, 12:31 AM:name=Obibun)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obibun @ Nov 10 2010, 12:31 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1805098"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's funny how anytime something negative is posted, it's a troll.
I was a member of these forums long before 98% of people here had ever even heard of the game. It's on the left people, take a look. Member number 490-something.
If anything, I should by rights be the most hardcore fan here. But I don't have my head up my ass about how miserable this development process is going. When you build a house, you lay a solid foundation before you install windows and doorknobs. This isn't a foundation, it might as well be Jenga.
I don't buy all of this "finding and organizing testers is such hard work" garbage either. Really? A game with such a tight-knit community following as NS2, and you can't find a few dozen dedicated people to test internally? Give me a break. Excuses, excuses, excuses.
Please feel sorry for us, everyone. We're trying our best. Sorry we took your money and gave you something that's been unplayable for the better part of three months. Sorry! Development is hard! Sympathize with us, please.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
sucks to be you. i've been playing since alpha hit. actually patch 153 was pretty fun; you could almost have decent games, especially on rockdown. actually seeing the improvements that have gone in from release to current build gives me a lot of hope. sure, the wait for 152 was long and seemed interminable. i feel bad for the people who got into this thinking that alpha was going to be like NS 1.0, a playable game that just needed to be balanced, but it's their own fault for having unreasonable expectations. what, did you expect UWE to pop a fully-functional, cutting edge, lightning fast and optimized game engine from their foreheads akin to Zeus birthing Athena?
There is a small (yet loud) percentage of users who seem to do nothing but complain (unfairly in my opinion). I am not sure what people were expecting pre-ordering to get access to the alpha. It's what it is. And honestly, I don't think it's fairing too badly.
Sure we would all like things to be going faster. But anyone who knows even the basics of software/game development would be mentally prepared for let-downs, delays and constant issues and bugs. Also the dev team being split into coders and content isn't a bad thing.
I really wish UWE would give the people complaining their money back. Or the difference back for the Standard Edition so they can just come back when its BETA.
On another note. I worry about people being scared off from posting and getting involved due to all the commotion.
<!--quoteo(post=1805098:date=Nov 10 2010, 12:31 AM:name=Obibun)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obibun @ Nov 10 2010, 12:31 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1805098"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's funny how anytime something negative is posted, it's a troll.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're being called a troll because your misinformed opinions. For example, you criticize the development team for working on gameplay content rather than making the game playable, yet it has been stated numerous times throughout these forums (and is just plain common sense) that the development team consists of different people working on different aspects of the game, such that the work on gameplay features has no impact on the work on engine coding.
Your lack of insight on the development process is Earth-shatteringly ignorant. Thus, rather than assume you are an idiot, the forum is giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you are just trolling by intentionally posting grossly misinformed opinions.
Comments
We understand the current process was not working out well, however, and have taken some significant steps to get a process in place that should work much better now.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good stuff. I suspect his new system is more about releasing often to us which gives you the biggest base to gather information and faster more reliable results (generally).
Steam update the game!
And i already got 152 since this news!
Steam update the game!
And i already got 152 since this news!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
exactly... ??..
no one else?
Suggested system: right click to aim, release to blink, left click to cancel. It takes one click to blink, two clicks to cancel.
So worst case scenario it's just as fast, during normal usage it is faster.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't like the suggested system because it involves having the right button depressed while your moving the mouse around to aim. This can be an uncomfortable arrangement for peoples hands because we usually deal with left-clicks-predominantly, right-clicks-sometimes, left-click-drags-sometimes, and right-click-drags-<u>never</u>. So while stressing your hand by holding that right mouse-button down, plus moving to aim, your asking that a left-click-muscle-impulse be the cancel-input? Really? Because i honestly don't think i would do any considerable blinking in this configuration. (btw, sometimes a person has so much trouble with these depressed-drag operations that they unintentionally let go of the mouse-button, or the game or mouse glitches, which turns into blinking in the wrong direction with the proposed approach). [the only way the proposed system could work is if we could map the depressed buttons to other buttons where this could be done comfortably, hundreds-to-thousands of times a game, as is common]
Just the same, i think the current system has the flaw that in certain circumstances the right click may not be registered correctly, i.e. in the heat of battle, and then you can be easily rendered a walker fade because your adrenaline-powered-right-clicking-frenzy has brought you to an unknown state. "Where's the on-screen indication?!, where's the ghost?! you'll be screaming into the mic until you realize that you're not in blink mode... which initiates another series of right-clicks xD.
My suggested system:
1. Left click = primary attack, which will also cancel any pending blink operation (also the "e"-interaction key, and probably some other key presses can cancel the blink). Maybe even have walking as a trigger to cancel a blink.
2. Right click+release (or if you want to nerf the fade then you can have Right click+hold-(for-charge-up-delay)+release) = power up the blinking-thrusters, (causes on-screen indication: the ghost, and possibly smoke emission from feet as the fades eye glow so brightly that you see two yellow circles on the wall in front of you >:D)
3. Now Aim with mouse (note: point (1) which means you can still kill someone if needed with conventional attacks, [unlike the current system where left-click -> blink only if your right click properly got registered to get you out of attack mode and into blinking mode])
4. Right click+release = launch the intruder.
Clean simple works, and none of the problems of either of the other approaches. Although i may have missed something because the first i'm hearing about how blinking works in ns2 is from the thread i'm quoting.
Hold down right click for blink, left click for swipe was the best thing that ever happened to fade controls in NS1. I don't think it is too difficult to use 2 fingers at once.
I'm a die-hard fan and my confidence in UWE is just fine. I consider the alpha release of NS2 an alpha marketing test. When they finally pull this off, and NS2 is in gamma release, then we can see if it was a good idea or not.
I always thought it was a graphics glitch, but no, it's not. It's actually the targeting range circle that comes up e.g. when you select a sentry gun as a commander.
I think there needs to be a better visual indication of this, some sort of 3-d sprite instead of a flat circle that doesn't always appear like it's supposed to.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I realise there are a few factors to think about, but why can't your group of testers who are playing these internal patches in a LAN environment just play the same patch on a server hosted on the internet whilst still in your office/test room? Is it because of a slow broadband connection or something meaning the 4-6 (or however many are testing for you at LAN) can't go online and play at the same time?
Nothing makes me chuckle more than to hear about a new release from the team, only to download it, log on and see absolutely empty servers across the board.
The fact anybody has any legitimate confidence in this development team anymore is quite sad to me. They're certainly capable of quality physical work, if directed or given a helping hand (like an engine), we've all seen this, but apparently nobody on the team has any idea how to actually run a development process or game release.
The development is scattered and piecemeal. Why does this build need a flamethrower when you've got zero players due to netcode and all manner of issues? Really? A flamethrower? Try getting the game in a playable, or at the very least, testable state before you move onto superfluous content.
This has been like, what, two, three months since the original paid alpha release?
Development. It's a pretty complex process, that's usually why professionals are the ones guiding it.
Nothing makes me chuckle more than to hear about a new release from the team, only to download it, log on and see absolutely empty servers across the board.
The fact anybody has any legitimate confidence in this development team anymore is quite sad to me. They're certainly capable of quality physical work, if directed or given a helping hand (like an engine), we've all seen this, but apparently nobody on the team has any idea how to actually run a development process or game release.
The development is scattered and piecemeal. Why does this build need a flamethrower when you've got zero players due to netcode and all manner of issues? Really? A flamethrower? Try getting the game in a playable, or at the very least, testable state before you move onto superfluous content.
This has been like, what, two, three months since the original paid alpha release?
Development. It's a pretty complex process, that's usually why professionals are the ones guiding it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<a href="http://kimag.es/" target="_blank"><img src="http://s2.kimag.es/share/893706.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
actually i just posted because it felt wrong not to have troll scores go 3->2->1. i didn't even read the guy's post.
isn't that sorta the definition of being a troll?
not really. i'm not sure what point you're trying to make anyway. somehow you're trying to paint all pro-UWE posters as...something negative, i guess. can you please clarify, besides stating an ill-defined dissatisfaction with UWE's release schedule and/or quality of product? If you have a problem with people drinking kool-aid, i suggest you chill out because there will always be people like that.
...? ne of that? try again plz? I said rage was on both sides. but if that means taking sides then i guess im guilty..? and the trolling thing is joining a topic, not knowing what "the guy" was talking about, and making a post (which was on the negative side for some other poster). and then continuing this. you posted here for no reason but to insult a person by calling them a troll, define urself as a troll, then act like one.
I don't agree with this. The team has done a good job to get an engine, game play stuff and artwork well on the way to being alpha material.
<!--quoteo(post=1804950:date=Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM:name=Obibun)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obibun @ Nov 8 2010, 09:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1804950"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The development is scattered and piecemeal. Why does this build need a flamethrower when you've got zero players due to netcode and all manner of issues? Really? A flamethrower? Try getting the game in a playable, or at the very least, testable state before you move onto superfluous content.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I completely agree with this. The priorities at the start of alpha seamed so weird. The counter argument I've heard to rebut this is - "the game play art and engine development seam to be happening in different 'threads' so to speak". Although recently I've seen quicker patches given to the public (which is good because play testing on a LAN with <32 players is pointless. I've also seen very small advancements in hit detection and net code... but nothing that I feel is where it needs to be. Although if the latest twitter post is something to go off, perhaps 154 will be solid enough to finally play.
Nothing is more important then getting a free to download and run without steam dedicated server that can run 16x16 people on the same server without lag, disconnects and with spot on hit detection and a client that can run a decent frame rate when played on decent mid-level hardware.
Server hosts shouldn't need steam and the absolute most important thing right now is to be able to get a decent amount of players into a server, with net code and hit detection that works from a 54k dialup user to a 100 mbit fibre user working properly and on a decent FPS.
No point in all this great art and game play stuff being fixed if the engine stuff takes 6months+ to sort out is there? Oh except for the NS2HD guy who can keep us frothing at the mouth by making more videos with his brother on a LAN. (Awesome vid about power nodes btw, was rad... completely see the atmosphere we might have going on there - how very aliens - 'what do you mean they cut the power?')
BUT
the difference here to all other games developed is that UWE shares the process outside of the studio.
work can go slow, work can go fast, but it's easy to sit on your FAT ASS, at home, infront of the computer, not doing anything and complain/troll!
i vote UWE all the way, keep up the good work guys, and balance it so you CAN keep it up all the way!
10/10 for being negative and being exactly what i said in my last couple posts.
I completely agree with this. The priorities at the start of alpha seamed so weird. The counter argument I've heard to rebut this is - "the game play art and engine development seam to be happening in different 'threads' so to speak". Although recently I've seen quicker patches given to the public (which is good because play testing on a LAN with <32 players is pointless. I've also seen very small advancements in hit detection and net code... but nothing that I feel is where it needs to be. Although if the latest twitter post is something to go off, perhaps 154 will be solid enough to finally play.
Nothing is more important then getting a free to download and run without steam dedicated server that can run 16x16 people on the same server without lag, disconnects and with spot on hit detection and a client that can run a decent frame rate when played on decent mid-level hardware.
Server hosts shouldn't need steam and the absolute most important thing right now is to be able to get a decent amount of players into a server, with net code and hit detection that works from a 54k dialup user to a 100 mbit fibre user working properly and on a decent FPS.
No point in all this great art and game play stuff being fixed if the engine stuff takes 6months+ to sort out is there? Oh except for the NS2HD guy who can keep us frothing at the mouth by making more videos with his brother on a LAN. (Awesome vid about power nodes btw, was rad... completely see the atmosphere we might have going on there - how very aliens - 'what do you mean they cut the power?')<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
you don't expect a plumber to perform maintenance on your car. why would you expect non-engine-coders in the NS team to code the engine?
I was a member of these forums long before 98% of people here had ever even heard of the game. It's on the left people, take a look. Member number 490-something.
If anything, I should by rights be the most hardcore fan here. But I don't have my head up my ass about how miserable this development process is going. When you build a house, you lay a solid foundation before you install windows and doorknobs. This isn't a foundation, it might as well be Jenga.
I don't buy all of this "finding and organizing testers is such hard work" garbage either. Really? A game with such a tight-knit community following as NS2, and you can't find a few dozen dedicated people to test internally? Give me a break. Excuses, excuses, excuses.
Please feel sorry for us, everyone. We're trying our best. Sorry we took your money and gave you something that's been unplayable for the better part of three months. Sorry! Development is hard! Sympathize with us, please.
I have a question for anyone in the know, is there currently some type of lighting that hasn't been implemented yet?
I was a member of these forums long before 98% of people here had ever even heard of the game. It's on the left people, take a look. Member number 490-something.
If anything, I should by rights be the most hardcore fan here. But I don't have my head up my ass about how miserable this development process is going. When you build a house, you lay a solid foundation before you install windows and doorknobs. This isn't a foundation, it might as well be Jenga.
I don't buy all of this "finding and organizing testers is such hard work" garbage either. Really? A game with such a tight-knit community following as NS2, and you can't find a few dozen dedicated people to test internally? Give me a break. Excuses, excuses, excuses.
Please feel sorry for us, everyone. We're trying our best. Sorry we took your money and gave you something that's been unplayable for the better part of three months. Sorry! Development is hard! Sympathize with us, please.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
sucks to be you. i've been playing since alpha hit. actually patch 153 was pretty fun; you could almost have decent games, especially on rockdown. actually seeing the improvements that have gone in from release to current build gives me a lot of hope. sure, the wait for 152 was long and seemed interminable. i feel bad for the people who got into this thinking that alpha was going to be like NS 1.0, a playable game that just needed to be balanced, but it's their own fault for having unreasonable expectations. what, did you expect UWE to pop a fully-functional, cutting edge, lightning fast and optimized game engine from their foreheads akin to Zeus birthing Athena?
OMG, I nearly wet myself on that one......bahahahahahahahha!!
Sure we would all like things to be going faster. But anyone who knows even the basics of software/game development would be mentally prepared for let-downs, delays and constant issues and bugs. Also the dev team being split into coders and content isn't a bad thing.
I really wish UWE would give the people complaining their money back. Or the difference back for the Standard Edition so they can just come back when its BETA.
On another note. I worry about people being scared off from posting and getting involved due to all the commotion.
You're being called a troll because your misinformed opinions. For example, you criticize the development team for working on gameplay content rather than making the game playable, yet it has been stated numerous times throughout these forums (and is just plain common sense) that the development team consists of different people working on different aspects of the game, such that the work on gameplay features has no impact on the work on engine coding.
Your lack of insight on the development process is Earth-shatteringly ignorant. Thus, rather than assume you are an idiot, the forum is giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you are just trolling by intentionally posting grossly misinformed opinions.