remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1799290:date=Sep 21 2010, 04:42 AM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Sep 21 2010, 04:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799290"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Tried running a .jar version and an exe version, both do the same thing.
It either crashes the display driver, or crashes the display driver which then causes the entire computer to crash.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> You need a new graphics card. Also you could try just updating your drivers.
Assuming this game is the only one that causes these catastrophic crashes, it's sort of hard to make the case for an entire new graphics card. Driver update might be an idea though.
Minecraft is fun, but gameplay is currently nothing to be exited about. Still it looks extremely promising. :)
On a side not: I am the only one who feels that games which promote creation rather than destruction tend to be more easily forgiven for not having the latest graphics or for that matter a totally obscure art style?
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited September 2010
<!--quoteo(post=1799332:date=Sep 21 2010, 07:22 PM:name=Faskalia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Faskalia @ Sep 21 2010, 07:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799332"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Minecraft is fun, but gameplay is currently nothing to be exited about. Still it looks extremely promising. :)
On a side not: I am the only one who feels that games which promote creation rather than destruction tend to be more easily forgiven for not having the latest graphics or for that matter a totally obscure art style?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think it has more to do with the crowd that plays these games. Dwarf Fortress anyone?
<!--quoteo(post=1799336:date=Sep 21 2010, 09:10 PM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Xyth @ Sep 21 2010, 09:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799336"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you have important things to do (homework, studying, work, using the bathroom) do not play this game. The hours just... disappear.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> So, so true. "I'll just do this and this an then go do stuff *ooh another cave*" -timetravel-
<img src="http://i.imgur.com/9IvEM.png" border="0" class="linked-image" /> I suddenly had good use for lava!
<!--quoteo(post=1799321:date=Sep 21 2010, 07:36 PM:name=Psyke)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Psyke @ Sep 21 2010, 07:36 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799321"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You need a new graphics card. Also you could try just updating your drivers.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The graphics card is new and the drivers are up to date, and it's only minecraft. The computer is delightfully stable running any other game of minecraft's complexity. It's just minecraft.
<!--quoteo(post=1799332:date=Sep 21 2010, 08:22 PM:name=Faskalia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Faskalia @ Sep 21 2010, 08:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799332"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Minecraft is fun, but gameplay is currently nothing to be exited about. Still it looks extremely promising. :)
On a side not: I am the only one who feels that games which promote creation rather than destruction tend to be more easily forgiven for not having the latest graphics or for that matter a totally obscure art style?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
'Latest' does not neccesarily mean good, a game with good art direction and a nice style will look far better than a game with poor direction and style but a lot of shaders, games like zelda LTTP and castlevania on the old consoles still look awesome.
ugh I was digging my way out of a long mining expedition, I had a diamond pickax and found a couple more diamonds and a ton of iron... killed a whole lot of monsters on the way, harvested 4 buckets of lava to use in my mansion... and I died in a cave-in. Couldn't it have been a more dramatic death at least? to die to some freaking gravel falling on my head...
I wish I could find my corpse and get all my crap back.
ThansalThe New ScumJoin Date: 2002-08-22Member: 1215Members, Constellation
<!--quoteo(post=1799377:date=Sep 21 2010, 07:47 PM:name=Nossah)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nossah @ Sep 21 2010, 07:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799377"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->never dig straight up or down, that's the first thing i learned while playing this my first day :P<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Speaking of that: What DOES happen if I fall out the bottom of the world? I haven't actually tested it yet.
DiscoZombie is right, you will hit an unbreakable rock they call adminium. Though people have been known to find holes in the adminium that lead into the void, which is pretty much the same as the void in some other games. If you've ever fallen through the world in WoW or even NS for that matter it's pretty much the same. A whole lot of nothingness that kills you if you fall far enough.
<!--quoteo(post=1799397:date=Sep 22 2010, 12:06 AM:name=DiscoZombie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DiscoZombie @ Sep 22 2010, 12:06 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799397"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Notch is rich.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Minor correction for you. Last I heard paypal froze his account with $750,000 in it. Total profit surely has entered 7 digits... For a java based digging game. Maybe engineering wasn't the best field after all...
I updated my mansion post on Page 2. My new basement library and art gallery <img src="http://koti.mbnet.fi/retales/minecraft/mansion16.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> <img src="http://koti.mbnet.fi/retales/minecraft/mansion17.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> Also from a new angle. Visible here is the outdoors staircase leading to the art basement :T <img src="http://koti.mbnet.fi/retales/minecraft/mansion18.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
ThansalThe New ScumJoin Date: 2002-08-22Member: 1215Members, Constellation
edited September 2010
<!--quoteo(post=1799395:date=Sep 21 2010, 11:22 PM:name=Nossah)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nossah @ Sep 21 2010, 11:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799395"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->DiscoZombie is right, you will hit an unbreakable rock they call adminium. Though people have been known to find holes in the adminium that lead into the void, which is pretty much the same as the void in some other games. If you've ever fallen through the world in WoW or even NS for that matter it's pretty much the same. A whole lot of nothingness that kills you if you fall far enough.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This.
I always find a hole or 2 in my adminium layer, and then just block it off with some dirt so I don't jump through it. I assumed I would die, but I wasn't 100% sure if it wouldn't just let me fall forever or not :P
It should be explained that the way I generally play is to make a little cavern home, then make a stair straight down to the bottom of the level, looking for random things to play with.
The game is weird to me. I don't like sandbox games. I'm not much of a builder. Etc etc. Games like this I would normally see the draw, but not be overly interested in it my self. However, this time around something has completely hooked me on it. I spend most of my time exploring, either going through random caverns available from the surface, or by hunting for underground areas where I can hear mobs/water/lava. If I get bored with that I spend some time building on my little cave.
It also has the same draw as DF. When things go wrong, they go wrong in awesome ways: <center><object width="450" height="356"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/LnjSWPxJxNs"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/LnjSWPxJxNs" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="356"></embed></object></center>
I'm the same. I think it's either that you can be up top building & shaping the landscape, or you can be down below for the thrill of skeletons shooting at you when you don't expect it and the satisfaction of claiming the caves as your own by putting torches everywhere, banishing the darkness.
also god damn retales how much spare time do you have to find that much clay
I like this game. I think the main problem is that there isn't enough endgame. After a couple of hours in a world once I've crafted everything I'm like, "now what?" There need to be more epic projects or goals to keep you going. Like, I had an idea for making a gigantic gunpowder farm to make adminium-plunging sets of TNT adjacent to full-depth mining shafts and then digging over to collect everything, then repeating that, but for what? I already have everything. A bigger house, a BIGGER castle, with more blocks, or more diamonds and gold, that's all I can do.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=1799483:date=Sep 22 2010, 07:15 PM:name=juice)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (juice @ Sep 22 2010, 07:15 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799483"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I like this game. I think the main problem is that there isn't enough endgame. After a couple of hours in a world once I've crafted everything I'm like, "now what?" There need to be more epic projects or goals to keep you going. Like, I had an idea for making a gigantic gunpowder farm to make adminium-plunging sets of TNT adjacent to full-depth mining shafts and then digging over to collect everything, then repeating that, but for what? I already have everything. A bigger house, a BIGGER castle, with more blocks, or more diamonds and gold, that's all I can do.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Keep in mind that this game is not actualy a game yet, even if it does look and feel like a completed game. It is in alpha and will continue to get more and more stuff... Here's hoping for npc villages and maybe hostile or friendly dorfs that will also excavate. Giving a nice competitions for resources...
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
edited September 2010
<!--quoteo(post=1799397:date=Sep 21 2010, 08:06 PM:name=DiscoZombie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DiscoZombie @ Sep 21 2010, 08:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799397"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Free weekend over I think :(<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> This is true, but you can still play Offline.
<!--quoteo(post=1799399:date=Sep 21 2010, 09:24 PM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Xyth @ Sep 21 2010, 09:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799399"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Minor correction for you. Last I heard paypal froze his account with $750,000 in it. Total profit surely has entered 7 digits... For a java based digging game. Maybe engineering wasn't the best field after all...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Minor correction for you. Over the year and a half of development of this game, he has made about 3 million dollars (assuming a consistent price point of $15) Source- <a href="http://minecraft.net/stats.jsp" target="_blank">http://minecraft.net/stats.jsp</a>
<!--quoteo(post=1799491:date=Sep 22 2010, 11:48 AM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Sep 22 2010, 11:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799491"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Keep in mind that this game is not actualy a game yet, even if it does look and feel like a completed game. It is in alpha and will continue to get more and more stuff... Here's hoping for npc villages and maybe hostile or friendly dorfs that will also excavate. Giving a nice competitions for resources...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm just waiting for Notch to finish fixing up multiplayer so that you have all the risks and thrills in there as you do in SP. An MMO version of this would be awesome. Keep in mind, Minecraft classic was created in a week. He has only been developing this game for a year and a half since then.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Is Java a good choice though? It can't do much in terms of higher res/polygon and such without seriously choking on it... not that the game needs that, but if there are going to be big bad dragons and stuff, they might need more polygons and resolution...
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1799520:date=Sep 22 2010, 04:42 PM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Sep 22 2010, 04:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799520"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Is Java a good choice though? It can't do much in terms of higher res/polygon and such without seriously choking on it... not that the game needs that, but if there are going to be big bad dragons and stuff, they might need more polygons and resolution...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> No, Java isn't a very good choice. The reason this game is so blocky is because trying to simulate a fully dynamic environment requires a ton of horsepower. Simplifying it into blocks decreases that load a lot. The problem is, as Notch tries to add in more complex terrain behaviors like cave-ins and more realistic fluid simulations (a la Dwarf Fortress), or more complex baddies with actual pathing... he's going to start hitting walls.
Even without any graphics, the guy developing Dwarf Fortress has had to deal with some serious challenges to make his simulation run in real-time.
On the other hand, if he's going multi player with this, a more thin-client approach which is built in Java might actually be a lot better because he will be able to easily hit a wider set of systems... But if he ever wants to go towards the MMO approach he will really need to start considering how to reduce the CPU load and probably start going for a more distributed architecture so that it can scale bigger.
This was originally built as just a week-long prototype... I think he's made a lot of decisions which were not optimal in terms of extendability... but it let him get stuff up quick and make a ton of money, and now he has the money to actually hire some people and port it to a different language if need be.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
edited September 2010
<!--quoteo(post=1799523:date=Sep 22 2010, 04:57 PM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Align @ Sep 22 2010, 04:57 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799523"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't think you can port an entire game like this to a different programming language...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Sure you can. Why wouldn't you be able to?
It's not a small undertaking, but a lot of stuff can be reused (not exactly line by line, but conceptually)... Overall system architecture (C++ and Java are both Object-Oriented), algorithms (regardless of language, you can always implement the same algorithms), data structures (how they store the world, and inventory, etc)...
The advantage of porting to C++ is not only that it would probably go faster in general, but also in doing so they would have a chance to reevaluate the architecture and potentially redesign portions that used to be hard to maintain/manage because of bad initial assumptions, feature creep, or hacks.
<!--quoteo(post=1799522:date=Sep 22 2010, 08:52 PM:name=Psyke)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Psyke @ Sep 22 2010, 08:52 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799522"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Even without any graphics, the guy developing Dwarf Fortress has had to deal with some serious challenges to make his simulation run in real-time.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The main challenge being his inability to program efficiently, from what I hear.
Porting minecraft to a more powerful language would definitely be a good choice, especially now that he has a grasp on the caveats of the game logic that might not have been initially obvious.
Also I wonder what DF guy thinks of all this. Both games have very similar appeal, except one guy decided to charge $10 for a copy and has now made millions while the other survives off donations.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1799550:date=Sep 22 2010, 10:11 PM:name=juice)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (juice @ Sep 22 2010, 10:11 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799550"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Nothing against DF, but minecraft blows it out of the water in terms of accessibility.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Exactly.
The big difference is that Notch made a conscious decision, "I want to monetize this."
To Tarn, Dwarf Fortress is his epic fantasy world simulator. He's not building it for people to play, he's building it for himself. It just turns out that what he wanted to build happens to have a niche audience, and that niche audience is giving him enough donations that he was able to quit his job as a math professor and develop DF full time.
Notch and Tarn, though they have some similar mechanics in their games, have totally different mindsets on who their audience is and what they are building for. And it is this difference in mindset that left the scene wide open for something like Minecraft to come along.
<!--quoteo(post=1799524:date=Sep 23 2010, 02:11 AM:name=Psyke)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Psyke @ Sep 23 2010, 02:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799524"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Sure you can. Why wouldn't you be able to?
It's not a small undertaking, but a lot of stuff can be reused (not exactly line by line, but conceptually)... Overall system architecture (C++ and Java are both Object-Oriented), algorithms (regardless of language, you can always implement the same algorithms), data structures (how they store the world, and inventory, etc)...
The advantage of porting to C++ is not only that it would probably go faster in general, but also in doing so they would have a chance to reevaluate the architecture and potentially redesign portions that used to be hard to maintain/manage because of bad initial assumptions, feature creep, or hacks.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Right, but it's more rewriting it from scratch using the old as a guideline than an actual port. It'd take ages, too, and the minecraft community doesn't seem to be too happy with notchs "whops i forgot to update" antics as it is...
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Update this weekend broke the game, that's why it was free. But now he has broken something again, a lot of people have sound issue (not playing while they are installed)
Disconnecting the game from the internet and then playing in offline mode does fix this issue...
Comments
It either crashes the display driver, or crashes the display driver which then causes the entire computer to crash.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You need a new graphics card. Also you could try just updating your drivers.
Still it looks extremely promising. :)
On a side not: I am the only one who feels that games which promote creation rather than destruction tend to be more easily forgiven for not having the latest graphics or for that matter a totally obscure art style?
Still it looks extremely promising. :)
On a side not: I am the only one who feels that games which promote creation rather than destruction tend to be more easily forgiven for not having the latest graphics or for that matter a totally obscure art style?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think it has more to do with the crowd that plays these games. Dwarf Fortress anyone?
<!--quoteo(post=1799336:date=Sep 21 2010, 09:10 PM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Xyth @ Sep 21 2010, 09:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799336"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you have important things to do (homework, studying, work, using the bathroom) do not play this game. The hours just... disappear.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, so true.
"I'll just do this and this an then go do stuff *ooh another cave*" -timetravel-
<img src="http://i.imgur.com/9IvEM.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
I suddenly had good use for lava!
The graphics card is new and the drivers are up to date, and it's only minecraft. The computer is delightfully stable running any other game of minecraft's complexity. It's just minecraft.
<!--quoteo(post=1799332:date=Sep 21 2010, 08:22 PM:name=Faskalia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Faskalia @ Sep 21 2010, 08:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799332"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Minecraft is fun, but gameplay is currently nothing to be exited about.
Still it looks extremely promising. :)
On a side not: I am the only one who feels that games which promote creation rather than destruction tend to be more easily forgiven for not having the latest graphics or for that matter a totally obscure art style?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
'Latest' does not neccesarily mean good, a game with good art direction and a nice style will look far better than a game with poor direction and style but a lot of shaders, games like zelda LTTP and castlevania on the old consoles still look awesome.
I wish I could find my corpse and get all my crap back.
Speaking of that:
What DOES happen if I fall out the bottom of the world? I haven't actually tested it yet.
Anyone else having trouble signing in? I'm guessing the login server is as stressed as the website.
Minor correction for you.
Last I heard paypal froze his account with $750,000 in it. Total profit surely has entered 7 digits... For a java based digging game. Maybe engineering wasn't the best field after all...
<img src="http://koti.mbnet.fi/retales/minecraft/mansion16.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://koti.mbnet.fi/retales/minecraft/mansion17.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Also from a new angle. Visible here is the outdoors staircase leading to the art basement :T
<img src="http://koti.mbnet.fi/retales/minecraft/mansion18.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
This.
I always find a hole or 2 in my adminium layer, and then just block it off with some dirt so I don't jump through it. I assumed I would die, but I wasn't 100% sure if it wouldn't just let me fall forever or not :P
It should be explained that the way I generally play is to make a little cavern home, then make a stair straight down to the bottom of the level, looking for random things to play with.
The game is weird to me. I don't like sandbox games. I'm not much of a builder. Etc etc. Games like this I would normally see the draw, but not be overly interested in it my self. However, this time around something has completely hooked me on it. I spend most of my time exploring, either going through random caverns available from the surface, or by hunting for underground areas where I can hear mobs/water/lava. If I get bored with that I spend some time building on my little cave.
It also has the same draw as DF. When things go wrong, they go wrong in awesome ways:
<center><object width="450" height="356"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/LnjSWPxJxNs"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/LnjSWPxJxNs" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="356"></embed></object></center>
also god damn retales how much spare time do you have to find that much clay
Keep in mind that this game is not actualy a game yet, even if it does look and feel like a completed game. It is in alpha and will continue to get more and more stuff... Here's hoping for npc villages and maybe hostile or friendly dorfs that will also excavate. Giving a nice competitions for resources...
This is true, but you can still play Offline.
<!--quoteo(post=1799399:date=Sep 21 2010, 09:24 PM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Xyth @ Sep 21 2010, 09:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799399"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Minor correction for you.
Last I heard paypal froze his account with $750,000 in it. Total profit surely has entered 7 digits... For a java based digging game. Maybe engineering wasn't the best field after all...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Minor correction for you.
Over the year and a half of development of this game, he has made about 3 million dollars (assuming a consistent price point of $15)
Source- <a href="http://minecraft.net/stats.jsp" target="_blank">http://minecraft.net/stats.jsp</a>
<!--quoteo(post=1799491:date=Sep 22 2010, 11:48 AM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Sep 22 2010, 11:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1799491"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Keep in mind that this game is not actualy a game yet, even if it does look and feel like a completed game. It is in alpha and will continue to get more and more stuff... Here's hoping for npc villages and maybe hostile or friendly dorfs that will also excavate. Giving a nice competitions for resources...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm just waiting for Notch to finish fixing up multiplayer so that you have all the risks and thrills in there as you do in SP. An MMO version of this would be awesome.
Keep in mind, Minecraft classic was created in a week. He has only been developing this game for a year and a half since then.
No, Java isn't a very good choice. The reason this game is so blocky is because trying to simulate a fully dynamic environment requires a ton of horsepower. Simplifying it into blocks decreases that load a lot. The problem is, as Notch tries to add in more complex terrain behaviors like cave-ins and more realistic fluid simulations (a la Dwarf Fortress), or more complex baddies with actual pathing... he's going to start hitting walls.
Even without any graphics, the guy developing Dwarf Fortress has had to deal with some serious challenges to make his simulation run in real-time.
On the other hand, if he's going multi player with this, a more thin-client approach which is built in Java might actually be a lot better because he will be able to easily hit a wider set of systems... But if he ever wants to go towards the MMO approach he will really need to start considering how to reduce the CPU load and probably start going for a more distributed architecture so that it can scale bigger.
This was originally built as just a week-long prototype... I think he's made a lot of decisions which were not optimal in terms of extendability... but it let him get stuff up quick and make a ton of money, and now he has the money to actually hire some people and port it to a different language if need be.
Yup. Those are my thoughts.
Sure you can. Why wouldn't you be able to?
It's not a small undertaking, but a lot of stuff can be reused (not exactly line by line, but conceptually)... Overall system architecture (C++ and Java are both Object-Oriented), algorithms (regardless of language, you can always implement the same algorithms), data structures (how they store the world, and inventory, etc)...
The advantage of porting to C++ is not only that it would probably go faster in general, but also in doing so they would have a chance to reevaluate the architecture and potentially redesign portions that used to be hard to maintain/manage because of bad initial assumptions, feature creep, or hacks.
The main challenge being his inability to program efficiently, from what I hear.
Porting minecraft to a more powerful language would definitely be a good choice, especially now that he has a grasp on the caveats of the game logic that might not have been initially obvious.
Also I wonder what DF guy thinks of all this. Both games have very similar appeal, except one guy decided to charge $10 for a copy and has now made millions while the other survives off donations.
Exactly.
The big difference is that Notch made a conscious decision, "I want to monetize this."
To Tarn, Dwarf Fortress is his epic fantasy world simulator. He's not building it for people to play, he's building it for himself. It just turns out that what he wanted to build happens to have a niche audience, and that niche audience is giving him enough donations that he was able to quit his job as a math professor and develop DF full time.
Notch and Tarn, though they have some similar mechanics in their games, have totally different mindsets on who their audience is and what they are building for. And it is this difference in mindset that left the scene wide open for something like Minecraft to come along.
It's not a small undertaking, but a lot of stuff can be reused (not exactly line by line, but conceptually)... Overall system architecture (C++ and Java are both Object-Oriented), algorithms (regardless of language, you can always implement the same algorithms), data structures (how they store the world, and inventory, etc)...
The advantage of porting to C++ is not only that it would probably go faster in general, but also in doing so they would have a chance to reevaluate the architecture and potentially redesign portions that used to be hard to maintain/manage because of bad initial assumptions, feature creep, or hacks.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right, but it's more rewriting it from scratch using the old as a guideline than an actual port. It'd take ages, too, and the minecraft community doesn't seem to be too happy with notchs "whops i forgot to update" antics as it is...
Disconnecting the game from the internet and then playing in offline mode does fix this issue...