Really totally completely badass server management tools.

Temphage

<div class="IPBDescription">BEST. IDEA. EVER.</div>Seriously, for the like the first time in the history of FPS games, can NS2 ship with a good set of server management tools, instead of having to rely on some hacky bassackwards tools to come out 6 months down the line?

I'm sure we as a community can come up with some admin commands that are pretty mandatory to be implemented, notably 'forceteam' commands so I can move belligerent stackers around.

Renegade.

lua

RobB

<!--quoteo(post=1738213:date=Nov 19 2009, 12:27 PM:name=R_e_n_e_g_a_d_e)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (R_e_n_e_g_a_d_e @ Nov 19 2009, 12:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738213"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->lua<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

What he said.

inb4urdumbflames

Align

But it should be standard, so decently administrated but otherwise unmodded servers show up in the vanilla servers list.

Temphage

<!--quoteo(post=1738218:date=Nov 19 2009, 11:09 AM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Align @ Nov 19 2009, 11:09 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738218"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->But it should be standard, so decently administrated but otherwise unmodded servers show up in the vanilla servers list.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

^ ^ ^

This. I shouldn't have to wait around for someone to script out an entire server management package - who knows how long that would take. How many years was it before decent admin tools came out for Battlefield? In addition the last thing we need are 45 different administration packages floating around. A single point for 'official' server management would consolidate any community involved efforts for expanded tools that could be updated by simple patching - and in addition, avoid moronic ###### like Unreal Tournament sounds from finding their way in.

Relying on the community to code features that should be standard is <i>utterly retarded</i>.

RobB

They're standard, and you can disable them often.
Oh, and they're called Quakesounds.

Bacillus

<!--quoteo(post=1738218:date=Nov 19 2009, 11:09 AM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Align @ Nov 19 2009, 11:09 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738218"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->But it should be standard, so decently administrated but otherwise unmodded servers show up in the vanilla servers list.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I hope there will be some reasonable filters with the LUA plugins. NS2 is never going to be perfect when it ships, so I wouldn't be surprised if every server has some slight improvements like mapvotes or server specific communication improvements. At that point either a good filter or plugin whitelist should do the trick.

Renegade.

<!--quoteo(post=1738233:date=Nov 19 2009, 09:41 AM:name=Temphage)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Temphage @ Nov 19 2009, 09:41 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738233"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->^ ^ ^

This. I shouldn't have to wait around for someone to script out an entire server management package - who knows how long that would take. How many years was it before decent admin tools came out for Battlefield? In addition the last thing we need are 45 different administration packages floating around. A single point for 'official' server management would consolidate any community involved efforts for expanded tools that could be updated by simple patching - and in addition, avoid moronic ###### like Unreal Tournament sounds from finding their way in.

Relying on the community to code features that should be standard is <i>utterly retarded</i>.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
no one said there isn't going to be a standard, but your wish for them to be included SHIP is naive and unnecessary. It's time wasted on something that is better taken from the community anyways. First finish and ship the game, so it can be released for a few months; then let whatever LUA scripts that admins find they need float to the surface and be refined by the community (instead of devs guessing what might work) and include them officially with the next release. Sounds like a familiar process eh? Good 'ol Darwin.

Temphage

<!--quoteo(post=1738320:date=Nov 20 2009, 03:19 AM:name=R_e_n_e_g_a_d_e)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (R_e_n_e_g_a_d_e @ Nov 20 2009, 03:19 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738320"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->First finish and ship the game, so it can be released for a few months; then let whatever LUA scripts that admins find they need float to the surface and be refined by the community (instead of devs guessing what might work) and include them officially with the next release. Sounds like a familiar process eh? Good 'ol Darwin.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Darwin advocated SELLING a half-finished product so that the consumers can bust their ass finishing it for you, all without pay so you can make even more cash by selling it in the next version?

Wow, I thought he talked about birds. I was way off.

Renegade.

You've been hanging around the EA kids too much. Firstly, not including some auto-team switcher and other misc tools hardly constitutes 'half' of the product, a single percentage at best. Secondly welcome to the NS community, we are not EA (yet) and yes we enjoy 'busting our asses' as a community *with* devs to improve our overall combined experience. Lastly, again, we are not EA - there isn't going to be roster updates, and quite frankly I don't know where you're assuming that they're going to charge for a patch, that's rather slanderous. Knowing the team, they'll gladly implement whatever first round of LUA scripts crop up in the first patch that will soon follow release.

Temphage

<!--quoteo(post=1738334:date=Nov 20 2009, 05:44 AM:name=R_e_n_e_g_a_d_e)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (R_e_n_e_g_a_d_e @ Nov 20 2009, 05:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738334"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You've been hanging around the EA kids too much. Firstly, not including some auto-team switcher and other misc tools hardly constitutes 'half' of the product, a single percentage at best. Secondly welcome to the NS community, we are not EA (yet) and yes we enjoy 'busting our asses' as a community *with* devs to improve our overall combined experience. Lastly, again, we are not EA - there isn't going to be roster updates, and quite frankly I don't know where you're assuming that they're going to charge for a patch, that's rather slanderous. Knowing the team, they'll gladly implement whatever first round of LUA scripts crop up in the first patch that will soon follow release.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's only fair that it's also the exact feeling I had regarding the tiny number of maps NS2 is going to ship with. Team Fortress 2 did the same thing - ship with 5 maps, only one or two of which are worth a damn, versus in the old days when you got a dozen or more. Then use community maps, compensate them in no way whatsoever, and make a bajillion dollars 'selling' them with the next update.

You could ship with half-assed models and make the community 'mod' in decent ones, hell don't even ship with a decent interface and let us mod that in too. Where do you draw the line here? I consider server tools to be pretty critical to a game, and as I pointed out, having a framework at least will be a major help in at least <i>making</i> them, instead of waiting for a veteran in raw .lua to build them from scratch.

SentrySteve

I've noticed I disagree with Temphage on almost everything, but on this topic, how can you disagree with him? All he is saying is "spend some time to include decent / above average server management tools." In NS1, and we can safely assume NS2, the quality of the server you're playing on is almost as important as the game itself. Admins should be able to run their servers the way they want to so they can create the gaming environment they want.

Saying "release the game and worry about that later" is stupid. This isn't a mod and unless UWE wants to throw themselves in with the "oh it's incomplete/broken? Patch it post-release" crowd server management tools should be included.

Racer1

I agree that there should be an in-game management tool/script built into the game. Frankly I think the arguments of it delaying the game are without merit. By the time the game is released, (beta) testers will have already created scripts that implement most of the desired functionality. At that point, all UW has to do is take the best of these, tweak as necessary, and bundle with NS 2.

Below are the management features that I think should go into NS2 before 1.0 is released. Note that these are the bare-minimum of options, and could be further extended after NS2 is released.

Multiple roles: Admin, Manager, Player (anyone in game)
[Admin]
- Add/remove managers
[Manager/Admin]
- Ban (with reason)
- Temp Ban (with reason)
- Unban
- Kick
- Load map
- Force balance teams
- Assign player to team
- Enable/disable "vote kick player"
- Enable/disable "vote map"
[Player]
- Vote kick player
- Vote map (incl. extend)