remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1731139:date=Oct 6 2009, 03:33 PM:name=JAmazon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JAmazon @ Oct 6 2009, 03:33 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731139"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I actually hope they delay it, I'm very busy this fall...
/runs away very quickly!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Though it is true it would be bad for it to come out now because my academic life would suffer... I'm an addict so give it to me now anyways. :)
What Flayra is saying, we need to buy more special edition packs so they can hire more guys ;), or we wont find the game under our x-mas trees. We can easy calculate when NS2 will be released, if we check the time between each reveal. Each "reveal" take 2-4 weeks. And they still have to reveal: lerk, fade, mine pack, cc, tf, obs, pg, electrified tf, turret, siege, pl, al, rt, electrified rt, "commander logout button reveal", menus and so on.
This gives us an estimated time of release: fall 2010. This is exactly what the UW should have said, "the game will be released fall 2010"... and people would now have said: "are you gonna release it already fall 2009?!?!" .... If you set a goal to not pass an exam, and you try your best to pass it, but you don't manage pass it, then you cant be disappointed either. If people ask for a game, just say 2012, and drop the game like a bomb in 2009, and we wouldn't have this whining at the forum. I'm gonna get another glass of wine now thank you.
<!--quoteo(post=1731140:date=Oct 6 2009, 11:49 PM:name=Psyke)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Psyke @ Oct 6 2009, 11:49 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731140"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Though it is true it would be bad for it to come out now because my academic life would suffer... I'm an addict so give it to me now anyways. :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Release it in fall and my schoolwork suffers. Release it in summer and my social life suffers. It's a no-win :p
<!--quoteo(post=1731142:date=Oct 6 2009, 11:59 PM:name=Atone)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Atone @ Oct 6 2009, 11:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731142"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Release it in fall and my schoolwork suffers. Release it in summer and my social life suffers. It's a no-win :p<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
maybe they just shouldn't release it.. that would save a lot of stress
<!--quoteo(post=1731143:date=Oct 7 2009, 01:03 AM:name=whocareswc)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (whocareswc @ Oct 7 2009, 01:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731143"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->maybe they just shouldn't release it.. that would save a lot of stress<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Or,, maybe they should release it and make alot of people happy.
<!--quoteo(post=1731141:date=Oct 7 2009, 12:51 AM:name=Thrillseeker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thrillseeker @ Oct 7 2009, 12:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731141"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If people ask for a game, just say 2012, and drop the game like a bomb in 2009, and we wouldn't have this whining at the forum.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I haven't read the thread so I apologize if this has been said:
My main concern is that Flayra has put himself and the shareholders of Unknown Worlds in legal Jeopardy by offering a pre-order for game that is not close to release.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1731147:date=Oct 6 2009, 04:27 PM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Oct 6 2009, 04:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731147"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I haven't read the thread so I apologize if this has been said:
My main concern is that Flayra has put himself and the shareholders of Unknown Worlds in legal Jeopardy by offering a pre-order for game that is not close to release.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Did you really need to capitalize Jepoardy? It just turned your post into a joke for me.
There is nothing illegal about taking preorders far in advance of release... especially considering we weren't guaranteed a release date when preordering. To see what UWE owes you for your money, go here: <a href="http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy" target="_blank">http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy</a>
On the more info page for preorders, it says explicitly: <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->We have no exact date for the alpha or beta.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1731149:date=Oct 6 2009, 07:32 PM:name=Psyke)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Psyke @ Oct 6 2009, 07:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731149"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Did you really need to capitalize Jepoardy? It just turned your post into a joke for me.
There is nothing illegal about taking preorders far in advance of release... especially considering we weren't guaranteed a release date when preordering. To see what UWE owes you for your money, go here: <a href="http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy" target="_blank">http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy</a>
On the more info page for preorders, it says explicitly:
You have no case.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your inability to spell jeopardy and your utter lack of legal knowledge turned your post into a joke.
When someone sells a product, they enter into a binding contract with the buyer.
When a seller refuses or fails to deliver the goods to the buyer, the buyer may sue for damages.
I would like for them to at least announce a delay if they plan on delaying it. I'd like to know how much longer I'm going to have to wait. If it's another year I'd rather just get a refund and put it towards another game to play and then just buy the game when it actually comes out.
There really hasn't been much info lately, no new reveals. Just brief tech stuff. The twitter updates only make the game seem that more incomplete and not even close to the target release date. I'm starting to think it'd be a miracle if we even see alpha/beta this year.
<!--quoteo(post=1731152:date=Oct 7 2009, 12:47 AM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Oct 7 2009, 12:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731152"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Your inability to spell jeopardy and your utter lack of legal knowledge turned your post into a joke.
When someone sells a product, they enter into a binding contract with the buyer.
When a seller refuses or fails to deliver the goods to the buyer, the buyer may sue for damages.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Before you made the transaction you were told that there was no clear cut release date. Until they cancel the game or say that your pre-order doesn't count and won't buy you the game, they have not failed or refused to deliver the product.
<!--quoteo(post=1731153:date=Oct 7 2009, 01:55 AM:name=psykotik)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (psykotik @ Oct 7 2009, 01:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731153"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would like for them to at least announce a delay if they plan on delaying it. I'd like to know how much longer I'm going to have to wait. If it's another year I'd rather just get a refund and put it towards another game to play and then just buy the game when it actually comes out.
There really hasn't been much info lately, no new reveals. Just brief tech stuff. The twitter updates only make the game seem that more incomplete and not even close to the target release date. I'm starting to think it'd be a miracle if we even see alpha/beta this year.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just go with that ThrillSeeker said, expect the game at 2012 and get supprized when the full release comes out.
<!--quoteo(post=1731155:date=Oct 6 2009, 06:17 PM:name=Tekoppen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tekoppen @ Oct 6 2009, 06:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731155"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just go with that ThrillSeeker said, expect the game at 2012 and get supprized when the full release comes out.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I could do that, except I already preordered the game thinking it was coming out this year. If I really expected it to come out in 2012. I wouldn't of preordered in the first place.
<!--quoteo(post=1730963:date=Oct 6 2009, 07:11 AM:name=xtcmen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xtcmen @ Oct 6 2009, 07:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1730963"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Would you buy a car without looking at it?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, but then cars are very expensive.
Lots of people do buy games without looking at them, that's the whole premise of the pre-order.
<!--quoteo(post=1731152:date=Oct 6 2009, 04:47 PM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Oct 6 2009, 04:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731152"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->and your utter lack of legal knowledge turned your post into a joke.
When someone sells a product, they enter into a binding contract with the buyer.
When a seller refuses or fails to deliver the goods to the buyer, the buyer may sue for damages.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I am quite aware that UWE has entered into a contract with you in return for your payment, but the legal issue has nothing to do with how far off the release date is, and as Atone said:
<!--quoteo(post=1731154:date=Oct 6 2009, 05:00 PM:name=Atone)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Atone @ Oct 6 2009, 05:00 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731154"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Before you made the transaction you were told that there was no clear cut release date. Until they cancel the game or say that your pre-order doesn't count and won't buy you the game, they have not failed or refused to deliver the product.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> You <b>still</b> have no case.
<!--quoteo(post=1731131:date=Oct 7 2009, 06:50 AM:name=davidcavalcante)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (davidcavalcante @ Oct 7 2009, 06:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731131"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What makes part of the community worried is that the devs don't enunciate anything.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Pretty sure you have no idea what the word "enunciate" means, which is proportional to your game development knowledge. I disagree with too many of your arguments to be bothered typing it all out, to keep it short, I'm sure the devs will pleasantly surprise you.
EDIT: This thread is turning into a bunch of hooting morons who have no idea what they are talking about. Just let the devs take their time and deliver the great game we know it's going to be.
Anyways... crafting official looking stuff is hard work. I'm pretty sure the people making the videos for Blizzard had to setup time to make the gameplay videos, think about what they wanted to show, and if the original recording stunk I'm sure they would do it again. The "gameplay videos" all feel a bit staged since very specific and unique properties tend to show up in the games. Then again, I'm not Blizzerd so it could very well be a random match they decided to commentate.
However, the sheer act of setting up the feeds, getting players up to speed on the gameplay, making sure all the sound systems work, and then posting the finished video can take hours and hours. Any IT/AV people or those who have made their own videos know exactly what I mean. The time commitment can be immense, and I'm pretty sure UWE would rather make very pithy, professional videos/podcasts/blog posts.
On a related note, I'm unsure how far all the artwork (especially the modeling) has come, so I don't know if gameplay footage is even feasible at this point.
The Elemental beta recently released an initial build that only implemented the cloth map and some basic functionality. Talk about stripping down to the essentials. If you're not in the Beta mindset (test for testing, not enjoyment, sake) then such a Beta build would be disappointing. I'm pretty sure UWE is aiming for close to all the content in their initial alpha builds. Although I guess we could always do Skulk races.
If you haven't contributed then you have nothing to grief about. Let these guys do what they do, we don't go to your job and flip your burgers for you.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1731178:date=Oct 6 2009, 09:00 PM:name=xposed-)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xposed- @ Oct 6 2009, 09:00 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731178"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This thread is turning into a bunch of hooting morons who have no idea what they are talking about.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> When you put it that way, I should quit the internet!
Looks like the main questions were answered in this thread. Like others have said, there is a lot more that goes into making a game. Even the `10 min videos` can take a non-trivial amount of time to make. Since some of the later posts are starting to be used more for talking down to people more than answering anything, I'll go ahead and close this.
Comments
/runs away very quickly!
/runs away very quickly!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Though it is true it would be bad for it to come out now because my academic life would suffer... I'm an addict so give it to me now anyways. :)
This gives us an estimated time of release: fall 2010. This is exactly what the UW should have said, "the game will be released fall 2010"... and people would now have said: "are you gonna release it already fall 2009?!?!" .... If you set a goal to not pass an exam, and you try your best to pass it, but you don't manage pass it, then you cant be disappointed either. If people ask for a game, just say 2012, and drop the game like a bomb in 2009, and we wouldn't have this whining at the forum. I'm gonna get another glass of wine now thank you.
Release it in fall and my schoolwork suffers. Release it in summer and my social life suffers. It's a no-win :p
maybe they just shouldn't release it.. that would save a lot of stress
Or,, maybe they should release it and make alot of people happy.
<!--quoteo(post=1731141:date=Oct 7 2009, 12:51 AM:name=Thrillseeker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thrillseeker @ Oct 7 2009, 12:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731141"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If people ask for a game, just say 2012, and drop the game like a bomb in 2009, and we wouldn't have this whining at the forum.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, that's exactly what should have been done.
My main concern is that Flayra has put himself and the shareholders of Unknown Worlds in legal Jeopardy by offering a pre-order for game that is not close to release.
My main concern is that Flayra has put himself and the shareholders of Unknown Worlds in legal Jeopardy by offering a pre-order for game that is not close to release.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Did you really need to capitalize Jepoardy? It just turned your post into a joke for me.
There is nothing illegal about taking preorders far in advance of release... especially considering we weren't guaranteed a release date when preordering.
To see what UWE owes you for your money, go here: <a href="http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy" target="_blank">http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy</a>
On the more info page for preorders, it says explicitly:
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->We have no exact date for the alpha or beta.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You have no case.
There is nothing illegal about taking preorders far in advance of release... especially considering we weren't guaranteed a release date when preordering.
To see what UWE owes you for your money, go here: <a href="http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy" target="_blank">http://www.naturalselection2.com/buy</a>
On the more info page for preorders, it says explicitly:
You have no case.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your inability to spell jeopardy and your utter lack of legal knowledge turned your post into a joke.
When someone sells a product, they enter into a binding contract with the buyer.
When a seller refuses or fails to deliver the goods to the buyer, the buyer may sue for damages.
There really hasn't been much info lately, no new reveals. Just brief tech stuff. The twitter updates only make the game seem that more incomplete and not even close to the target release date. I'm starting to think it'd be a miracle if we even see alpha/beta this year.
When someone sells a product, they enter into a binding contract with the buyer.
When a seller refuses or fails to deliver the goods to the buyer, the buyer may sue for damages.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Before you made the transaction you were told that there was no clear cut release date. Until they cancel the game or say that your pre-order doesn't count and won't buy you the game, they have not failed or refused to deliver the product.
There really hasn't been much info lately, no new reveals. Just brief tech stuff. The twitter updates only make the game seem that more incomplete and not even close to the target release date. I'm starting to think it'd be a miracle if we even see alpha/beta this year.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just go with that ThrillSeeker said, expect the game at 2012 and get supprized when the full release comes out.
I could do that, except I already preordered the game thinking it was coming out this year. If I really expected it to come out in 2012. I wouldn't of preordered in the first place.
No, but then cars are very expensive.
Lots of people do buy games without looking at them, that's the whole premise of the pre-order.
Touche.
<!--quoteo(post=1731152:date=Oct 6 2009, 04:47 PM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Oct 6 2009, 04:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731152"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->and your utter lack of legal knowledge turned your post into a joke.
When someone sells a product, they enter into a binding contract with the buyer.
When a seller refuses or fails to deliver the goods to the buyer, the buyer may sue for damages.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I am quite aware that UWE has entered into a contract with you in return for your payment, but the legal issue has nothing to do with how far off the release date is, and as Atone said:
<!--quoteo(post=1731154:date=Oct 6 2009, 05:00 PM:name=Atone)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Atone @ Oct 6 2009, 05:00 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1731154"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Before you made the transaction you were told that there was no clear cut release date. Until they cancel the game or say that your pre-order doesn't count and won't buy you the game, they have not failed or refused to deliver the product.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You <b>still</b> have no case.
Pretty sure you have no idea what the word "enunciate" means, which is proportional to your game development knowledge. I disagree with too many of your arguments to be bothered typing it all out, to keep it short, I'm sure the devs will pleasantly surprise you.
EDIT:
This thread is turning into a bunch of hooting morons who have no idea what they are talking about. Just let the devs take their time and deliver the great game we know it's going to be.
A virtue... patience is one. Stop whining please.
Anyways... crafting official looking stuff is hard work. I'm pretty sure the people making the videos for Blizzard had to setup time to make the gameplay videos, think about what they wanted to show, and if the original recording stunk I'm sure they would do it again. The "gameplay videos" all feel a bit staged since very specific and unique properties tend to show up in the games. Then again, I'm not Blizzerd so it could very well be a random match they decided to commentate.
However, the sheer act of setting up the feeds, getting players up to speed on the gameplay, making sure all the sound systems work, and then posting the finished video can take hours and hours. Any IT/AV people or those who have made their own videos know exactly what I mean. The time commitment can be immense, and I'm pretty sure UWE would rather make very pithy, professional videos/podcasts/blog posts.
On a related note, I'm unsure how far all the artwork (especially the modeling) has come, so I don't know if gameplay footage is even feasible at this point.
The Elemental beta recently released an initial build that only implemented the cloth map and some basic functionality. Talk about stripping down to the essentials. If you're not in the Beta mindset (test for testing, not enjoyment, sake) then such a Beta build would be disappointing. I'm pretty sure UWE is aiming for close to all the content in their initial alpha builds. Although I guess we could always do Skulk races.
When you put it that way, I should quit the internet!