Remember the Southpaw

CrispyCrispy Jaded GD Join Date: 2004-08-22 Member: 30793Members, Constellation
edited July 2009 in NS2 General Discussion
<div class="IPBDescription">Complete control customisation for all</div>So, I'm left-handed and it seems everyone in the games industry has forgotten about us. According to international studies, we make up between 15% and 25% of the population depending on different parts of the world.

Yet every ergonomic mouse comes in only right-handers flavours and RTS and FPS games frequently lock control setups to right-handed-only controls. Trying to command in NS is a ###### because I have to cramp my right hand into the WSAD corner of the keyboard and stretch my little finger out to reach hotkeys further right, not to mention the squad numbers.

So, please, when assigning hotkeys for Natural Selection, either make all controls (and commander hotkeys) completely customisable, or provide a second alternative that suits a person using the mouse in their left hand and the keyboard with their right (i.e. most hotkeys should emanate out to the left of the main hand position on the keyboard).

Thanks in advance.

Comments

  • WatchMakerWatchMaker Join Date: 2003-09-26 Member: 21233Members, Constellation
    The commander's UI is apparently done entirely with LUA and Flash... So you could probably remake the interface entirely for a left handed appeal.
  • CxwfCxwf Join Date: 2003-02-05 Member: 13168Members, Constellation
    edited July 2009
    I'm reasonably certain the commander interface in NS1 is ALREADY completely customizable for you southpaws. The only tricky part is that many of the bind options aren't labeled anywhere -- instead of having a separate control scheme for commanding, the game just remaps the buttons you already used for first person play onto commander functions.

    The commander hotkeys do get their own line of text somewhere though. The default is a text string that looks like "qwerasdfzxcv", so if you can find that in your config you can replace it with whatever set of buttons you wanted to use for hotkeying.

    Lemme see if I can remember what all the unlabeled ones are:

    --Select groups 1 - 5 is whatever you have setup for select weapon slots 1 - 5
    --Save new groups 1 - 5 is that group button + whatever you have bound to "duck"
    --Go to last message is whatever you have bound to "jump"
    --Any hotkeys that also show up on that "qwerasdfzxcv" line will be overwritten by the commander function, so the old function won't work in the chair. (Since I have "q" bound to voicecomms, I moved the whole thing over to "wertsdfgxcvb". You can put it wherever you want though.)

    I think that's all of them? Commanders don't need any more hotkeys than that, that I can remember.
  • CrispyCrispy Jaded GD Join Date: 2004-08-22 Member: 30793Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1716331:date=Jul 8 2009, 11:50 AM:name=ZeroFate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ZeroFate @ Jul 8 2009, 11:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1716331"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The commander's UI is apparently done entirely with LUA and Flash... So you could probably remake the interface entirely for a left handed appeal.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Next question would be does this pass consistency checks for competitive play?

    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm reasonably certain the commander interface in NS1 is ALREADY completely customizable for you southpaws.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->If you're right I'll concede this point, but again we're being treated a bit like second class citizens. Give us in-game customisation or at least draw attention to the fact this can be done.

    Essentially we should be able to choose our hotkeys, but if that's not possible, then at least incorporate an alternative that is comfortable for left-handers.
  • AlignAlign Remain Calm Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5216Forum Moderators, Constellation
    There is a line in config.cfg with the value qwerasdfzxcv, but I forget what the variable is. At any rate, that one determines the commander menu keys.
  • BadMouthBadMouth It ceases to be exclusive when you can have a custom member titl Join Date: 2004-05-21 Member: 28815Members
    I would expect it that the controls are fully customizable. But I would like to have an extra request. To have primary buttons and secondary buttons. I share games with my bro who is righthanded whilst im left.
  • CxwfCxwf Join Date: 2003-02-05 Member: 13168Members, Constellation
    edited July 2009
    <!--quoteo(post=1716370:date=Jul 8 2009, 11:04 AM:name=Crispy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Crispy @ Jul 8 2009, 11:04 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1716370"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you're right I'll concede this point, but again we're being treated a bit like second class citizens. Give us in-game customisation or at least draw attention to the fact this can be done.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You act like lefties are the only ones who ever have to re-bind keys. The HL1 keybinding features were complicated to navigate for everyone, and some of the NS-specific binds were even stranger due to poor integration with the built-in bind editor. But if you were willing to put some time into customizing your userconfig file, NS already provided a huge amount of potential customizability and I have no doubt NS2 will be just as robust.

    For example, take Badmouth's request for an option to swap between two sets of binds. I'll agree that it would be cool to have a way to do this integrated into the main menu, but with a little effort you can already do that for NS1. A lot of people use that to swap binds when switching between marines and aliens, or between different alien lifeforms -- I swap binds when the 2nd Hive goes up and I suddenly need the +movement key as a skulk. Swapping binds for different players would be just as easy.

    Hopefully NS2 will provide a more intuitive editor interface for accomplishing all these things, but one way or another you can get all the customization you want.
  • JasonCJasonC Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68101Members
    Hmm.. I'm left handed, and I use the mouse with my right hand. I thought this was default behavior for almost everyone that is left handed? Have you tried it?
  • RobBRobB TUBES OF THE INTERWEB Join Date: 2003-08-11 Member: 19423Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1717056:date=Jul 13 2009, 01:13 AM:name=JasonC)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JasonC @ Jul 13 2009, 01:13 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1717056"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hmm.. I'm left handed, and I use the mouse with my right hand. I thought this was default behavior for almost everyone that is left handed? Have you tried it?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Dito. But I think it's just personal preference. Still feels weird when I have to teach my mom for the 7th time in a week (on tuesday) how to use firefox and are forced to grab over half the table to and use the mouse left handed.
  • BadMouthBadMouth It ceases to be exclusive when you can have a custom member titl Join Date: 2004-05-21 Member: 28815Members
    I used a righthanded mouse with my left hand since I was a kid. so I got used to it. tried switching over but it just feels weird.
  • SewlekSewlek The programmer previously known as Schimmel Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16247Members, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Developer
    i always use symmetric mice (i am left handed aswell) which are siutable for both left and right hand.

    never tried to play with right hand, I guess i would not be able to aim at any skulk anymore :)
  • HarimauHarimau Join Date: 2007-12-24 Member: 63250Members
    edited July 2009
    <!--quoteo(post=1717068:date=Jul 13 2009, 09:30 AM:name=RobB)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RobB @ Jul 13 2009, 09:30 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1717068"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->when I have to teach my mom for the 7th time in a week (on tuesday) how to use firefox<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    hahaha. we know how you feel.

    btw, this thread reminds me of a very interesting thread from last year. in the I&S forums i think it was.

    Found it. Here it was: <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=103472&hl=left+handed" target="_blank">Lefthanded Weaponmodels</a> funny stuff.
  • DadayaDadaya Join Date: 2005-02-02 Member: 39540Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1717100:date=Jul 13 2009, 06:15 AM:name=Schimmel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Schimmel @ Jul 13 2009, 06:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1717100"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i always use symmetric mice (i am left handed aswell) which are siutable for both left and right hand.

    never tried to play with right hand, I guess i would not be able to aim at any skulk anymore :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    This is somewhat similar to everyone being taught to play a musical instrument a certain way - i.e. right-handed guitar, right-handed violin/viola/cello/etc.

    For as long as that has happened though, there have always been people to switch it around and make it so for lefties (hendrix was a lefty!)

    However, for the original poster, I'm sure they'll be more than able to allow lefty customization, though an easy "lefty" setup with no work on your end might not happen, maybe they'll think about it after reading your post?
  • SopsSops Join Date: 2003-07-03 Member: 17894Members, Constellation
    Every lefty I have ever known uses the mouse in the right hand, so I think you are in a much smaller pool of people then you think. Regardless I'm sure NS2 will be fully customizable.
  • Cereal_KillRCereal_KillR Join Date: 2002-10-31 Member: 1837Members
    Most left-handed people use their right hand for mousing due to habit: at any public place, mice are constantly on the right; ergonomic mice come extremely rarely in a left-handed version; when sharing a computer, you don't bother switching around...
  • RobBRobB TUBES OF THE INTERWEB Join Date: 2003-08-11 Member: 19423Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    Seriously, the only Time I'm using my left hand is writing, I believe through a Mistake as my Teacher put me before the Chalkboard and didn't pay attention when I was writing my first word.
    Then he asked me and I didn't remember cause I was to concentrated on writing the word, I put my left hand forth and he put a stamp on it as a memory support to use that hand.
  • CrispyCrispy Jaded GD Join Date: 2004-08-22 Member: 30793Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1717056:date=Jul 13 2009, 01:13 AM:name=JasonC)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JasonC @ Jul 13 2009, 01:13 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1717056"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hmm.. I'm left handed, and I use the mouse with my right hand. I thought this was default behavior for almost everyone that is left handed? Have you tried it?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Actually I used to use the mouse right-handed for a number of years (Quakeworld, TFC, CS) but towards the end of CS I swapped to my left hand because the index finger on your dominant hand is faster than the one on your secondary hand, no matter how hard you might train it to be.

    Most people will accept what they're forced into doing if they are in the minority. Most people will accept second best if they convince themselves it's the only option. Whether you want to be one of those people or not is another question.
  • sherpasherpa stopcommandermode Join Date: 2006-11-04 Member: 58338Members
    I'm a lefty but I grew up using the mouse in the right hand.

    No jokes, please.
  • StanzStanz Join Date: 2009-07-07 Member: 68080Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1717319:date=Jul 14 2009, 08:34 PM:name=sherpa)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sherpa @ Jul 14 2009, 08:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1717319"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm a lefty but I grew up using the mouse in the right hand.

    No jokes, please.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    For quite a few years, when I first started using a keyboard and mouse (and gaming), I used my left hand on the mouse with arrow keys on my right. But I honestly felt no noticeable difference at all which hand I used, but ended up sticking to this setup for years. The only reason I now use my right hand is because it's the standard. I find it noticeably less efficient to go back to using my left hand on my mouse now if I force myself, but I'm quite satisfied that that is simply down to lack of practice (and the shape of the mouse). Oh, and I'm right handed (not ambidextrous).

    At the end of the day, you're going to be using both hands anyway.
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