Star Trek
TychoCelchuuu
Anememone Join Date: 2002-03-23 Member: 345Members
Anememone Join Date: 2002-03-23 Member: 345Members
in Off-Topic
<div class="IPBDescription">Awesome Movie / Sulu is a ninja</div>Just saw Star Trek. Overall, I thought it was quite good. 7.5 or 8 out of 10 in my book. Anyone who's a big Star Trek fan would do well to read the Countdown comic books; it's a four issue prequel to the movie that clears up some plot holes and sets up the movie pretty well. In any case, though, I liked the special effects, I thought all the actors were particularly well matched to their roles, and it was pretty exciting. Could have been better but hey, looking at the other Trek movies, it could have been much worse. If you haven't seen it, careful for spoilers in this thread, but I'll go ahead and put mine in tags:
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>The whole Spock/Uhura thing was a neat change in my book. Pretty much the only big departure and at the same time I think it makes everything more interesting. Plus they can always break up if it's dumb. Also, Leonard Nimoy will never get old.</span>
What'd everyone else think? Also, Sulu should be canonically homosexual. Just because.
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>The whole Spock/Uhura thing was a neat change in my book. Pretty much the only big departure and at the same time I think it makes everything more interesting. Plus they can always break up if it's dumb. Also, Leonard Nimoy will never get old.</span>
What'd everyone else think? Also, Sulu should be canonically homosexual. Just because.
Comments
Overall it was fun to watch and they've essentially set themselves up for both a franchise reset and, if they want, a whole new series.
There's lots of logic holes in the movie but they don't really matter; it was fun and that's all that matters =D
My main beef was the "A supernova that threatened to destroy the galaxy".
That's one helluva supernova.
--Scythe--
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>1) Why drill to the core of the planet and drop the red mass in? Surely dropping red mass on the surface would obliterate half the planet and suck in the remaining half anyway? You've got a giant ball of the stuff and it only takes a drop... go mad!
2) "in my time this is just a mining ship". Uh... a mining ship made to look like a war kraken space monster with high damage combat missles and able to withstand a starship's full arsenal? I seriously doubt the power needed to mine a planet or deflect space debris has changed much over the years and according to the story line they didn't have time to 'outfit' it for war; they intercepted Spock right after he was stopping the Nova so it's gonna be pretty much a base mining ship.
3) I've never seen a star trek where they could beam aboard a ship unless they knocked it's shields out first. They beam onto both the mining monster ship and the enterprise during this film. In the case of the mining ship I suppose you might say it has no shields (seems odd if it's a mining ship though, surely it'd have to go into asteroid fields and the like where debris is a problem and I'd imagine energy shields are easier to maintain than knocking dents out of the outer hull). The enterprise? uh... I'm guessing they put their shields down when they're at warp speed but I'd imagine travelling that fast without some kind of protection from debris and particles would be a bit silly :3
4) "We have intruders on board and one's Vulcan!" What's the first thing you do? That's right, you don't post any guards, security or go yourself to the ship with all the red mass in it. That ship alone can pretty much help you realise your revenge plans but instead you went off to wait about in a weird big dark chasm place for Kirk to show up and then act surprised when you find out the key component of your plan has been pinched. Nero's a genius :p
5) "and then the unthinkable happened... Romulus was destroyed before I could get there" I find that hard to believe. unthinkable? Wouldn't the nova explosion have a fairly linear rate of expansion? Didn't the Romulans think to maybe evacuate just in case? I mean, did they sit about go "Spock'll fix it for us, what could possibly go wrong while we wait for him to arrive with a planet destroying Nova on our doorstep?" Silly... very silly :p
6) They used a black hole that flushes things through into another time to get rid of the nova... isn't that a lil irresponsible? Wouldn't all that fire and energy be getting shunted off to somewhere back in time to destroy god knows what, god knows where instead potentially changed the present? Or is it just ships that conveniently get transposed through time completely intact? :p</span>
I could go on all day, but you get the idea. Despite all the above and more though, it was fun and again; that's all that matters :3
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>1) Why drill to the core of the planet and drop the red mass in? Surely dropping red mass on the surface would obliterate half the planet and suck in the remaining half anyway? You've got a giant ball of the stuff and it only takes a drop... go mad!
That's a good question.
2) "in my time this is just a mining ship". Uh... a mining ship made to look like a war kraken space monster with high damage combat missles and able to withstand a starship's full arsenal? I seriously doubt the power needed to mine a planet or deflect space debris has changed much over the years and according to the story line they didn't have time to 'outfit' it for war; they intercepted Spock right after he was stopping the Nova so it's gonna be pretty much a base mining ship.
After Romulus was destroyed, Nero picked up the Romulan high council that had evacuated. Mad with rage and grief, he killed them, and from them obtained the location of the hidden Romulan military fortress that was designed to be the fallback point in case anything went to crap. Nero showed up there saying that he found the council dead and that he was all that was left. They outfitted his mining ship with their best experimental technology, retrofitted from Borg wreckage among other things. It made him super powerful.
3) I've never seen a star trek where they could beam aboard a ship unless they knocked it's shields out first. They beam onto both the mining monster ship and the enterprise during this film. In the case of the mining ship I suppose you might say it has no shields (seems odd if it's a mining ship though, surely it'd have to go into asteroid fields and the like where debris is a problem and I'd imagine energy shields are easier to maintain than knocking dents out of the outer hull). The enterprise? uh... I'm guessing they put their shields down when they're at warp speed but I'd imagine travelling that fast without some kind of protection from debris and particles would be a bit silly :3
Also a good question, but I imagine you could easily explain it with some technobabble.
4) "We have intruders on board and one's Vulcan!" What's the first thing you do? That's right, you don't post any guards, security or go yourself to the ship with all the red mass in it. That ship alone can pretty much help you realise your revenge plans but instead you went off to wait about in a weird big dark chasm place for Kirk to show up and then act surprised when you find out the key component of your plan has been pinched. Nero's a genius <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
Nero and his crew were just a bunch of miners, so I guess you could say they're all just idiots.
5) "and then the unthinkable happened... Romulus was destroyed before I could get there" I find that hard to believe. unthinkable? Wouldn't the nova explosion have a fairly linear rate of expansion? Didn't the Romulans think to maybe evacuate just in case? I mean, did they sit about go "Spock'll fix it for us, what could possibly go wrong while we wait for him to arrive with a planet destroying Nova on our doorstep?" Silly... very silly <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
In the comic it's pretty believable. In a nutshell, since it's basically just Spock and Nero saying "Romulus is going to blow up, you have to let the Federation save you," the Romulan high council obviously distrusts the Vulcan and doesn't act quickly enough. Spock decides to go renegade and try to help anyways, but he's too late to save Romulus and Nero blames him for it.
6) They used a black hole that flushes things through into another time to get rid of the nova... isn't that a lil irresponsible? Wouldn't all that fire and energy be getting shunted off to somewhere back in time to destroy god knows what, god knows where instead potentially changed the present? Or is it just ships that conveniently get transposed through time completely intact?
The black hole actually doesn't just throw stuff into another time; that's simply one thing that a black hole CAN do. Mostly it just sucks stuff in.
</span>
~tilts head and thinks~ then again, maybe not... I might be able to find all these faults and some gaps that you need the comics for but the movie was still an enjoyable romp :3
Thanks for those explanations tych :D
There were waaay too many situations in Star Trek when lasers weren't the answer to the problem.
In case I was in any doubt of this it was made clear when the trailer came up and the misses said "you're not taking me to see that".
Yeah, it seemed to me like he was saying that, which seems sort of silly. I mean, if you wanted 24/7 violence you can always play a video game or zone out when people are talking. Tons of episodes of Star Trek didn't have any violence at all.
The movie was fantastic. I'll definitely look up the comic prequel, but a question does come up to me. I think I've solved it, but it still remains.
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>In the film, you see Kirk and Spock as children and their respective upbringings. I know no dates are associated, but it is as if they are the same age. However, in ST:E it is constantly alluded that T'pol is much older than the human crew. The older Spock says he is from over 120 years in the future I think, so that explains the longer life, but is Vulcan adolescence as short as humans? Maybe it's that Spock is half human, so his life expectancy shortens?</span>
Jack Bauer.
That's all I have to say to that.
The man speaks truth. Real, absolute truth.
--Scythe--
That's actually how I rate them too, although I can't imagine you'll find lots of people who do that. In any case, I did indeed enjoy the movie.
Can anyone tell me otherwise? or is this actually how they/he decided to redo it.
That's what it felt like to me but it was still a fun movie.
Also, I guess the thing with Enterprise is that they are trying to reinvent ST and are somewhat full of themself. That and the ST feeling just isn't there (no idea how to explain that though)
I still like it a bit though. But yeh if were going to debate about the best space/sci-fi series evah... Full power goes to Firefly "Serenity" <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> (blast FOX for screwing that one over...)
It wasn't a horrible show, it's just by far the worst Star Trek. It basically copied the original, only it swapped around the genders and ethnicities a tiny bit. Uhura and Sulu swapped races, Spock was a girl, and the engineer had a different funny accent. From there it either hewed pretty close to the original series only less cheesy, which takes out half the charm, or ridiculous alien-Nazi-shapeshifter-timetravel plotlines that weren't super gripping. Finally, it had the weakest cast; aside from Scott Bakula I can't even name any of the actors, let alone recall how awesome they were. Compared to the original series, TNG, Voyager, and DS9, it was missing memorable, engaging people. Finally, the art direction was just generic sci-fi. Nothing special. Not awful, but nowhere near the nice stuff you got on all the other shows.
So his answer is basically, yes it was more accessible, but because it only took the good parts of trek and slightly tweaked them that it was bad :-p .
Serious answer is that it was nothing new, so people who had watched a lot of trek were bored because they'd seen it all before(really this has been the same since TNG, but I guess it reached critical mass).
I agree too. It was just a sci-fi action movie. There was some idea of a plot hidden behind it, but it was only there to serve to push more action. I mean <span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>the whole Vulcan planet is gone, you think there would be more focus on something like that in a normal Trek story</span> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> I still enjoyed it, but there is no time to breath and enjoy any story it has.
Can anyone tell me otherwise? or is this actually how they/he decided to redo it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I felt exactly the same. In all honestly I've stopped trying to expect great things from ST films, the series are largely where it's at. I don't mind if it leans more towards action, but that's not really what Star Trek has traditionally been.
Traditionally, the reason ST has gotten such a big following, particularly since TNG, is because it's a set of really well written short stories in a rich Sci Fi universe full of diverse cultures that gives the viewers interesting perspectives on the human race, whether it's the question of what it is to be human, human character and relationships, cultural diversity or the question of where the human race could be headed. That's for me what makes Star Trek good, and that wasn't conveyed in the movie trailer, which was much more HEYLOOKATMEWEGOTLASERSTHATGOWHOOSHEXPLOSIONSTHATGOBOOMGIRLSTAKINGOFFTHEIRSHIRTSA
NDNUBILETWENTYSOMETHINGSUNDULATINGUNDERSOFTLIGHTINGOHANDINCASEYOUDIDN'TKNOWTHISWASASTARTREKMOVIELOOKIT'SLEONARDNIMOY!
<!--quoteo(post=1706677:date=May 11 2009, 09:52 PM:name=DiscoZombie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DiscoZombie @ May 11 2009, 09:52 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1706677"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><a href="http://www.theonion.com/content/video/trekkies_bash_new_star_trek_film?utm_source=videoembed" target="_blank">Obligatory</a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I was kinda tipped off by the url containing the word 'trekkies'. Still amusing.
I'm not massively put off, but I'm not in as much of a rush to see this as I was to see the Dark Knight or Watchmen.
On the ST movie, it seems the only people I've seen speak negative of it are trekkers. It's like this movie is to them what Jesus Christ Superstar is to uptight religious folk. Yes, the movie has action. Yes, there is lens flare. Yes, there is more attitude than previous iterations. Yes, there is lens flare. Yes, Shatner got shafted. Yes, it sticks to the cannon of Star Trek, yet completely reinvents the franchise. Yes, it has plot holes (and lens flare). But as I've seen many critics say, and I agree, the cast is so captivating, you gladly overlook the holes because you WANT to see more of this ensemble working together. To me, Simon Pegg makes Scotty. And I didn't know either actor for Kirk or Spock, but I am very impressed with their performances.
So, to all trekkers, see here: <a href="http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/update-feature-star-trek/1099561/?dst=nbc|widget|NBC%20Video&__source=nbc|widget|NBC%20Video" target="_blank">Star Trek on SNL</a>
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>1. No one ever tried to stop the giant drill except for the enterprise. Spock says that on Vulcan there were 6 billion people, and not a single person or ship on Vulcan did anything about the giant laser drill attacking their planet. I guess you could make an argument about vulcans being vulcans (i.e. useless) but the same argument doesn't apply to Earth. No one does anything. They just run outside and stare at it. Sulu and Kirk knocked it out of comission using two hand held rifles. They're trying to make us believe that there's not a single flying vehicle on the whole of earth that could fly up and cut the chain or something? Come on.
Also there're only two damn ships in the entire film; the enterprise and the bad guy's ship. You'd expect more resistance around Earth and Vulcan, even if it *is* an extremely powerful warship. Speaking of which, the bad guys ship decimated a small fleet of federation ships apparently because they couldn't destroy the torpedoes fast enough, and yet when it attacks Spock's ship and the enterprise comes to the rescue, it has absolutely no problem point-defence-lasering the hell out of "everything [they've] got".
2. Alternate timeline / alternate dimension / alternate reality is Sci-Fi's version of "it was all a dream". It's a lazy cop out to disregard / reinvent the show's history. I can understand why they did it, but it still bugs the hell out of me.</span>
Still an enjoyable film. Simon Pegg as Scotty turned out to be far, far better than I anticipated.
Yes.
--Scythe--