A More Forgiving Natural Selection
Sirot
Join Date: 2006-12-03 Member: 58851Members
Join Date: 2006-12-03 Member: 58851Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Back to the Basics</div>Oh how I love puns.
From the <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=105227" target="_blank">Will NS2 be newbie friendly?</a> Thread:
<!--quoteo(post=1694896:date=Dec 2 2008, 11:47 AM:name=Emanon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Emanon @ Dec 2 2008, 11:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1694896"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->NS isn’t newbie friendly and may never be because there is so much going on at once. As any life form or marine how you play against each other changes depending on so many factors; Ammo, Guns in use, # of enemies, friendly support, adrenaline, health, armor, opponent abilities, opponent locations, structures, nearest health/healing, commander reaction time, your movement, opponents movement, timing, opponents intentions (build, pickup equip?), life forms involved, proximity to the hive, etc. All these things go into any combat situation and those who play it right wins.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is a discussion of how the gameplay of Natural Selection could be simplified without hurting the identity of the game. The reason why you would do this is to allow people who are less experienced games to play the game. This means to discredit all assumptions that the person has video game savvy aside from the very basics of that in a FPS you shoot things and in a RTS, you build things. This however is not a debate on the worthiness of the mechanics or "how could you even suggest dumbing down this glorious game". What I want to extract is the very foundation of Natural Selection and remove the unnecessary complexities that haunted it.
I'll be primarily be using the Marine as an example since we know the most about them. This is how a player who played an FPS and RTS (core target) but is not a enthusiast, should be able react. I am using some information that we got from the developers. All that information is going to be in NS2 underlined and the rest is assumptions
<b>An example of how early game that should occur:</b>
A player first spawns and is greeted by a few things. He has a health, armor and a weapon. This tells him he is going to shoot things. However, in the top right of the screen, he sees that he has a resource counter in the top right with a commander's pool right below. This tells him that<u> he has resources </u>he could use and that the commander needs resources as well. He looks around and sees the very start of a base, a tooltip catches his attention and tells him to go to the armory, creating a little icon above the odd structure. The player walks up to it and is prompted to press the "use" key and when he does, <u>a window opens up displaying all the things he could use resources for.</u> Not having enough for anything, he begins marching out and receives a way point by the commander to go capture a resource node. <u>Arrows appear below his feet to direct him to where needs to go.</u> He promptly gets killed by a skulk and realizes that four-legged creatures are a threat. He later respawns and more carefully exists the base, watching the corners for any sudden movement. He spots the skulk and shoots it down. He finally arrives and he gets a notification of the importance of resource nodes and that they need to be captured. A resource tower appears and he is prompted by the commander and a notification to help build it.
The objective is to keep the amount of information that the player needs to know in the beginning at a complete minimal. All important information needs to be done in subtle ques that are self-explanatory. An example of this is there being two resource pools displayed, with one being labeled as the player's and the other as the commander's. This tells the player that he can use those resource for something, presumably for equipment and that the commander has resources to which he probably used to build this base. The very idea of having resources also tells the player that things need to be captured, which is inherent in NS1 as well. What was different in NS1 was that the marine was told he had resources but no explanation was given of how he could use it. The unification of resource systems between the two sides made it possible to simplify a complicated thing for a new player like the commander being the only person who can use resources and give out equipment into something more manageable and less worrying. Of course, I am not certain if the developers are going to display both resource pools to the player at the same time - but I would like to think that they would. Another thing that I have grown fond of is that the developers removing the mini-map and adding a drawn path for players to follow when assigned a waypoint. This makes navigating the world a lot less daunting with no mini-map and makes the usefulness of the commander immediately apparent to the new marine.
This is not much different from how NS1 played, but removing content that has baggage and replacing it with a more sleek alternative is a great way to encourage new players and remove gameplay clutter. This does bring up issues which is the crux of this discussion. What can be removed or simplified in the game without hurting what Natural Selection is?
A example of a hot issue would be the gorge for the aliens, who served a builder and support role in the team. The problem begins with the gorge being a object of necessity in the sense the aliens needed a way to build structures because they had no commander. The way the gorge built things was awkward and the chambers system made it very difficult to figure out how the alien tech tree worked. Now that the aliens could potentially have their own commander, what is the use of the gorge? Wouldn't the commander be more qualified to act as the builder given the the RTS interface is a lot better suited for it with easier placement and access to helpful tooltips? The chamber system could be abolished if the alien commander would direct the avaliable evolutions for aliens players.
What is the fate of the gorge considering he is loveable character if such a potential simplification occurs?
So, what do you think? In what areas can NS2 be softer without hurting what it is.
From the <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=105227" target="_blank">Will NS2 be newbie friendly?</a> Thread:
<!--quoteo(post=1694896:date=Dec 2 2008, 11:47 AM:name=Emanon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Emanon @ Dec 2 2008, 11:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1694896"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->NS isn’t newbie friendly and may never be because there is so much going on at once. As any life form or marine how you play against each other changes depending on so many factors; Ammo, Guns in use, # of enemies, friendly support, adrenaline, health, armor, opponent abilities, opponent locations, structures, nearest health/healing, commander reaction time, your movement, opponents movement, timing, opponents intentions (build, pickup equip?), life forms involved, proximity to the hive, etc. All these things go into any combat situation and those who play it right wins.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is a discussion of how the gameplay of Natural Selection could be simplified without hurting the identity of the game. The reason why you would do this is to allow people who are less experienced games to play the game. This means to discredit all assumptions that the person has video game savvy aside from the very basics of that in a FPS you shoot things and in a RTS, you build things. This however is not a debate on the worthiness of the mechanics or "how could you even suggest dumbing down this glorious game". What I want to extract is the very foundation of Natural Selection and remove the unnecessary complexities that haunted it.
I'll be primarily be using the Marine as an example since we know the most about them. This is how a player who played an FPS and RTS (core target) but is not a enthusiast, should be able react. I am using some information that we got from the developers. All that information is going to be in NS2 underlined and the rest is assumptions
<b>An example of how early game that should occur:</b>
A player first spawns and is greeted by a few things. He has a health, armor and a weapon. This tells him he is going to shoot things. However, in the top right of the screen, he sees that he has a resource counter in the top right with a commander's pool right below. This tells him that<u> he has resources </u>he could use and that the commander needs resources as well. He looks around and sees the very start of a base, a tooltip catches his attention and tells him to go to the armory, creating a little icon above the odd structure. The player walks up to it and is prompted to press the "use" key and when he does, <u>a window opens up displaying all the things he could use resources for.</u> Not having enough for anything, he begins marching out and receives a way point by the commander to go capture a resource node. <u>Arrows appear below his feet to direct him to where needs to go.</u> He promptly gets killed by a skulk and realizes that four-legged creatures are a threat. He later respawns and more carefully exists the base, watching the corners for any sudden movement. He spots the skulk and shoots it down. He finally arrives and he gets a notification of the importance of resource nodes and that they need to be captured. A resource tower appears and he is prompted by the commander and a notification to help build it.
The objective is to keep the amount of information that the player needs to know in the beginning at a complete minimal. All important information needs to be done in subtle ques that are self-explanatory. An example of this is there being two resource pools displayed, with one being labeled as the player's and the other as the commander's. This tells the player that he can use those resource for something, presumably for equipment and that the commander has resources to which he probably used to build this base. The very idea of having resources also tells the player that things need to be captured, which is inherent in NS1 as well. What was different in NS1 was that the marine was told he had resources but no explanation was given of how he could use it. The unification of resource systems between the two sides made it possible to simplify a complicated thing for a new player like the commander being the only person who can use resources and give out equipment into something more manageable and less worrying. Of course, I am not certain if the developers are going to display both resource pools to the player at the same time - but I would like to think that they would. Another thing that I have grown fond of is that the developers removing the mini-map and adding a drawn path for players to follow when assigned a waypoint. This makes navigating the world a lot less daunting with no mini-map and makes the usefulness of the commander immediately apparent to the new marine.
This is not much different from how NS1 played, but removing content that has baggage and replacing it with a more sleek alternative is a great way to encourage new players and remove gameplay clutter. This does bring up issues which is the crux of this discussion. What can be removed or simplified in the game without hurting what Natural Selection is?
A example of a hot issue would be the gorge for the aliens, who served a builder and support role in the team. The problem begins with the gorge being a object of necessity in the sense the aliens needed a way to build structures because they had no commander. The way the gorge built things was awkward and the chambers system made it very difficult to figure out how the alien tech tree worked. Now that the aliens could potentially have their own commander, what is the use of the gorge? Wouldn't the commander be more qualified to act as the builder given the the RTS interface is a lot better suited for it with easier placement and access to helpful tooltips? The chamber system could be abolished if the alien commander would direct the avaliable evolutions for aliens players.
What is the fate of the gorge considering he is loveable character if such a potential simplification occurs?
So, what do you think? In what areas can NS2 be softer without hurting what it is.
Comments
A tutorial of some kind explaining the roles of the buildings, weapons/items and lifeforms is a start at least.
I think the tutorial approach is better, and it also reduces the hassle of worrying about whether a veteran player is being explained how to use an armory etc. I've been seeing more and more frequently in games that they have a summary of the game during installation. Some show images while the more advanced ones have entire flash videos playing.
What I propose is exactly that. Why don't we have a flash video tutorial on how natural selection 2 is played, but hide it by making it seem like some sort of tactical log report which you, a marine of the Frontiersmen, are reading prior to battle. Give it a sort of feel like you're watching the pc screen of an incredibly advanced computer system telling you you've received battle assignments and to rendezvous for teleportation (inspired by the computer voice at the beginning of Half-life).
Script would be something like:
<i>Connection in progress...
<Load fully the movie before showing to reduce cpu competition with installation program>
Good day, Lieutenant Banks.
The current temperature on Moonbase delta 164 is a chilly -78 degrees Celsius. A light radiation storm is predicted later this afternoon at 1600 and you're invited to take all the correct precautions, including to ensure that all family members are accounted for and all pets are kept safely in their dormicles facility. Remember to work safe. Your life depends on it.
Incoming transmission from Seargent Renolds...
<Wait a few moments for effect, possibly with some sound effects>
"Banks! Where the hell are you!? You've got detail duty in 10 minutes!
We've got orders from upstairs that there have been some.. disturbances. Nothing we can't handle. There have been some reports of an outbreak of some organic creatures that have been said to look like dogs. "
<show some rough drawings of skulks and perhaps a few screenshots of blurred skulks on the walls>
They're rumored to be highly intelligent beings and adapt quite well to their environments, so be on the lookout for any funny strange adaptations from these creatures. Though not to worry, Banks. I'll keep watch in the commander seat to make sure your precious little fannies remain unscathed. All I ask is you listen closely to my orders and we'll be back on Alpha 9 smoking cigars before you can say 'Xenophobe'. I'm sending you the coordinates this second.
The phase gate should be up and operational. And despite what those sissy scientists tell you, phasing does <b>not</b> cause cancer and in my entire lifetime, I've only known three people to have.. incidents phasing, though I can tell you I've never seen more blood in my entire life! They were cleaning gunk out of the walls for probably a good month after.
Don't worry about equipment. If there's one thing those sissy scientists have done right, it's that they rigged the entire place under a teleportation matrix, so I can drop anything we need anywhere we need it. If you need ammo, you can it yourself at the armory or you can me, and if I'm not busy, I'll drop you some clips. If you're hurt, I can manifest some health packs (you'll owe me at least a beer for saving your ass big time). I doubt if you'll need it, but if things get rough, we've got some spare armor suits and weapons for just such a special occasion. I hope these creatures do put up a fight. Some of the tinkerers back in the lab have cooked something up that I could probably get if I put forth the effort to make it happen.
Though all these pretty little gadgets and guns don't come cheap! I'm going to need resources if we're going to keep it up. Which is why it might be that the best way to burn these little critters is if we keep our supply of resources high. So build resource nodes as you see'em and keep them safe! Don't you worry too much about that. You just listen to orders and you'll do just fine Lieutenant. You get yourself and your pansy-ass squad here on the double!
Now what are you waiting for, maggot! We've got work to do! If you're 1 minute late I'm docking it off your pay, you got that, maggot?! I'll be surprised if you even show up at all. On the double! Move out, maggot!"
End transmission.
We shall await your return. Have a safe journey. </i>
But yeah, we'd need more to introduce players to more personal details like resources and upgrades (and the map! never forget the map), so a cool video won't be enough by itself.
Queued jumping.
Easier to end the game.
Removal of static defenses unless they need to be attended.
Dual commandermode (pilot / navigator).
Better waypoints (with pathfinding).
Don't assume anyone is intelligent or expect them to think critically, but design with openings for those who want to.
Queued jumping.
Easier to end the game.
Removal of static defenses unless they need to be attended.
Dual commandermode (pilot / navigator).
Better waypoints (with pathfinding).
Don't assume anyone is intelligent or expect them to think critically, but design with openings for those who want to.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Queued jumping?
I actually like the co-commander idea as a way for new commanders to learn. But other than that, you are suggesting overall game improvements not simplifications.
Another thing I have been thinking about is the pacing of matches. Do new technologies/evolutions become available too quickly? Should the earlier game be extended in a bit (skulks, gorges and lurks for example) so newer plays could have more time to prepare for the fades?
Queued jumping.
Easier to end the game.
Removal of static defenses unless they need to be attended.
Dual commandermode (pilot / navigator).
Better waypoints (with pathfinding).
Don't assume anyone is intelligent or expect them to think critically, but design with openings for those who want to.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm pretty down with this list. There hasn't been many other game-breaking ideas. A few intriguing ones like sticky chambers, but these hit the core issues.
The queued jump is for easier movement stuff, like bunnyhopping.
<i><a big gate opens, light fall in a dark room, marines move in and drop a CC>
"god damned that stinks!" says a marine over radio.
<the marines sett a base up, whit a IP, armory, TL.>
"stop crying, jonson" <a marine hits another marine on the shoulder>
"MOVE OUT"-
< a group of 4 marines move out the base, through a dark corridor>
"shouldnt the lights be on?" -
"i dont like this..." -
"shut up! we have to secure that processing center!"
<the camera looks up, directly abouve the marines is a vent opening, you see the shadow of a skulk>
< parasiting sounds is to hear>
"OH ######?! what was that? something hit me on the back!"
"relax you ######. were home before you can say -double node.-"
<the marines proceed further, on the way another marines yells >
"stop that bob! it isnt funny anymore!"
"what? i did nothing!"
"someone scratched me!"
<skulk laughning is to hear from above, the marines get alerted. the camera is on the skulk, who scratches the vent, chuckles, bites the air, >
<the marines are fokused at the vent, pointing their weapons on it>
"what is this thing?!"
" whatever it is, we need to kill it, we cant allow it to get to our back!"
< the skulk still make noise, the marines are distracted, and cant see 2 skulks sneaking up on them.>
"HOLY ######! SHO.. aAR"
<seeing the 2 skulks bite a marine, then retreating, marines fire everything they got in the corridor. camera fokuses then on the marines, who are breathing heavely, blurry skulks fall from the cielling. camera switches to another marine group that is building a RT, far away screams are to hear. near parasiting sound is heard. >
end.</i>
scout, distract, and ambush video.
now imaging a video for each class, HA, JP, lerk, fade, gorge(whos running away, maybe bring some humor.) onos.
a exiting tutorial video!