Ns_Nexus Beta3 test available

StixNStonz

<div class="IPBDescription">if anyone wants to provide feedback before I fully release b3</div>Heya,

So, Nexus has finally come to beta3. Beta 2 was released on Nov 7, <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?s=3492003561034242560&showtopic=98465" target="_blank"><u>thread found here</u></a>, so its been nearly two months until the next version. As i dislike releasing version after version, i try to get each as polished as i can.

I'm releasing this 'beta 3 test' so that hopefully one or a few of you could provide any amount of feedback, or even an in-depth review like how some of us enjoy doing <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />. Whatever the feedback is, it will absolutely be considered before ns_nexus_b3 is released all over. And by all over, i mean the 8 or so server forums I have bookmarked <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />. I will also be putting this version through the channels to be considered for official.

The main drawback of this test is the minimap. The beta 2 minimap had everything labelled and coloured; there have been a few significant changes to the minimap, and I havn't been able to get it updated yet (still gotta learn photoshop...).

But, I included a basic buildminimap file, so you'll still have the basic minimap. Everything else should be near-b3 release. I might darken the pulsating Nexus Mainframe light a bit, but that will be determined after a bit of testing.

So if anyone will, please, check it out <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

Thank you very much in advance,

Stix&Stonz


...and please keep posts relevant

<a href="http://www.iownallyourbase.com/hosting/hosting/ns_nexus_b3_test.rar" target="_blank"><u>Download NS_Nexus_b3_test here</u></a>



Current Changelog:

**Beta 3:
-renovated Chromo Hive: Higher hive, new reachable spot, more cover, more lighting
-removed vast majority of func_nobuilds in the View Halls and Rings, because Chromo cannot be sieged from there anymore
-fixed weldable corridors near double: much more onos friendly (fits them now) and newb friendly (no more dead ends)
-removed weldable door, corridor from Double to Port Shaft is now open
-fixed onos stuck points when MC'ing to bottom hives (two spawns per hive)
-lowered all weld times (7 total weldables now)
-placed a location name on the Starboard Shaft res node
-fixed onos stuck points in nexus and chromo
-added ladder to the Gorges' Hideout in Engineering Halls (since gorges should be able to exit their hideout)
-fixed sinkable structures in marine start
-fixed all ladders. You can now approach from the side and not be stopped. (this was about 25 ladders)
-fixed all 'dead end' situations in Mag Pump overhead vents
-gorges now have easy access to the ladders in the bottom hives (noobs couldnt find their way out before <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />)
-removed some extraneous vents, to simplify map
-removed the Rings from around the two Shafts to simplify the map
-over 9000 visual upgrades (estimate)

tigersmith

<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wow.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":0" border="0" alt="wow.gif" /> Ill download it after I finish my HW. im looking forward to the fixes and new stuff you did <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />

Chocolate

Ill download it tommorow, got to get back studying <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />

Strangely enough, I've never been able to play nexus, even when i push for it in NS matches. I guess ill start with this <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

AnAkIn

Is this map going to be in 3.2 Final?

FFSkyrider

Hope you don't mind me mirroring this, even though this is a beta (test):
<a href="http://halflife2.filefront.com/file/;75419" target="_blank">http://halflife2.filefront.com/file/;75419</a>

StixNStonz

Even though i'd love it to be, theres no way this will be in 3.2 final, unless it really caught their eye in b2 and they're waiting on b3 before they talk to me. A more realistic possibility would be for me to release a fully polished version (imo b3), and then see if i can put it through the 'proper channels' to be considered for official. But i doubt that could happen before 3.2 final.

Kouji_San

I'm still not sure what the proper channels are. Nemisis_Zero or puzl? Or can one even send it to the almight Flayra

RoCity

like some of the rooms, but having 4 different levels in some rooms is to much. I wouldnt play it if it was official. To clustured, to much fake doors.

Some rooms with 2 levels look really nice, something we dont see in good ns maps.

- Port shaft is wow huge
- A room with only water doesnt really work :/
- To big

This is my feedback after running abit through the map.

StixNStonz

Just to tell you, the H2O tanks (the rooms with the water) have a weldable nearby that lowers the water in both, making them both siege rooms for their respective hives. The water stops that and also gives aliens a slight advantage, in the room directly beside the hives.

StixNStonz

Some people still hold that the map is *unacceptably* complex. To me, there are maps like Lucid and Metal which have rather basic routes with a few vent crossovers, and then there are maps like Hera, Agora and Achio with much more intricate networks. Looking at Nexus b3 (with the simplifications), it really isnt that crazy, but the high-middle-hive dynamic adds to the feeling of complexity. The original intention of Nexus was to be on the higher-end of acceptably complex maps. Whether there is warrant to all the whining of it being *unacceptably complex* is another question, but I still hear it.

I've considered ways to help this. But, the middle hive has to stay where it is.

One idea was to make the unlabelled minimap have the vents, but the labelled minimap NOT. As such, 'newer' players (hence those using the labels) wont have the added clutter of the vents. And those who know the map better and dont want the clutter of area names, can also see the intricate vent system. Thoughts?

The bottom middle of the map, Engineering Halls, is another area peopel have complained about. It needs to have a roughly 30 second runtime between the two hives. Compound that with the fact that it connects the two weldable sieges (H2O tanks). Thats why the Halls have their design like they do. So...

One idea would be to space out the map; basically stretch it horizontally. The View Halls would be about twice the distance from each other, but rines calling for meds from there would have the comm actually come right over them from the call. In the current version, this is the only real problem area for the comm, as he will see Chromo Hive and have to go to the side.

The entire map would be shifted away from the middle north-south line. This would be a huge amount of work, but could potentially 'clean up' the minimap for all you whiners <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />. Engineering Halls could also have its Halls no longer overlapping; but keep in mind, in b2 and b3, the overlap isn't an issue for the comm since half the floor is a func_seethrough (hence the comm can med the bottom, and half of the top... which is plenty).

Its an idea, and I'm not really sure how it would actually pan out.

CarNagE1

I made a litle walktrough your map it's nice, many colorfull lights, nice orginal architecture. in that engine hive with big beam machine add some cables on celing and maybe a console it would be a nice touch. near that room is a coridor down with ultra bright blue light computers there on wall are blending in, maybe change that light. In the butom of your map you have a nice glassed bridge i was getting stuck there...

Garo

Played one round on a big server, which ended for marine victory.

Critical problems:

- Onos gets stuck in multiple places (in hive areas). Generally not an onos friendly map (too narrow passages etc)
- Complex as hell, so it needs much more training than "normal" map.
- Got stuck multiple times at the two hollow tunnels which are under the 3rd hive.
- Marines can siege 3rd hive area from those hollow tunnels (ppl said that the sieges could not reach hive though)


Other things:
I like the big vertical differences, but Im not sure how they fit in ns. Double resnode is cool though, but I dont know about the hive which is at the top of the map.

Some people also said that the map is a big ugly. The map got me into a confusion. I like the verticality, but I think the map is too much in different vertical levels. I also like complex maps, but I think the map is too complex. One reason might be that there are too much similar looking areas, so you don't immediatelly know where you are by just looking around.

Still, I find some potential in your map =)

- Garo

amckern

Added to the CustomFactor Map Cycle

Edit, chose to put it on this weeks instead

hl1://203.98.89.154:27015

StixNStonz

Thanks for the replies, guys! I'd especially love help with fixing the dilemma. I want to stay away from 'dumbing down' the map too much, by keeping certain parts relatively intact, such as:
-the vent system
-hive layout , i.e. the A-format, with a hive in the middle and high up (though general distances can be changed)
-the shafts (i'll mention these in a min)

An idea I had, posted in detail above, would be to spread out the map horizontally. An area that has causes confusion is Engineering Halls, as they are mirror images of each other, partially over each other, have a crazy weldable in the vents, a strange door and two watered-in siege locations. They were designed as such on paper way beforehand, to have appropriate runtimes between the two siege rooms (we dont need a Processing Siege again, ever).

The tightness of the area is innate it its design, which is why im thinking of spreading the map. If that were done, there could be enough room for a full new room, rather than the crazy Halls currently in there. (playtesters have said that once you understand them, there's nothing to them, and they're awesome... but people shouldnt get that confused at first).

This would also (possibly) spread out the View Halls, those glass hallways in the middle of the map, directly under (and way under) Chromosynthesis Hive. By being spread out, i might be able to give them significantly better commander-sight, as right now, a med call to those halls brings a comm to Chromo, and he has to move to the side to med.

The rest of the map could likely spread out with little noticeable difference, and the runtimes should still be more than optimal. Its just that it could take awhile.

Any thoughts? Would this help solve the Eternal Issue with nexus, its complexity?

amckern

Fisrt of all thank you for making such a good map - after about 5 days of people avoiding the vote for nexus, it is now one of the most common maps played on CustomFactor, even taking away from Stargate-nsa, and stargate-xt9.

There are some things that i would like to see:

The engine hives are good on detail, but they lack 'something'

If your a gorg, or skulk, you have to go the long way to get out of the lower areas around the engine hives, and can be a real pain if your on one hive, and have jet packs roaming around on top of the engines.

A better way to get to double, i played the map 5 times, and only found double once - and that was by acident

The halls that lead to the lift shaft from the top hive are just a littile to short, oni get stuck on the light fittings when you are standing.

The weld points are plenty, and do what they are ment to do

Other then these issues, made by comment from the community, and my self the map is well made, and functions well - please by all means send me a pm if you want any community testing made on a near complete, or revesied nexus before b3 final.

Adam

BigD

I just downloaded it and had a quick run around. I quite like the basic "A" layout, I'm a fan of innovation! Have yet to see how it plays. I won't lie to you though: this map reminds me of tanith and origin, which is a style I'm not a huge fan of. (I think it's the cement looking teckwall textures...) But that's probably just me, and don't let that stop you. (This is my personal taste disclaimer!)

Some points I made note of based on my first run through:<ul><li>I ran past those lifts about 3 or 4 times. I knew that I had to go up to get to the hive, but in my running around, I just didn't look up in those rooms and didn't notice the switches. I had to spawn that hive and work my way out from it to figure out how to get to that hive. Something to lead the eyes upward in those shafts would be great. Something to make it obvious that you need to go up, that these are lifts.</li><li>Vents are very dark and hard to find your way around them. </li><li>Lighting needs more contrast*. More spot lights. </li><li>Exits and entrances should be lit up a bit better in some areas. This was one of the huge improvements made to machina from early versions, as light leads the eyes to where you want to go, is my theory. This could make it seem a bit less confusing as people can see where they need to go. (Look up from a map, don't see the door, scratch head, look at map, look for door, look at map, scratch head, walk three steps forward, see door, "ohh okay...", goto next room, repeat) <- I'm exagerating, obviously, but that's my theory anyway.</li><li>The area below the hive, IMO should probably be deleted or moved out from under it as it adds to the confusion. (I'm in the hive comm, there isn't anything here!) Maybe a bit of a gap around the bottom of the hive too. At first look, I thought I could get to it from the area between the bottom hives by going straight up... somehow. By moving (or removing) the area below the hive, you might be able to have that gap to force people who first see the map to look to the sides of the center hive for the entrances.</li><li>Maybe a bit more consistency in your texturing, lighting and/or architecture. I dunno, this is hard to describe, but each room should be different, yet familiar. Find something that you've done in the map that you like, and try to apply it to areas that you don't like as much. I'm not saying eclipse level of theming, but look at some other maps, and find something that is similar between their rooms. Hera makes great use of the eclipse textures, yet the architecture is all quite distinct. Maybe you've done this, but consider this comment equated to amckerns "...it lacks something..." comment, just applied to the map overall.</li><li>Maybe open up some hallways. Widen them or raise the roof. Keep in mind the 10v10 and up games... this might have the added benefit of less claustrophobia and less confusion.</li></ul>*By contrast, I don't mean more bright and dark, I mean less grey in between. Texture lights make an entire room glow one colour with a wide spread between bright and dark, but a few spot lights can break it up. Some colours just dominate the area too much, flooding the area. Look for a colour that offsets the "fill" colour. White mixes with anything. The changes to the origin remake show this greatly. Beta6 of origin was worse than nexus in this regard, but the final version I'd say, while similar to, is a couple notches better than nexus now.

Minimap suggestions:<ul><li>Clean it up a bit, there are areas that you can walk off the "map" to get to another room. The generated minimap is always a bit gross in that regard, as I'm sure you're aware.</li><li>Don't put borders on the vents. In fact, do like the official maps and make them a purple colour. Consistency in interface makes it easier to learn. </li><li>Put a border around the center hive's room right through to the lifts to suggest that the areas are connected and the area below the hive is not. The areas south of the hive on the map should similarly appear to be not connected to the hive.</li><li>DO NOT remove the vents from the labelled version you make! Follow my suggestions above and the minimap will be fine!</li></ul>
Anyway, that's about all I can think of. Good luck!

StixNStonz

Some great feedback <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

Im back into mapping again, and ive put a lot of work into beta 4 of Nexus. It'll still be another week at least, but its rolling along beautifully. So far, i've taken the View Halls (glass hallways underneath the middle hive) and spread them out, so they're no longer actually underneath. This has had a huge effect on the rest of the map, which all has to be spread out, fixed up, and balanced. Because of the spread, you can no longer siege the middle hive from the Shafts (as was originally intended), so i've made new siege areas for the middle hive. I'm also going to redesign Engineering Halls... make them more open, less symmetrical, and easier to navigate. I'll also move the RT there further north, to bring the bottom hives 'closer' to the rest of the map <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

Double won't change much though; Its meant to be slightly more isolated than the other single nodes. It has to be. Think of how double on Tanith is isolated (theres not much nearby), as it should be. In Nexus, its the same, but its not in the middle of the map like Tanith's. It still has 3 main entrances though, and 2 vent entrances, so its not like its inaccessible <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />

But yeah, the next Nexus may very well solve just about every non-visual issue people have had. I'll post a test of it here, if anyone would be so kind to give it a run-through to check for further issues/visuals.

Merkaba

cool stuff : )

StixNStonz

lol, k, i just completely tore out one of the Shafts. Felt that two was a bit too unbalancing/confusing for the middle hive. I'm in the process of replacing it with a completely new area: its a siege location, rt location, and very crazy architecture location. And by that, i mean a three/four tiered ramproom. Lets hope it comes out alright.

Im definitely excited about how the idea is turning out! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

Kassinger

I've played this map on the VH2 servers sometime in February (hardly played NS since then), so I can't remember enough to give specific feedback. But I enjoyed the map and it's original leveling and complexity, even though it was very confusing, and being new to most of the players, gameplay suffered.

I see you've got a lot of feedback on issues, and look forward to your next version of it. I'd love to go playtest this map more, but sadly I won't have a chance/time to play NS before sometime in April.

Hope this map comes so far as to be official sometime, I trust you'll be able to resolve most issues.

amckern

Customfactor will be more then happy to server the map for people to play, and even though your ping may suffer, your more then glad to come and play it on something like SNL, or a normal every day rotation.

StixNStonz

I was thinking... With NS being balanced for smaller servers than I-AM and Guns, what if someone scaled up the number of resnodes in the maps? (idea spawned from another post, tbh)

I'm thinking of releasing two versions of the next Nexus. The first will the be normal one; Nexus is getting some phenomenal updates (no more rooms-over-rooms, an entirely new section, no more confusion, a better minimap, etc).

But on top of that (that'll be ns_nexus_b4), im thinking of releasing an ns_nexus_b4big. This would be the same version, with probably either 14 or 16 res nodes. It would only take a recompile with a few more entities, yet it could significantly change the gameplay on bigger servers.

What do you guys think?

StixNStonz

I would love some feedback on the flow of the map. Specifically the weldable door right outside of MS (where you have to weld it from the otherside).

Im thinking of turning this into a button door (with either buttons on both sides, or just one on the marine side). THis weldable was just like the old Hera's Cargo weldable; you had to run around to get it from behind. Hera's was removed, and the flow of the map greatly improved; im thinking Nexus needs the same. This opens up access to both of the view halls, which in themselves give much better access to the map for marines.

I'd love feedback on this. Also, should the door have buttons on both sides? or just on the MS side? I'll make the decision myself, but i'd love some opinions.