Can We Do Something about Ridiculous Gorge Tunnel Locations?
BobRossTheBoss
Join Date: 2012-12-31 Member: 176824Members
Join Date: 2012-12-31 Member: 176824Members
Such as these:
You can place a gorge tunnel in any vent that is wider than normal, such as the server-platform vent. On some maps you can also put them in places where the vent turns and there is more space, such as the extraction-smelting vent. Like the cargo example, you can also place them in high up places that are hard for marines to see, let alone attack. Many of these locations are not accessible to marines until they get jetpacks, yet gorge tunnels are a 1 hive upgrade.
This is most definitely definitely asymmetrical, but I would hardly consider it balanced for the alien team to be able to place secret tunnels which are inaccessible to marines until a prototype lab is built. Perhaps disallow gorge tunnels in vents and root out problem areas like the one in cargo. Or, in the most extreme case, limit gorge tunnels to places where there is infestation.
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/630782139749182983/6D52E76D219461B5CF3AB83FB9074D300498C585/1024x768.resizedimage
http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/630782139749184613/EA4B498750DCAEFD40168B6F2F5BE060F953AD0B/
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/630782139749180815/A422EC0CA67E812AFF3E14C402D109647709DABE/ (marine view)
You can place a gorge tunnel in any vent that is wider than normal, such as the server-platform vent. On some maps you can also put them in places where the vent turns and there is more space, such as the extraction-smelting vent. Like the cargo example, you can also place them in high up places that are hard for marines to see, let alone attack. Many of these locations are not accessible to marines until they get jetpacks, yet gorge tunnels are a 1 hive upgrade.
This is most definitely definitely asymmetrical, but I would hardly consider it balanced for the alien team to be able to place secret tunnels which are inaccessible to marines until a prototype lab is built. Perhaps disallow gorge tunnels in vents and root out problem areas like the one in cargo. Or, in the most extreme case, limit gorge tunnels to places where there is infestation.
Comments
"It's raining babblers!"
Aliens lost the MC's of NS1 and this is the replacement in NS2.....a tunnel that both sides can use...they already have enough of a down side and limited use.
That you can hide them in some hard to get places is one of their few up sides....even then they are only safe until marines get JP's or GL's (and notice aliens appearing).
Its not exactly cheap to place them up there...you have to go gorge...place it...then either sneak back as gorge or devolve and then re-evolve to place the other end.
I always took it that the ability to hide them was their selling point...given they can be used by marines.
Why exactly is vent placement forbidden in the ENSL?
Risks of these supposedly ridiculous gorge tunnels:
-Harder to achieve.
-Potentially costs evolving gorge twice.
-Not accessible by gorges or onos from at least one entrance, possible two.
-Possible for onos not be able to use being unable to exit. E.g. a vent.
-Potentially awkward to get in and out of because of space constraints.
Benefits of these supposedly ridiculous gorge tunnels:
-Easier to hide.
-Hard for marines to access.
Also risks being inside obs range.
seen in http://forums.unknownworlds.com/discussion/130472/rework-gorge-tunnel-hitbox-or-modelanimation#latest
It took me about 15 minutes to find all of those locations and more in refinery, which shows the amount of thought required to figure out gorge tunnel locations. Clog climbing allows gorges to get into all kinds of vents, as does the ability to evolve in certain vents (which you usually can if a tunnel can fit in the location). So none of these locations are inaccessible to gorges if they know how to play.
The problem is the fact that aliens are able to place what are essentially forward offensive phasegates in possibly unknown, difficult to access areas very early in the game, and the marines' best counter to them does not come until much later in the game. It gets even more difficult to attack them once aliens actually start popping out on the marines trying to attack the tunnels (which is what they should be doing). This is most likely the reason tunnels are banned from vents in competitive play.
There's still the problem that the thing should be spitting out aliens as soon as you try to attack it. Fighting aliens in vents is not fun.
It is _very_ complicated to place a good tunnel in a forward position, and if you let a gorge clog in a forward position near marine base for a longer time to get that all up, well then you deserve that. It costs that gorge more res then the marines to counter, so its not an issue and can be easily stopped, especially from marines that look sometimes at the map where the aliens are running around.
-Harder to achieve.
-Potentially costs evolving gorge twice.
-Not accessible by gorges or onos from at least one entrance, possible two.
-Possible for onos not be able to use being unable to exit. E.g. a vent.
-Potentially awkward to get in and out of because of space constraints.
-Potentially could take too much time to clog to odd location to place tunnel.
Benefits of these supposedly ridiculous gorge tunnels:
-Easier to hide.
-Hard for marines to access.
It takes you 15 minutes to find them, even longer to place them as a gorge. It may not be incredibly complicated but it is harder to achieve than just placing it in the middle of a room.
Adding time to the Risks of these supposedly ridiculous gorge tunnels.
Yes a gorge can get into all sorts of weird locations with clog stacking, which a skilled gorge does better than a non skilled gorge. It also takes long enough that a marine should be a able to scout it.
Why yes if you know how to play it is not difficult. Thanks for pointing that out.
Fighting aliens in vents is not fun? Most of the time I don't think it is. Killing rt's is not much fun but is a huge part of the game. Fighting an onos 1v1 or 2v1 or even 3v1 and losing is not much fun but happens all the time. Not to mention all the other odd ball little things of the game that are not much fun. It is probably fun for the aliens...
(thankfully it does say vents, and I will lookup the wording before matches hehe for some other lovely places)
not a no brained... as with everything else in the game, situational. vent access effectively makes it a one way tunnel for some gorges. makes the vent a killing floor if people know where it is. I'd rather make two hive connections than vent tunnels.
A perfect example is Docking and Terminal. A skulk can make his way across the map almost entirely in vents, on the west side, directly over Terminal (which can be marine base). A GT drop above the south entrance is invulnerable and invisible for a very long time. It's the marine equivalent of dropping a PG at the hive, but no alien can reach it, see it, or attack it until Tier 2 hive abilities.
Although I still like these awesome gorge tunnel spots and I think they are fun... that there is a logic I can understand.