FlaterectomyNetherlandistanJoin Date: 2005-02-03Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
No changelog or progress video for now, as I'm back in the hospital for a few days, but I did indeed texture the whole map (save for a few accidentally skipped faces - mostly in vents) to get it ready for the coming NSL season.
Played it a couple rounds today. Seems a bit marine biased at the moment, so A couple of suggestions to help:
1. Add a vent or hallway to the lower left hand corner of Central Processing. As it stands now, if you stand in that corner, you get easy covering of the only two entrances to the room, making it easier for marines. Having a third flank point might open it up just enough.
2. Upper sewer, if held by aliens, can be sniped from across the room. In a marine
3. Generator spawn is a bit rough. There's a LONG distance that must be cysted in order to achieve 2 res nodes and even a second hive.
honestly aliens win more times in this map that marines, for all the times i play
We play PUG's on this map, and it's been 100% marine wins for the 4 games I watched, and it was all centered around the 2 res tech point being rushed by marines, and seemingly easily held. Once that is held, it's quick-ish access to all alien nodes.
It is possible it's because no one knows how to play aliens, but from what I saw, all teams were competent players. It was the same story each time.
FlaterectomyNetherlandistanJoin Date: 2005-02-03Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
edited September 2013
In my experience testing the map (this is in pubs), until recent builds I mostly encountered alien wins, and marines are starting to win more regularly these days. This is quite anecdotal, so I was hoping to go to ns2stats.org and see more accurate data, but the domain appears to be for sale. Oops, seems they moved to ns2stats.com. Though, even if we run ns2stats on our server, Caged is not listed. Guess there might be settings to set and configs to configure or something.
Pre Reinforced a single babblered gorge with a skulk and some commander help could hold the center relatively easy, with the marines just suiciding constantly. a prevalent strategy seen on our games on Caged. Progression up the right side of the map has always been hard for marines, generator isn't the best frontier base making it a horribly long stretch assaulting the next base, and sewer is hard to pass without getting eaten, so effectively marines got stuck.
Reinforced just shuffled the deck. The Gorgeous strategies no longer work and just like last patch it'll take weeks to settle.
Right now the only way a gorge survives early game is with plenty of cover you can circle, which the center doesn't have, or supporting skulks from far back, who generally don't feel like hanging around in one spot for too long.
I just published a new build of Caged on the Workshop. I based these changes on feedback I got from watching and talking to Teamwork & Tactics and Quaxy, who played a PCW on it yesterday---I recorded the match, and will upload it to YouTube tomorrow. Hopefully these changes help aliens a bit.
CHANGELOG [6th of september 2013]
o Once again added the Central Processing backdoor from Ventilation Access
o Moved the power node in Central Processing to its old location north of the stairs
o Added random-ass containers to Generator and the east corridor next to Central Processing as LOS blockers, and some pipes near the Purification power node
o Changed the Sewer -> Lower Sewer vent entrance
o Changed the Ventilation -> Purification vent entrance
o Changed the Central Processing -> Ventilation Access vent entrance
o Added a new vent exit from Generator -> Stability
o Made more geometry 'commander invisible' for an easier overview
I've had to wing the LOS blockers, as I had no feedback on which specific areas are affected.
And in defense of Generator spawn [See the concerns with generator in the ENSL thread], while I admit it's a longer walking distance (measured by regular marine walking time) from Central Processing (30/31 seconds as opposed to 25/29 seconds from Sewer and Ventilation), travel time to the far and close RTs (each hive has one far and one close expansion RT) is comparable to the other hives, and it's the same amount of cysts as the other hives as well.
The new vent exit from Generator into Stability will reduce skulk travel time via that route towards Monitoring and Central Processing as well.
Please continue giving me feedback based on your plays.
FlaterectomyNetherlandistanJoin Date: 2005-02-03Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
But wait! There's more! Legendary Snails and RadicaL had a go as well. Both videos contain an apology to the viewer, because I'm still a newbie broadcaster of these things. Derp.
FlaterectomyNetherlandistanJoin Date: 2005-02-03Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
Small update for today's map test.
CHANGELOG [8th of september 2013]
o Moved Monitoring resource node to Stability
o Plopped a container in Central Processing for cover
o Added vents in the corridors west and east of Central Processing
FlaterectomyNetherlandistanJoin Date: 2005-02-03Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
edited September 2013
Aaand another update. Things are getting daily here.
CHANGELOG [9th of september 2013]
o Fixed lack of Commander Invisible ceiling geometry in Central Processing
o Altered Ventilation hive's exit towards Shipping Tunnels to reduce LOS into the hive
FlaterectomyNetherlandistanJoin Date: 2005-02-03Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
edited September 2013
Another update, though the workshop seems to be broken or something. It tells me it published successfully, but I cannot get the map to load on the SCC server, and the map is missing from my local workshop folder entirely. Hope to get it fixed before tonight's map testing session.
CHANGELOG [15th of september 2013]
o Made Central Processing a single res node location
o Detailed the Upper Sewer-side exit of Satan's Butthole
o Re-greyboxed and then re-textured Upper Sewer
o Added some more cover throughout the entire map
EDIT: Still borked. Publishing's successful, but the state of the mod keeps switching between 'Downloading 0%' and 'Unavailable' in the Mods menu.
EDIT #2: I give up for the day. Tried publishing it as separate mod, and that didn't work either. I'm afraid Caged is broken and doesn't work because of this, but the frustration with the Workshop has just gotten to me today, and I will fix it at some later date or something.
FlaterectomyNetherlandistanJoin Date: 2005-02-03Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
Thanks for the info Polini.
Luckily, I have good news. I somehow fixed Caged, and it should work again.
I was wondering if it was a problem with my map rather than the Workshop, so I made a quick test map, replaced the contents of my Output folder with those, and published. This was successful and it downloaded the test map normally. I then replaced the test map with the real Caged files again, published, and suddenly it worked. I don't know if I fixed a corrupt file or something, or whether they fixed a Workshop issue, but the map should be playable again. Huzzah!
Comments
EDIT: Ugh, workshop agreement.
Full steam ahead! : D
1. Add a vent or hallway to the lower left hand corner of Central Processing. As it stands now, if you stand in that corner, you get easy covering of the only two entrances to the room, making it easier for marines. Having a third flank point might open it up just enough.
2. Upper sewer, if held by aliens, can be sniped from across the room. In a marine
3. Generator spawn is a bit rough. There's a LONG distance that must be cysted in order to achieve 2 res nodes and even a second hive.
I thinks that its not because of a layout just generally balance issues and no worked out tactics on the map yet for marines
We play PUG's on this map, and it's been 100% marine wins for the 4 games I watched, and it was all centered around the 2 res tech point being rushed by marines, and seemingly easily held. Once that is held, it's quick-ish access to all alien nodes.
It is possible it's because no one knows how to play aliens, but from what I saw, all teams were competent players. It was the same story each time.
Reinforced just shuffled the deck. The Gorgeous strategies no longer work and just like last patch it'll take weeks to settle.
Right now the only way a gorge survives early game is with plenty of cover you can circle, which the center doesn't have, or supporting skulks from far back, who generally don't feel like hanging around in one spot for too long.
I just published a new build of Caged on the Workshop. I based these changes on feedback I got from watching and talking to Teamwork & Tactics and Quaxy, who played a PCW on it yesterday---I recorded the match, and will upload it to YouTube tomorrow. Hopefully these changes help aliens a bit.
CHANGELOG [6th of september 2013]
o Once again added the Central Processing backdoor from Ventilation Access
o Moved the power node in Central Processing to its old location north of the stairs
o Added random-ass containers to Generator and the east corridor next to Central Processing as LOS blockers, and some pipes near the Purification power node
o Changed the Sewer -> Lower Sewer vent entrance
o Changed the Ventilation -> Purification vent entrance
o Changed the Central Processing -> Ventilation Access vent entrance
o Added a new vent exit from Generator -> Stability
o Made more geometry 'commander invisible' for an easier overview
I've had to wing the LOS blockers, as I had no feedback on which specific areas are affected.
And in defense of Generator spawn [See the concerns with generator in the ENSL thread], while I admit it's a longer walking distance (measured by regular marine walking time) from Central Processing (30/31 seconds as opposed to 25/29 seconds from Sewer and Ventilation), travel time to the far and close RTs (each hive has one far and one close expansion RT) is comparable to the other hives, and it's the same amount of cysts as the other hives as well.
The new vent exit from Generator into Stability will reduce skulk travel time via that route towards Monitoring and Central Processing as well.
Please continue giving me feedback based on your plays.
EDIT: No love for clan abbreviations.
Round 1 of 2:
Round 2 of 2:
Anyway, map is looking really good.
Round 1 of 2:
Round 2 of 2:
CHANGELOG [8th of september 2013]
o Moved Monitoring resource node to Stability
o Plopped a container in Central Processing for cover
o Added vents in the corridors west and east of Central Processing
CHANGELOG [9th of september 2013]
o Fixed lack of Commander Invisible ceiling geometry in Central Processing
o Altered Ventilation hive's exit towards Shipping Tunnels to reduce LOS into the hive
CHANGELOG [15th of september 2013]
o Made Central Processing a single res node location
o Detailed the Upper Sewer-side exit of Satan's Butthole
o Re-greyboxed and then re-textured Upper Sewer
o Added some more cover throughout the entire map
EDIT: Still borked. Publishing's successful, but the state of the mod keeps switching between 'Downloading 0%' and 'Unavailable' in the Mods menu.
EDIT #2: I give up for the day. Tried publishing it as separate mod, and that didn't work either. I'm afraid Caged is broken and doesn't work because of this, but the frustration with the Workshop has just gotten to me today, and I will fix it at some later date or something.
Same problem.
Luckily, I have good news. I somehow fixed Caged, and it should work again.
I was wondering if it was a problem with my map rather than the Workshop, so I made a quick test map, replaced the contents of my Output folder with those, and published. This was successful and it downloaded the test map normally. I then replaced the test map with the real Caged files again, published, and suddenly it worked. I don't know if I fixed a corrupt file or something, or whether they fixed a Workshop issue, but the map should be playable again. Huzzah!