Spyware...for Those Who Care.

AntiuniverseAntiuniverse Join Date: 2004-02-10 Member: 26369Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Xfire, apparently to be a part of NS</div>Disclaimer: I "figured this out" on my own, and I could very well be wrong. This was my experience.

That was fast. In the 20 minutes from when I first saw the post on Planet Half-Life, I became interested, <i>read the license agreement</i> (apparently not closely enough...), tried Xfire, discovered it was spyware-infested and promptly cleaned it up.

Shortly after installing Xfire, I found myself unable to load several web pages, and when they did load, it was with extreme latency. Then I started spontaneously losing connection in games of HL. Paranoia detectors went off and I skimmed the Xfire program directory for an install log. Read on...

First, the good news:
It seems to uninstall cleanly without any tricks or tools.

The gritty details (I'm no expert...on spyware):
When you run the Xfire installer, at the end of the install process, it silently forks another installer executable...seems to be from Ultimate Arena, who I never trusted after seeing their button suddenly appear in one version of All-Seeing Eye.

The UA installer takes the liberty of adding its own LSP (layered service provider) DLL to your Winsock LSP chain, a file located by default in C:\WINDOWS\system32\ua_lsp.dll.

IMPORTANT: I AM NOT SUGGESTING YOU DELETE THIS FILE IF YOU HAVE IT. Doing so will almost certainly break your internet connection. Such is dirty nasty spyware. Leave it alone and uninstall Xfire, and cross your fingers. The LSP was gone after an uninstall and a reboot for me. A lucky break.

Extra details, corrections or feedback more than welcome.

Comments

  • OG17OG17 Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2024Members
    This is already discussed in the release thread, and it doesn't seem that anyone else had such a problem. Also, if you weren't aware, UA makes the program; it's not like it's smuggling someone else in with it.
  • ThreshThresh Chief Gaming Officer, Ultimate Arena Join Date: 2004-02-10 Member: 26368Members
    Xfire is absolutely NOT spyware. It is an Instant messenger for gamers. It's a mix between ICQ & All-Seeing Eye. With Xfire, you can see who, what, when, and where your friends are playing online for over 75 games:

    It's been featured in front page articles by:
    -IGN (http://pc.ign.com/articles/463/463362p1.html?fromint=1)
    -1up.com (http://www.1up.com/article2/0,4364,1518169,00.asp),
    -File of the week" by Download.com. (http://download.com.com/2001-2012-0.html?tag=dir)
    -Firingsquad (http://www.firingsquad.com/games/xfire_overview/)
    -etc.

    Xfire features:
    “Who” – Xfire looks like an IM client that shows a list of just your gamer friends, and friends of your friends who play games. Unlike most IM apps, Xfire alerts you when you receive incoming messages without disrupting your game.

    “What” – Xfire shows you what game your friend is playing, whether it’s BF1942, Everquest, Starcraft, or 75 other top games.

    “When” – Xfire is a tray application that changes color whenever your friends start playing online.

    “Where” – Xfire shows you the game server, ping time, map, player list, etc. and lets you join your friend’s game with just one click.

    Xfire is simply a tool to make it easier to play with your friends. Steam has similar features, but it only works for Valve games. Xfire is for those gamers who play more than just Valve games. It's completely free, and the download is less than 500k. There are over 70,000 gamers on Xfire already, and counting. It is being bundled with a lot of other games as well, which you will be seeing in the coming weeks.

    I don't understand where the confusion is coming from that Xfire is spyware, but I promise you that it is absolutely NOT spyware and never will be.

    Dennis "Thresh" Fong

    Chief Gaming Officer, Ultimate Arena (creators of Xfire)
  • OG17OG17 Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2024Members
    Maybe you should have read the post and addressed his problem instead of pasting your earlier reply. Just saying.
  • ThreshThresh Chief Gaming Officer, Ultimate Arena Join Date: 2004-02-10 Member: 26368Members
    edited February 2004
    The installer does run a program which installs what's called an LSP, which does plug into the Winsock chain of data. Xfire uses this to detect which game servers you connect to, so your friends can join you in a game. Here's how it works:

    You run Xfire, then launch an online game, for example Halo. When you connect to a game server, the LSP sees this, and tells the Xfire client "We're playing Halo on the game server at 192.168.25.59 port 7777" (for example). The Xfire client then sends this data to an Xfire server which sends the data to your friends. Your friends' Xfire clients show this information. If your friend hits the Join button, then Halo is launching using command line parameters to join your game server at 192.168.25.59 port 7777.

    Xfire looks at your network connections only for games, and then it only looks at WHO you connect to, so your friends can join you. It never looks at the actual data you send or receive.

    There are a few programs that install LSPs that have problems when another LSP is installed, such as an old version of Zone Alarm, as well as some spyware LSPs. You should remove these, as they can cause you to have network problems when you have another LSP installed, whether it's the Xfire LSP or anything else.
  • Brad_RBrad_R pandas | brad Join Date: 2002-11-12 Member: 8273Members, Constellation
  • PlasmaPlasma Join Date: 2003-04-26 Member: 15855Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
    Ive recently been getting lag pauses (upto 30 seconds) in NS - Is this whats causing it? I have the thing installed right now (although I find it useless).

    Ill try uninstalling it, sounds dodgy!
  • AntiuniverseAntiuniverse Join Date: 2004-02-10 Member: 26369Members
    edited February 2004
    Well, I said corrections were welcome, and I'm glad I got one. If what you say is true, I sincerely apologize for slandering a program that seemed like a brilliant idea at a glance. It's just that between the instability and the fact that LSPs are so often spyware elements that are notorious for breaking your system's internet connectivity, I jumped to an apparently incorrect conclusion.

    I wasn't kidding when I said the paranoia detectors went off. Slightly off-topic, the subject of LSPs and the way you went about doing this fascinates me...an amateur software developer. I really do appreciate the thorough reply and explanation. and for what it's worth, I'd already checked and ensured that my LSP chain was "kosher," by using Cexx.org's LSPFix.exe. I suppose it was just bad luck, although it happened to another friend of mine as well.

    Even more off-topic...I had no idea you were associated with UA, Thresh. I'd never looked into it. You're a legend. :D

    - not afraid to admit I was wrong, assuming I was wrong. Crono.
  • ShadowcatShadowcat Join Date: 2003-01-18 Member: 12443Members
    Good thing I clicked no and then deleted the installer for that strange program.
  • Mr_HeadcrabMr_Headcrab Squee&#33;~ Join Date: 2002-11-20 Member: 9392Members, Constellation
    edited February 2004
    EDIT: After reviewing as much data as i could about Xfire, Im doing my own spyware check right now...


    EDIT^2: After an extensive battery of tests, Xfire seems clean, I personally will not use it yet, but i wont stop anyone else from using it, I apologize for my outburst earlier.
  • l3igDl3igD Join Date: 2003-11-20 Member: 23262Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-Plasma+Feb 10 2004, 11:05 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Plasma @ Feb 10 2004, 11:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ive recently been getting lag pauses (upto 30 seconds) in NS - Is this whats causing it? I have the thing installed right now (although I find it useless).

    Ill try uninstalling it, sounds dodgy! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I get this to...IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH BETA3 ive been getting this every since i dled beta2...i just though it was my comp...
  • TychoQuadTychoQuad Join Date: 2003-10-09 Member: 21540Members
    edited February 2004
    Something that's important to me with tools like this is appearance. xFire's is horrible. Steam doesn't exactly have the nicest looking interface, but at least it's neat. Advertising on the main page with icons clipping into text is definitely not a good look. Neither is banners which take up the top quarter of the buddylist. You seem to have functionality down pat, I suggest you tidy up the programs visual aspect a bit more. You may be surprised how many more downloads you get. I mean seriously, after seeing those screens, I have no desire to download this app.
  • crono1crono1 Join Date: 2004-01-20 Member: 25497Members, Constellation
    ROFL. After taking a look at the interface.. I'll stick to using IRC and STEAM to find out where my buddies are gaming, tbqfh.
  • CommunistWithAGunCommunistWithAGun Local Propaganda Guy Join Date: 2003-04-30 Member: 15953Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-Antiuniverse+Feb 10 2004, 10:15 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Antiuniverse @ Feb 10 2004, 10:15 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Disclaimer: I "figured this out" on my own, and I could very well be wrong. This was my experience.

    That was fast. In the 20 minutes from when I first saw the post on Planet Half-Life, I became interested, <i>read the license agreement</i> (apparently not closely enough...), tried Xfire, discovered it was spyware-infested and promptly cleaned it up.

    Shortly after installing Xfire, I found myself unable to load several web pages, and when they did load, it was with extreme latency. Then I started spontaneously losing connection in games of HL. Paranoia detectors went off and I skimmed the Xfire program directory for an install log. Read on...

    First, the good news:
    It seems to uninstall cleanly without any tricks or tools.

    The gritty details (I'm no expert...on spyware):
    When you run the Xfire installer, at the end of the install process, it silently forks another installer executable...seems to be from Ultimate Arena, who I never trusted after seeing their button suddenly appear in one version of All-Seeing Eye.

    The UA installer takes the liberty of adding its own LSP (layered service provider) DLL to your Winsock LSP chain, a file located by default in C:\WINDOWS\system32\ua_lsp.dll.

    IMPORTANT: I AM NOT SUGGESTING YOU DELETE THIS FILE IF YOU HAVE IT. Doing so will almost certainly break your internet connection. Such is dirty nasty spyware. Leave it alone and uninstall Xfire, and cross your fingers. The LSP was gone after an uninstall and a reboot for me. A lucky break.

    Extra details, corrections or feedback more than welcome. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I think this topic should be deleted before the ignorance goes any farther.



    I am really tired of people expecting everything for nothing. Even if it were spyware I'd say this because Flayra has the option to MAKE A LIVING SOMEHOW.
  • OlmyOlmy Join Date: 2003-05-08 Member: 16142Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, NS2 Developer, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond
    Spyware is devious though. You didn't ask for it, and it normally is in the very fine small print. Ad aware 6 is your friend.
  • DocWhoDocWho Join Date: 2003-08-25 Member: 20187Members
    It should be noted that despite the fact spyware was included, it is hardly the worst kind, and as far as I can tell, completly optional, unlike it's STEAM counterpart, STEAM. I know they removed the spyware featues, but Valve can restore it when ever they want, read the EUAL.
  • SupernornSupernorn Best. Picture. Ever. Made. Ever. Join Date: 2002-11-07 Member: 7608Members, Constellation
    Hmm..Xfire sounds interesting, But I can just use Steam friends to find what my friends are playing, where they are, and for PMing.

    If Steam keeps screwing around with the Friends network (like shutting it down every week for "maintenence") then Xfire will become slightly more appealing to me.

    <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
  • EpidemicEpidemic Dark Force Gorge Join Date: 2003-06-29 Member: 17781Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-CommunistWithAGun+Feb 11 2004, 12:38 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CommunistWithAGun @ Feb 11 2004, 12:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Antiuniverse+Feb 10 2004, 10:15 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Antiuniverse @ Feb 10 2004, 10:15 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Disclaimer: I "figured this out" on my own, and I could very well be wrong. This was my experience.

    That was fast. In the 20 minutes from when I first saw the post on Planet Half-Life, I became interested, <i>read the license agreement</i> (apparently not closely enough...), tried Xfire, discovered it was spyware-infested and promptly cleaned it up.

    Shortly after installing Xfire, I found myself unable to load several web pages, and when they did load, it was with extreme latency. Then I started spontaneously losing connection in games of HL. Paranoia detectors went off and I skimmed the Xfire program directory for an install log. Read on...

    First, the good news:
    It seems to uninstall cleanly without any tricks or tools.

    The gritty details (I'm no expert...on spyware):
    When you run the Xfire installer, at the end of the install process, it silently forks another installer executable...seems to be from Ultimate Arena, who I never trusted after seeing their button suddenly appear in one version of All-Seeing Eye.

    The UA installer takes the liberty of adding its own LSP (layered service provider) DLL to your Winsock LSP chain, a file located by default in C:\WINDOWS\system32\ua_lsp.dll.

    IMPORTANT: I AM NOT SUGGESTING YOU DELETE THIS FILE IF YOU HAVE IT. Doing so will almost certainly break your internet connection. Such is dirty nasty spyware. Leave it alone and uninstall Xfire, and cross your fingers. The LSP was gone after an uninstall and a reboot for me. A lucky break.

    Extra details, corrections or feedback more than welcome. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I think this topic should be deleted before the ignorance goes any farther.



    I am really tired of people expecting everything for nothing. Even if it were spyware I'd say this because Flayra has the option to MAKE A LIVING SOMEHOW. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Indeed ^^
  • CForresterCForrester P0rk(h0p Join Date: 2002-10-05 Member: 1439Members, Constellation
    Everyone here is at each others' throats over what some people think is spyware. Xfire isn't spyware. I have it installed and it's running fine. Whenever I install something, I comb my entire system for anything suspicious. The LSP was the only thing, and that was just explained. Trust Flayra, guys. If anyone would know if it's spyware, it would be him, and he wouldn't include spyware in his game.

    Also, it seems that you've got the definition of spyware all backwards. Spyware is a program that installs itself, collects data about you and transmits it to a server without your knowledge. Xfire isn't hiding anything, they even state the LSP version in their "About" box, and they just publically admitted that it was there and told us what it does.
  • coilcoil Amateur pirate. Professional monkey. All pance. Join Date: 2002-04-12 Member: 424Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
This discussion has been closed.