Hand Gren + Pg = Abuse?
Hakujin
Join Date: 2003-05-09 Member: 16157Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2003-05-09 Member: 16157Members, Constellation
I was playing on voogru tonight and the marines were using a tactic I hadn't seen before: everyone pulled their pins before phasing and then tossed a hand grenade on the PG after teleporting. This made it nigh impossible for skulks to take down the PG. I'm not talking about one or two marines doing this; I am talking about 8+ marines tossing grens before getting munched, killing 2-3 skulks, and then doing it again when coming back to life.
Pro-marine nazis will, of course, cry, "It's in the game!" Any intelligent people want to comment? Is this a valid tactic which should be endorsed?
Pro-marine nazis will, of course, cry, "It's in the game!" Any intelligent people want to comment? Is this a valid tactic which should be endorsed?
Comments
Bad Marine! *spank*
Why didn't the skulks learn after the first 2 or 3 grenades and start backing away from the nades? I doubt the marine would've been able to aim the grenade, so he would have most likely just been firing straight down at the PG as you said, which means the nade will not have exploded for 4 seconds (unless friendlyfire was on, but that's another issue) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree with revenge.
Besides its hardly fair for the marines to get killed right after they phase. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hardly fair?? Perhaps the marines should have defended their phase gate in the first place?
By your logic if marines are inside a hive blasting it and shooting spawning aliens then thats hardly fair now is it?
What about HA? Personlly I think the reason why HA are overpowered is because of phase gates. They complement each other so well.
A: grenades only do 1/2 or so self damage to the user
B: The outer edges of a grenade explosion inflict nearly as much damage as a direct hit(went from a 70/30 skulk to 25/0 when standing about 4 feet away from the explosion animation itself)
I think grenades should cause full damage to the user and also scale the damage down more so than it currently is as the explosion expands.
Still, that's pretty lame. It bypasses one of two things that lets the grenades be balanced (the other being one per life).
What about HA? Personlly I think the reason why HA are overpowered is because of phase gates. They complement each other so well. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yupp, completely bypasses the slow walking issue.
Umm, this is slightly cheap, but i really think the rines should have some chance of saving a phase if there's only skulks attacking it....
Oh wait... most PGs are covered by a turret factory... what happened to that?
If it's an undefended PG, then it deserves to die... If it's got turrets, the commander should have plenty of warning from the sentries firing message, or at least from the turrets/turret factory rapidly dying....
I think the best solution would be, as you said, to make them drop the grenade if the pin is pulled before phasing.... (i think if the pin isn't pulled, they should either drop a pickup-able nade, or just not drop it at all)
Why didn't the skulks learn after the first 2 or 3 grenades and start backing away from the nades? I doubt the marine would've been able to aim the grenade, so he would have most likely just been firing straight down at the PG as you said, which means the nade will not have exploded for 4 seconds (unless friendlyfire was on, but that's another issue)
Why didn't the skulks learn after the first 2 or 3 grenades and start backing away from the nades? I doubt the marine would've been able to aim the grenade, so he would have most likely just been firing straight down at the PG as you said, which means the nade will not have exploded for 4 seconds (unless friendlyfire was on, but that's another issue) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree with revenge.
Besides its hardly fair for the marines to get killed right after they phase.
the marines dont really get anywhere, if the aliens cant get a gorge to bile bomb, or a lerk to gas or just an onos for that matter. then maybe they should just give up, retire to the hive and wait for the marines to stop killing themselves with grenades.
Agreed
The gorge, with its armor having been nerfed into near nothingness, dies extremely fast, and a phase gate is usually shoved behind a TF, turret farm, and an electrified node, one marine just has to charge the gorge after blowing away the skulks in the area with his nade. Lerk spore doesn't do anything considering the nade is dropped in less than a second. Onos are you only real hope but for one, they aren't exactly a dime a dozen, and two, needing a 75 res unit to counter a 20 res, permanent upgrade = imbalance.
Another point
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> They already are very limited in thier use<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As they should be, again being a very cheap, permanent upgrade. Unfortunately in the case described, this "tactic" of bypassing the nades limiting factor of a long priming sequence, contributed heavily to the marines' victory, as two of their outpost's(one of which was a siege post for our hive) would have likely fallen had not our attack force been taken out with this cheap spammage.
Anyways, I think something should be done to curb this abuse, or it'll soon be common practice to prime a nade before jumping through a phase to a hotspot, I know I already do it now to devastating effect.
1) keep chewing on phase gate = death by lmg or grenade
2) attack marine = death by grenade
3) run away = death by lmg
Now imagine if the phase gate is proximal to an electric TF and RT. Even a Fade couldn't take that down because he would be in a weakened state when the hand grenades came through.
I'm going to agree with Psyke; if it's undefended, it deserves to die. It's a tactic, but somewhat cheap nonetheless. You can't say the skulks are missing out on the teamwork aspect because marines can just phase there once spawning; skulks have to run over. I like that no-priming-before-phasing idea. But don't take away it's damage. I like blowing away silly aliens in the vent <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' /><!--endemo-->
At least until I get a GL. Seriously though, HGs maybe have a little too much damage.
Or what about the idea of making HG's like an HMG or something, where the commander has to drop a pack for someone?
[edit] i failed spelling. [/edit]