Marik_SteeleTo rule in hell...Join Date: 2002-11-20Member: 9466Members
edited January 2004
It's actually faster paced than I would've expected, which has both its good and bad points. I briefly mentioned one suggestion in IRC, but since multiple conversations were going at once, I think I'll restate my full-out concept here.
Think of games like the Hitman/Thief/MGS series and Splinter Cell: as a stealth character you not only want to attack from behind; for best success you want your victim to be completely oblivious to your existence. In multiplayer the entire enemy team <i>knows</i> you're somewhere in the limits of the map, but the following "heightened awareness" ability tries to recreate the sort of experience normally only possible in singleplayer games.
We already have the dashing feature, which takes stamina, for both teams. I personally associate such agility more with the rebels team instead of the heavily armed evil empire. Simple change: for the evil empire, <i>keep</i> that stamina bar feature, but when the player presses the button, instead of having greater movement speed, they are in a state of "increased awareness." In this state the evil empire player simply recieves less damage (whether from knife or any rebel weapon, do whatever works best) because they're pretty sure they just saw/heard something, and chose to pay more attention because they think it's probably still near. Adjust stamina bar usage/regeneration rate accordingly. Increase damage of knife when victim is unaware if desired. Congrats, you've just made yourself the magic of your favorite SP stealth games.
If you really want to get fancy with it, add a sound that plays when the button is pressed or released. A whisper-volume "I could've sworn I just saw something" and "I must be imagining" would work fine.
<!--QuoteBegin--Pulse+Jan 10 2004, 10:43 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Pulse @ Jan 10 2004, 10:43 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> 68.97.68.154 <- DOOManiac's steamed server, it doesn't show up in the server browser for some reason, the password is "ns" <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm gonna guess it doesn't show up because you have passworded servers filtered out.
Marik, I think you're really on to something. I wish I could do that in NS! (but my previous ideas about it involve using the flashlight when something is amiss). But, still, it's much more fitting here than NS.
I'm gonna hold out for the HL2 mod to actually play, I think. Sniping whoring is something I can't stand, and there doesn't currently seem to be any real balance to prevent it.
EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
Its says invalid to this IP, 68.97.68.154 but connecting via console demands a pass <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
Using my vision h4x, I have to say that the Sniper is sorta ovarpowered. Good thing you put him at last place for stealth <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Sounds great. Now only if floppy disks could carry 45 MB in them :/
I want my internet on MY PC now <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
Another note: I said countless times that this is nothing other than a proof of concept. The concept has been proven so for all intents and purposes everything it was created for has been completed.
We know its unbalanced, we said so many many times. Certain aspects of the game which we will to balance it were not implemented
We know there are bugs, we said so many more times.
The HL2 mod Quad and I are working on, Espionage, will have nothing in common with this other than the basic premise of "stealth vs. firepower". Espionage will be far beyond this thing in scope, size, and implementation. But enough talking about that, as 1) we don't want to give out too much 2) its pretty dumb to talk about a mod we've yet to write a line of code for thanks to HL2 being delayed. So just keep in mind that the prototype is just that, a prototype, when making any suggestions.
<!--QuoteBegin--DOOManiac+Jan 11 2004, 12:08 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Jan 11 2004, 12:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Another note: I said countless times that this is nothing other than a proof of concept. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> And from my puttering around in the single player, said concept is <i>very</i> sound. What are the engineer/hacker going to do?
BizZy_9mm_MessiahOld School MemberJoin Date: 2003-07-25Member: 18411Members, Constellation
In my eyes it was pretty good for a "Prototype." Besides all the keyboard malfunctions I was having, and the major **** kicking me and Enigma were recieving, I liked it.
<!--QuoteBegin--Pjofsky+Jan 11 2004, 04:29 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Pjofsky @ Jan 11 2004, 04:29 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Very, very, very laggy. It's a tad too fast paced for me, but I like it. Which models were QUAD's? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> The only thing of mine in this mod right now is the driving concept and one of the maps. DOOM coded it and did the other map. I've done other work, of course, but none you guys get to see yet :P.
<!--QuoteBegin--Dragon_Mech+Jan 11 2004, 01:11 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dragon_Mech @ Jan 11 2004, 01:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--DOOManiac+Jan 11 2004, 12:08 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Jan 11 2004, 12:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Another note: I said countless times that this is nothing other than a proof of concept. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> And from my puttering around in the single player, said concept is <i>very</i> sound. What are the engineer/hacker going to do? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Well the engineers will.... engineer things whereas hackers will, "Hack" things. Hacking is the act of infiltrating a computer mainframe without permission <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--QUAD+Jan 10 2004, 10:09 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (QUAD @ Jan 10 2004, 10:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> This is half my baby, guys D:!
But yes, this is a proof of concept, essentially. The final version will be very goo. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I love goo! Is it sticky or perhaps more slimy?
Seriously, I'm downloading now, sounds like a good bit of fun <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Even for a said "crappy" prototype, I'm still deriving loads of fun from this mod. Please, please, pleeeease update it, even just a little bit.
EDIT:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Very, very, very laggy. It's a tad too fast paced for me, but I like it. Which models were QUAD's?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Its only laggy because that map is way oversized and completely outdoors and there are no dedicated server files.
Dl'ing right now from second mirror, 410 KB/s. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Doom will have to write a mapping guide for manually putting in the entities, because there's no .FDG at the moment.
For now, just do what I did: map it for HLDM. Make sure to put in lots of shadowy areas for the stealth players. It can easily be compiled for Stealthmod after that.
<!--QuoteBegin--QUAD+Jan 11 2004, 01:01 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (QUAD @ Jan 11 2004, 01:01 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> For now, just do what I did: map it for HLDM. Make sure to put in lots of shadowy areas for the stealth players. It can easily be compiled for Stealthmod after that. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Please don't interpret "shadowy areas" as pitch black. That just ruins that map. Please see NS's mapping guidelines for more info/other suggestions.
<!--QuoteBegin--DOOManiac+Jan 11 2004, 03:23 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Jan 11 2004, 03:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> so I guess we better get to work eh Quad? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You do. You SO have to get working on this.
I think everything just has the regular footsteps. I'm only like 30% sure on this, if they really do just have the normal footsteps that'd be a good simple change.
An easier way to put up a server would be greatly appreciated too. I've seen many people in #ns that want to play but there are no servers and many people's routers don't allow for them to put it up.
Glad to see you guys working... for once <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Well the public demands it, so I guess we better get to work eh Quad? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Definatly. Idea discussion session later today?
Comments
Think of games like the Hitman/Thief/MGS series and Splinter Cell: as a stealth character you not only want to attack from behind; for best success you want your victim to be completely oblivious to your existence. In multiplayer the entire enemy team <i>knows</i> you're somewhere in the limits of the map, but the following "heightened awareness" ability tries to recreate the sort of experience normally only possible in singleplayer games.
We already have the dashing feature, which takes stamina, for both teams. I personally associate such agility more with the rebels team instead of the heavily armed evil empire. Simple change: for the evil empire, <i>keep</i> that stamina bar feature, but when the player presses the button, instead of having greater movement speed, they are in a state of "increased awareness." In this state the evil empire player simply recieves less damage (whether from knife or any rebel weapon, do whatever works best) because they're pretty sure they just saw/heard something, and chose to pay more attention because they think it's probably still near. Adjust stamina bar usage/regeneration rate accordingly. Increase damage of knife when victim is unaware if desired. Congrats, you've just made yourself the magic of your favorite SP stealth games.
If you really want to get fancy with it, add a sound that plays when the button is pressed or released. A whisper-volume "I could've sworn I just saw something" and "I must be imagining" would work fine.
I'm gonna guess it doesn't show up because you have passworded servers filtered out.
Marik, I think you're really on to something. I wish I could do that in NS! (but my previous ideas about it involve using the flashlight when something is amiss). But, still, it's much more fitting here than NS.
I'm gonna hold out for the HL2 mod to actually play, I think. Sniping whoring is something I can't stand, and there doesn't currently seem to be any real balance to prevent it.
Sounds great. Now only if floppy disks could carry 45 MB in them :/
I want my internet on MY PC now <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
And I ran around in single player for a while - it looks sweet!
Another note: I said countless times that this is nothing other than a proof of concept. The concept has been proven so for all intents and purposes everything it was created for has been completed.
We know its unbalanced, we said so many many times. Certain aspects of the game which we will to balance it were not implemented
We know there are bugs, we said so many more times.
The HL2 mod Quad and I are working on, Espionage, will have nothing in common with this other than the basic premise of "stealth vs. firepower". Espionage will be far beyond this thing in scope, size, and implementation. But enough talking about that, as 1) we don't want to give out too much 2) its pretty dumb to talk about a mod we've yet to write a line of code for thanks to HL2 being delayed. So just keep in mind that the prototype is just that, a prototype, when making any suggestions.
And from my puttering around in the single player, said concept is <i>very</i> sound. What are the engineer/hacker going to do?
The only thing of mine in this mod right now is the driving concept and one of the maps. DOOM coded it and did the other map. I've done other work, of course, but none you guys get to see yet :P.
And from my puttering around in the single player, said concept is <i>very</i> sound. What are the engineer/hacker going to do? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well the engineers will.... engineer things whereas hackers will, "Hack" things. Hacking is the act of infiltrating a computer mainframe without permission <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
But yes, this is a proof of concept, essentially. The final version will be very goo. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I love goo! Is it sticky or perhaps more slimy?
Seriously, I'm downloading now, sounds like a good bit of fun <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
EDIT:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Very, very, very laggy. It's a tad too fast paced for me, but I like it. Which models were QUAD's?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Its only laggy because that map is way oversized and completely outdoors and there are no dedicated server files.
For now, just do what I did: map it for HLDM. Make sure to put in lots of shadowy areas for the stealth players. It can easily be compiled for Stealthmod after that.
Please don't interpret "shadowy areas" as pitch black. That just ruins that map. Please see NS's mapping guidelines for more info/other suggestions.
Someone put a server up ASAP, I need a stealth fix.
Well the public demands it, so I guess we better get to work eh Quad?
You do. You SO have to get working on this.
An easier way to put up a server would be greatly appreciated too. I've seen many people in #ns that want to play but there are no servers and many people's routers don't allow for them to put it up.
Well the public demands it, so I guess we better get to work eh Quad? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Definatly. Idea discussion session later today?