The 3.0 Fade
Doobie_Dan
Join Date: 2003-10-23 Member: 21892Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2003-10-23 Member: 21892Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">Too nerfed?</div> Could some people who are actively participating in the 3.0 beta give some comments on how the fade nerf is affecting gameplay? Are they still useful/used? I believe the 2.01 Fade is perfectly balanced (although perhaps a <i>bit</i> too powerful in the hands of the uber1337) and the extra cost makes me scared about an already somewhat risky investment. Shotties are cheap because they're easily lost, but Fades can be lost easily too, and not just from foolishly blinking into a group of 5 rines...
Comments
I agree that fade shouldn't have been nerfed, but maybe he isn't truly.
Basically, you can kill anything with a fade if you know how to use it.
No. The changelog says that blinking does not take as much stamina as it did before, in fact, it costs 25% less.
No. The changelog says that blinking does not take as much stamina as it did before, in fact, it costs 25% less.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually it says this:<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Reduced blink power by 25% (less force is applied when you blink).<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I would guess that that means a longer tap of the attack key will be required in order to achieve the maximum speed, but not that the maximum speed of blink is actually slowed.
Basically, you can kill anything with a fade if you know how to use it.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I am sorry but this is inaccurate information. With the new hitbox fades are so easy to shoot and kill. In 2.01 only a small section of the fade near the center is the hitbox. Now in 3.0 the hitbox covers most if not all of the fade. Why do you think the onos was increased to 900/400. Because of the much larger hitbox. Same thing has been done to the fade but with no increase to the hp/armor. Maybe in ns combat the fades are good but you can not get a fade to be that good in classic ns. In Ns combat the fade can get cara, regen adren, celerity meta, Acid rocket and still would have some points left over. This would be an effective fade. In ns classic you can get what, a fade with regen, adren and maybe focus and AR with the 3rd hive. The fade is not worth 60 res, when it dies much faster then a 50 res 2.01 fade does.
Any weapon is "overpowered" in the hands of an "uber1337", and it should be.
it's the % of damage its armor absorbs
it can actualy die and still have half its maximum armor
its not nerfed
i think it shoud stay the way it is
(i have played and am attively playing 3.0)
They die too quick but the focussed "blink-swipe" really tears the marines apart... Lastinv bound to a nearby key really helps here.
The dynamics of the game haven't changed from 2 -> 3 as much as they have from 1 -> 2. Most of the new additions, like hand grenades, catalysts are too expensive/useless. Only focus will really change things, but even focus won't compensate for 1st hive dcs in a long drawn out game. You'd need to rush for focus to work.
Well, I'm sure we'll see some innovative strats for focus after the version is released publicly, but I can't imagine it changing things that significantly.
Finally someone else who believes the 1.x blink would be better. Focus blink/swipe? I gotta taste that.
Acid rocket is too powerful, good Fades (gotta name ktdm : Rapacious here..) can just pwn entire squads and a base with ease...
The only counter measure is upped shotties, and an early Fade with regen can waste all your chances of getting res in a matter of minutes...
Acid rocket is too powerful, good Fades (gotta name ktdm : Rapacious here..) can just pwn entire squads and a base with ease...
The only counter measure is upped shotties, and an early Fade with regen can waste all your chances of getting res in a matter of minutes... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Too powerful? PSHH! It's to weak.
hence the variable is players' skill, and not game balance, which is why i think 2.01 fade is good <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> (duh?)
Against lv 2 marines. The current strat some commanders use is to take lv 2 weapons right away. After 5 minutes of game-play, only 2 marines without any equipment can waste 50 res fade. With shotguns, okay; they had to pay for that, but 2 LMG's...? Weak, if you ask me.
(But then, I'm pretty much sure they hit almost every bullet home <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> "Oops" indeed <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> )
1/3 to 1/2 of the alien team going fade before the 2nd hive gone up were almost unstopable when covering each other and just being fast.
2 teams of equal skill playing and the rines will win 9/10 times. Fade's are the hardest hit.
I could usually kill at least 10 marines before I died as a fade in 2.01. Taking down 3 rines with lmg's wasn't even challenging. Now with a little luck on their part of one **** up on your part, 2 lmg rines can mop the floor with me.
Furthermore, Flayra apparently has said that fades will get a boost in beta 2, which may or may no bring back fade dominance.
now, it is true that a 1337 fade can blink around and not get hit enough to die. this is a problem if your a marine. the "flying fade" is truely insane. but it is also true that a fade has difficulty toe-to-toe even against vanilla marines. this means that a fade <b>cannot</b> engage in combat effectively unless it cant be hit, either by blinking or ambush. on most pubs ive seen, they still use dc>mt>sc so by the time cloaking is an option its academic. considering that a 50 (now 60) res fade cant stand toe-to-toe with 4 res of marine, fades have become the most inefficient option in NS IMHO. welder rushing the hive gets more results/res then a fade attacking head-on.
now, it is a matter of skill but a specific skill. blink-swipe. with a fade and any group of marines without massive armor this is the only determining factor. however, if like me you get lag-spikes in combat then the subtle timing is thrown off and this tactic becomes nearly impossible. i CAN get kills as a skulk with twice the lag as everyone else on a server as a skulk. even easyer as a gorg. as a hive 1 or 2 fade the best i hope for is to take out a res node and redempt.