I didnt realize that 2.01 was for steam as well.. shows my ignorance <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Bad HAL 9000+Dec 18 2003, 06:25 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Bad HAL 9000 @ Dec 18 2003, 06:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Well, to answer the question about loctaion the server is in texas. hosted by servermatrix. They run excelent servers.
I need some input about maxplayers and such. I am thinking 8 vs 8, that is my first idea.
I know a very good commander and I have a few volunteers. I dont know many of you here at the NS.org forums but I do know the skills of a few of the regs at the server I play at. If anyone is in CAL please tell me so I can take that into consideration. Also I will need an idea of how big I need the HLTV server to be. how many players should be allowed to be connected.
I will be updating my first post with current settings, rules, and registered players. Feel free to shoot somone down if you play with them and know they are not ""elite"" Same for the otherway around. If you know somone good then tell me. A person that does not come with recognition from at least one other player will not be considered
As far as the 3.0 concern. Well. I dont have 3.0 And as it is for steam I may not even getting it. And I know a great deal of other players that feel the same way, we will be stuck with 2.01 because of our thickheadedness and fear of change that we wont use steam. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> While I can't stop you from carrying out your grand plan...
You do realize how silly, stupid, and ignorant this entire idea is?
First of all, the best teams of NS are the best because they have played with each other, and have played together often. You know, teamwork and coordination. It makes up a LOT of your game.
Second, throwing skill players together will still get it's butt raped by any of the top clans, because, AGAIN, the good players together aren't going to have the same amount of coordination.
Third, it seems most people share my reaction of this idea, that it's a total waste of time, and you aren't going to get any actually truely skilled players to scrim with you.
All you are asking for is a pug game (pug games are basically groups of people who round up together and play each other). And pug games are hardly what I'd call top level play.
So, in essence, your 'balance' experiment is not only flawed in design, but it's going to fail in execution as well, as it won't show jack crap. Also, you manage to alienate yourself from an entire clan community as you dismiss the <b>hundreds</b> of hours spent on scrims and matches by various clans all throughout the NS community which will give you a <i>far</i> better idea of NS 2.01 balance.
Wow, your mean. go die or somthing. This is somthing I want to do. I want to see for my self. I dont care what you think. I am not forcing anyone to do this. Thanks for your insight so from now on I know not to look at your posts. have a nice day.
I was asking for volunteers. Not flamming jerks. If you dont want to be a part of it then fine. I see now why a large portion of the NS community avoids these forums.
<!--QuoteBegin--Elderwyrm+Dec 18 2003, 08:26 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Elderwyrm @ Dec 18 2003, 08:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Just go Rip all the players off of eR and HAM and I say you have your allstar team right there. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> or better yet just watch the demo...
gee, who would have thought of that? certainly not any of you.
Well if it isnt Bad Hal from EP. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Cereal_KillR+Dec 18 2003, 03:56 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cereal_KillR @ Dec 18 2003, 03:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I never was good and never will. I can't lie to anybody <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Amen to that cereal. I suck hard core if there was an award for sucking I *WOULD* be the 1337357 <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
But yea balance for the average not the perfect.
Oh and dont mind forlorn. He can be a bit harsh sometimes but he gets the point across quite nicely. He's simply a joy to play with as well <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
I would actually have to defend the scientific validity of this experiment.
Sure it wouldn't be a test of the "average" case, but it would be an experiment in the ability for teams of "equal" "1337"ness (in their own regards) who have had no prior teamwork experience with eachother and see how well they can cooperate. In THAT sense it does in fact model the environment of most pub servers. While there are a few pub servers (few = 200 or less) that have regulars (Freaks Unleashed! Give it UP!), there comparatively exists a plethora of pubs with no regular attendees (this qualifies if regulars constitute more than 3 people). So on the "average" case, if you joined a random server, you are likely to experience an environment where you have never played with any of your teammates before. Furthermore, simulating this experiment using "1337" players will ensure that the game is utilized/exploited for all its features/shortcomings by virutally all players. Since the full range of capabilities offerred in the game are available to all players in this circumstance it becomes a perfect method of calculating the "actual" balanced nature (as opposed to the "average" balance) in an evironment where the players are unfamiliar with thier respective teammates.
So why the hell, would you want to know whether the actual game is balanced vs. the average game? Well I'll tell you why I think its at least worthy of note if not pertinent.
Generally speaking, the more a person enjoys a game the more that person will play and become familiar with the game. In many cases, this will lead to said player gaining an intimate knowledge into the gameplay and tactics of the game. Such intimate knowledge will lead to some form of "1337"ness as said person will be able to fully utilize/exploit the games features/shortcomings to his/her advantage. When this phenomenon happens it can become boring for said player to continue playing as this player can almost guarantee himself that he is sure to win (or greatly aid in winning). At that point, the player has a high likelihood of leaving the game for some other game (one that presents some level of challenge). I have seen this happen in countless games. Now if said player were able to play in an environment where his intimate knowledge only slightly leveled the playing field there would actually be more focus on competition between players, or teams of players for our purposes, focusing on who could use such advantages best in different situations (personal skill).
If all that confused you in any way, the basic argument applies to the longevity of players. Will they quit a game sooner ("average" case) or later ("actual" case). If development is focused more on providing balance only for the "average" case then you can easily make an argument that player are not likely to stay with the game as long as they would if a more refined set of balance was created (in the case that all players are fully knowledgable of all features/shortcomings).
Now we could go on and on about player longevity theory in the software development lifecycle, but in 90% of such theory, there still exists the basic principle game balance is geared towards the best of players and not towards the average or worst players.
I'll get down from my podium now... thnx for listening even if you may not agree.
<!--QuoteBegin--CutterJoe+Dec 18 2003, 09:09 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CutterJoe @ Dec 18 2003, 09:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Cereal_KillR+Dec 18 2003, 03:56 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cereal_KillR @ Dec 18 2003, 03:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I never was good and never will. I can't lie to anybody <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Amen to that cereal. I suck hard core if there was an award for sucking I *WOULD* be the 1337357 <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
But yea balance for the average not the perfect.
Oh and dont mind forlorn. He can be a bit harsh sometimes but he gets the point across quite nicely. He's simply a joy to play with as well <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> <3
that was my reaction exactly, and a far as that list goes. Those are the only volunteers I have gotten that were worth considering. Now. I am not going to go seeking out all these players because I dont know whos the best. I only know who is good on the servers I play on. I was hoping some people would suggest a person or volunteer themselvs with somone else backing them up as a good player. If a player is better then a person on the list then that person will be replaced by the better player. This is how it is going to be. Hell, I have only got negative **** from you fellows, perhaps I should keep this to the people I know on my server.
Well, I am withdrawing my offer to the people here. Only the few that I know as a good player are allowed. Anyone that is from this thread is not welcome as I dont know anyone and I dont care to be flammed for no logical reason.
Would a moderator please lock this thread
The offer is closed to anyone on these forums, a certian level of maturity was expected but not found
Comments
shows my ignorance <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
I need some input about maxplayers and such. I am thinking 8 vs 8, that is my first idea.
I know a very good commander and I have a few volunteers. I dont know many of you here at the NS.org forums but I do know the skills of a few of the regs at the server I play at. If anyone is in CAL please tell me so I can take that into consideration. Also I will need an idea of how big I need the HLTV server to be. how many players should be allowed to be connected.
I will be updating my first post with current settings, rules, and registered players. Feel free to shoot somone down if you play with them and know they are not ""elite"" Same for the otherway around. If you know somone good then tell me. A person that does not come with recognition from at least one other player will not be considered
As far as the 3.0 concern. Well. I dont have 3.0
And as it is for steam I may not even getting it. And I know a great deal of other players that feel the same way, we will be stuck with 2.01 because of our thickheadedness and fear of change that we wont use steam. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
While I can't stop you from carrying out your grand plan...
You do realize how silly, stupid, and ignorant this entire idea is?
First of all, the best teams of NS are the best because they have played with each other, and have played together often. You know, teamwork and coordination. It makes up a LOT of your game.
Second, throwing skill players together will still get it's butt raped by any of the top clans, because, AGAIN, the good players together aren't going to have the same amount of coordination.
Third, it seems most people share my reaction of this idea, that it's a total waste of time, and you aren't going to get any actually truely skilled players to scrim with you.
All you are asking for is a pug game (pug games are basically groups of people who round up together and play each other). And pug games are hardly what I'd call top level play.
So, in essence, your 'balance' experiment is not only flawed in design, but it's going to fail in execution as well, as it won't show jack crap. Also, you manage to alienate yourself from an entire clan community as you dismiss the <b>hundreds</b> of hours spent on scrims and matches by various clans all throughout the NS community which will give you a <i>far</i> better idea of NS 2.01 balance.
I was asking for volunteers. Not flamming jerks. If you dont want to be a part of it then fine. I see now why a large portion of the NS community avoids these forums.
eR took the entire pai for CAL and HAM was right there with them at the Finals.
or better yet just watch the demo...
gee, who would have thought of that?
certainly not any of you.
I salute you.
Anyway, I'll probably spectate. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Amen to that cereal. I suck hard core if there was an award for sucking I *WOULD* be the 1337357 <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
But yea balance for the average not the perfect.
Oh and dont mind forlorn. He can be a bit harsh sometimes but he gets the point across quite nicely. He's simply a joy to play with as well <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Wouldn't a completely random player team be a better choice?
But, if you need a volunteer when your going to do it, I could fill in, I guess.
Marine team:
Lost
Asterisk (Current commander)
Thief
Matrix
Alien team:
Mr.Billy
ccnncc99
MomawNadon78
G2
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Who are these people? I thought you said you wanted the best.
Sure it wouldn't be a test of the "average" case, but it would be an experiment in the ability for teams of "equal" "1337"ness (in their own regards) who have had no prior teamwork experience with eachother and see how well they can cooperate. In THAT sense it does in fact model the environment of most pub servers. While there are a few pub servers (few = 200 or less) that have regulars (Freaks Unleashed! Give it UP!), there comparatively exists a plethora of pubs with no regular attendees (this qualifies if regulars constitute more than 3 people). So on the "average" case, if you joined a random server, you are likely to experience an environment where you have never played with any of your teammates before. Furthermore, simulating this experiment using "1337" players will ensure that the game is utilized/exploited for all its features/shortcomings by virutally all players. Since the full range of capabilities offerred in the game are available to all players in this circumstance it becomes a perfect method of calculating the "actual" balanced nature (as opposed to the "average" balance) in an evironment where the players are unfamiliar with thier respective teammates.
So why the hell, would you want to know whether the actual game is balanced vs. the average game? Well I'll tell you why I think its at least worthy of note if not pertinent.
Generally speaking, the more a person enjoys a game the more that person will play and become familiar with the game. In many cases, this will lead to said player gaining an intimate knowledge into the gameplay and tactics of the game. Such intimate knowledge will lead to some form of "1337"ness as said person will be able to fully utilize/exploit the games features/shortcomings to his/her advantage. When this phenomenon happens it can become boring for said player to continue playing as this player can almost guarantee himself that he is sure to win (or greatly aid in winning). At that point, the player has a high likelihood of leaving the game for some other game (one that presents some level of challenge). I have seen this happen in countless games. Now if said player were able to play in an environment where his intimate knowledge only slightly leveled the playing field there would actually be more focus on competition between players, or teams of players for our purposes, focusing on who could use such advantages best in different situations (personal skill).
If all that confused you in any way, the basic argument applies to the longevity of players. Will they quit a game sooner ("average" case) or later ("actual" case). If development is focused more on providing balance only for the "average" case then you can easily make an argument that player are not likely to stay with the game as long as they would if a more refined set of balance was created (in the case that all players are fully knowledgable of all features/shortcomings).
Now we could go on and on about player longevity theory in the software development lifecycle, but in 90% of such theory, there still exists the basic principle game balance is geared towards the best of players and not towards the average or worst players.
I'll get down from my podium now... thnx for listening even if you may not agree.
Amen to that cereal. I suck hard core if there was an award for sucking I *WOULD* be the 1337357 <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
But yea balance for the average not the perfect.
Oh and dont mind forlorn. He can be a bit harsh sometimes but he gets the point across quite nicely. He's simply a joy to play with as well <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
<3
Hahahahahahaha
And you are?
Guess none of us are leet enough for bad a*s HAL
Would a moderator please lock this thread
The offer is closed to anyone on these forums, a certian level of maturity was expected but not found