Metabolose
uranium_235
Join Date: 2002-11-20 Member: 9478Banned
Join Date: 2002-11-20 Member: 9478Banned
Comments
I guess you mean stacking properly, since right now you can almost stack it with a little timing.
*chuckles* Sorry but playing with the vets opens your eyes to how strong the Fade really is. Metabolise is an excellent skill when used correctly. It allows you to take carapace if you have DCs (and trust me, against shotgunners you <i>need</i> carapace. Plus, if you don't have DCs, you can heal yourself whilst taking arden or celerity plus maybe focus or cloaking.
1) It heals much slower then regeneration. Try it. A level 3 regen fade vs. a metabolose fade from 1 hp: The metabolose fade will only be about half healed by the time the regen fade is healed.
2) It wastes stamina. And wow does it waste stamina... the fade itself is practically the SUV of the alien world.
3) It's the equivilent of a 'I need a medpack' call for the aliens: Any marine that hears the 'woob woob' knows there's a beat-up fade over there. At least with regeneration's 'gloomp gloomp' he doesn't know what type of alien it is.
4) It doesn't heal you constantly. Metabolose is only useful when you can find a safe place to sit back for 2 minutes and use it. Regeneration can, however, technically triple, even quadruple your effective hit points. A fade can wade into a nest of turrets with regen and do some damage before wading back out. A metabolose fade can just run in, whack things for a bit, then run like hell.
5) You uncloak when using it.
Agreed as usual, that metabol<b>iz</b>e (DUH! i dont like nick's for most alien weapons, especially nicks that put a weapon down) should stack <i>propery</i> with regen.
and uranium:
1- It heals slower for a <i>reason</i>. If it healed as fast as regen just think how good a regen'ing fade using metabol<b>iz</b>e would be! If metabol<b>iz</b>e properly stacked with regen now, it wouldn't be that much of a problem... but metabol<b>iz</b>e was any better. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
2- Yeah, and so does blink... so i guess that makes it a even bigger SUV? No, blink has just as much use as metabol<b>iz</b>e does.
3- You should be taking silence... all those misc sounds the fade just PUMPS out can give away to the marines that theres a fade nearby! *crowd wows* metabol<b>iz</b>e has a very short sound range, granted, it does stick out but you should blink atleast alittle ways out from the action. if you're blinked into a vent it doesn't really matter much, anyways; marine bullets wont necessarilly hit you.
4- Again, if a fade using metabol<b>iz</b>e could heal as fast as regen allowed you to, the fade would be very nasty. You could technically strafe and avoid marine bullets while regen'ing using metabol<b>iz</b>e, but you cant use a weapon... hmm. i wonder why the devs made metabol<b>iz</b>e a weapon... <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> and hey, why walk when you can <b>blink</b>?
[edit]
5- wouldn't you un-cloak if you're tissues were healing at a rapid rate? such a rapid rate that cloaking couldn't keep up? i thought so...
[/edit]
Metabolise: 100 res.
Which should heal faster?
Metabolise: 100 res.
Which should heal faster? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Care to explain that math?
30 for chamber, 2 for upgrade
Metabolise: 100 res.
Which should heal faster? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
First of all, your math is off. Since we are looking at a regen fade, the fade cost has to be in both formulas, so regen is 82 res. That still leaves metabolize a higher cost. However, the second hive has many benefits, such as giving bile bomb to gorges and leap to skulks, along with doubling the spawn rate (not quite doubling, but close enough). All of these benefits combined are greater than the benefits of dc's in many cases. If metabolize were so much better than regen, fades would have little reason to get regen at 2 hives.
<!--QuoteBegin--uranium - 235+Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (uranium - 235 @ Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
1) It heals much slower then regeneration. Try it. A level 3 regen fade vs. a metabolose fade from 1 hp: The metabolose fade will only be about half healed by the time the regen fade is healed.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
How about trying a level 3 regen fade vs level 3 weapons. You won't last long with regeneration, but with carapace you are given more time to do more damage. If you have taken too much damage, not even regeneration will heal you fast enough. Times like these call for a quick "blink" trip back to your hive to heal.
<!--QuoteBegin--uranium - 235+Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (uranium - 235 @ Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
2) It wastes stamina. And wow does it waste stamina... the fade itself is practically the SUV of the alien world.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So does every other ability in this game. And so what if it wastes stamina, it's not like you are going to be to metabolize while trying to swipe people.
<!--QuoteBegin--uranium - 235+Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (uranium - 235 @ Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
4) It doesn't heal you constantly. Metabolose is only useful when you can find a safe place to sit back for 2 minutes and use it. Regeneration can, however, technically triple, even quadruple your effective hit points. A fade can wade into a nest of turrets with regen and do some damage before wading back out. A metabolose fade can just run in, whack things for a bit, then run like hell.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Regeneration cannot heal you fast enough when you fighting big weapons to do any damage, but carapace can allow you survive long time to do some damage.
A fade is suppose to run in, whack things for a bit, then run like hell. That's why they designed it to be a "hit and run" unit.
<!--QuoteBegin--uranium - 235+Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (uranium - 235 @ Nov 4 2003, 10:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
5) You uncloak when using it.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So does every other ability in this game.
He was comparing it to regen...
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->So does every other ability in this game. And so what if it wastes stamina, it's not like you are going to be to metabolize while trying to swipe people. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not every abilty eats up 1/4 of your energy bar. And whoever said blink takes a lot of energy is not using it right. Blink eats up a sliver of the energy bar.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Regeneration cannot heal you fast enough when you fighting big weapons to do any damage, but carapace can allow you survive long time to do some damage.
A fade is suppose to run in, whack things for a bit, then run like hell. That's why they designed it to be a "hit and run" unit.
o does every other ability in this game. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This isn't a "which D chamber upgrade is better" thread. People are comparing regen with metabolize since they are so similar.
And for the record, metabolize used to allow temporary invincibility and damage turned into energy. But it didnt work out. If I remember correctly it was bugged.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Metabolise is an excellent skill when used correctly.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wish people would stop saying things like this without actually explaining anything. Whats so difficult in finding a hiding spot and spamming metabolize... though I do use it midbattle too if I'm not in range. I take carapace for my fade. Still its not that great. Not as critical an ability like leap/bomb/stomp.
Metabolise: 100 res.
Which should heal faster? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
First of all, your math is off. Since we are looking at a regen fade, the fade cost has to be in both formulas, so regen is 82 res. That still leaves metabolize a higher cost. However, the second hive has many benefits, such as giving bile bomb to gorges and leap to skulks, along with doubling the spawn rate (not quite doubling, but close enough). All of these benefits combined are greater than the benefits of dc's in many cases. If metabolize were so much better than regen, fades would have little reason to get regen at 2 hives. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I never said base it on the creature getting regeneration. If metabolose was for skulks, then base it on that, then. Either way, metabolize is MUCH more expensive then regeneration. Defense chambers also provide innate regneration for all nearby creatures, and they also give 2 other upgrades. That hive 2 crap is just that: crap, don't throw it out here. You want I should calculate the cost of the gorges building the hive, and dropping RTs too? Sheesh. Again: Fade with metabolize is much more expensive then a fade with level 3 regeneration.
@ FCC:
First of all, never EVER tell <b>me</b> how to run a fade. Drop by Lunixmonster and I'll whip anyone's **** any day. Furthermore, what POSSIBLE bearing did 'fades are good in the right hands' have to do with the price of peach tea in Tibet? We're not talking about the fade being useful, so shut up about that.
Furthermore, I always take regeneration as a fade. Always. You wanted to start talking about good fades, then you whine about regeneration not protecting you when you run face first into big guns? Do I really need to point out the stupid flaw in your argument right there? You know... I probably will, so here ya go:
<b>Good fades don't run face-first into big guns.</b> If you find yourself NEEDING carapace, you screwed up bad.
Gah, Fades for hit and run, I hate that title. The fade is nothing but a glorified skulk with extra strength. Blink - Leap, Bite - Swipe. You know how some people can kill a line of marines as a skulk? It's because they're also good with a fade, and they work the exact same way: Incredibly weak, but can deal lots of damage.
I've been running some tests in my server:
1) A regeneration fade can destroy, about, 1.75 electrified turret factories. That's straight, from one to the other, without getting more stamina. If the fade has three movement chambers nearby, he can destroy both.
A carapaced fade cannot destroy one. He can hurt it to half health, and that's it. He dies.
2) A regeneration fade standing in front of 5 turrets: Lives for 10 seconds, nearly exact.
A carapaced fade standing in front of 5 turrets: Lives for 11 seconds, nearly exact.
All tests were run twice, with the exception of the carapace turret test (Run 3 times), and all repeated tests net the same results.
Regeneration fade, heal from 10 health to 250 / 100 : Approx 30 seconds.
Thusly:
Carapace is inferior to regeneration, and metabolize is inferior to regeneration.
However, metabolize does heal slightly more rapidly then regeneration. If the fade lacked all defense upgrades, metabolize would work. It takes approximately 26 seconds to heal from 10 health to full with metabolize, no carapace, and approximately 30 to heal from 10 to full with regeneration.
However, that means no carapace either. In lieu of NOTHING, sure, I'd take metabolize, but I'll take regeneration over carapace / metabolose any day.
EDIT: And one more thing to keep in mind: All the tests involving metabolize left me with almost no stamina to defend myself. Regeneration kept me prepped and ready to rock and roll.
While regen is more useful for fighting defenses, carapace is still WAY more useful for fighting shotties; it takes 2lv. 0 shotties to kill a regen fade opposed to 3 direct hits from a lv. 0 shotty. (Not sure on the math, but these numbers are roughly correct that shotties have a harder time killing a cara fade over a regen fade)
Is this difference even noticible? You bet. Is it worth it? That's a preference. Between the choice of carapace or regen, I take regen usually, but against things like shotties carapace is way more useful.
But I'm not gonna argue here; meta is pretty damn useless at the 2 hive level, simply considering that you have 2 hives up and you will have 2 healing stations on the map and movement chambers, so you can celerity or adren blink back to a hive to heal in record time (considering that usually there are D chambers around the hive), as opposed to meta which is WAY slower.
Probably not.
it lets fades fade out for a while and come back ready to fight
I doubt it will be changed though
Is your "vampire" ability supposed to be a passive ability? If that's the case, then it isn't an attack, and wouldn't be put in probably. I guess it could just be a different version of swipe, one that does less damage but gives you health when you hit them (which might be what you meant, I'm not sure). That might be more useful than metabolize, although its use would be completely different.
HA / HMG is a different matter. In that case, you just do what you can, usually involving a horde of allies slamming into the horde of enemies.
Imagine if metabolise, instead, when you used it, made you cloaked. But you couldn't cloak-walk.
Imagine if metabolise would cause you to see like scent of fear, but only injured marines.
Imagine if metabolise gave you a speed boost... but you couldn't attack while using it.
That's what metabolise is: A waste of a weapon slot that just gives the fade a completely useless, redundant, and watered-down ability.
it lets fades fade out for a while and come back ready to fight
I doubt it will be changed though <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The problem with meta is that blink is so darn fast you can blink to a gorge/hive/bunch of DC's that stack with your regen which you heals you SO much faster than meta ever could/will...
2 problems with that:
1) I'm assuming you're blinking from battle. In which case, you're going to be very low on stamina. It will take practically 2x longer to heal then normal. Furthermore, without silence, all the marines will know where you are, and if you have cloaking, well, it's useless.
2) Meta and regen don't stack, but that's being fixed, or so I've been told.