Armories Should Still Refill Your Clip

Xero · August 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">Grenades launchers aside.</div> I would like to request that in patch 2.01, the armory will still refill marine weapon clips, aside from grenade launchers. I definitely agree that grenade spam ruins endgame and prolongs alien victory. But marine base defense becomes much harder without fast lmg/hmg/shotgun refilling. During early and midgame, it is very difficult to hold off multiple waves of aliens because marines don't have enough time to reload. I can't count how many times I've died with a newly received hmg because I had to stop and reload it. So this is my humble plea to reinstate clip reload (excluding nades), because it seriously affects gameplay.

Tyrain · August 2003

A "newly recieved" HMG is usually reloaded.

Xero · August 2003

I mean after spending the initial clip. Therefore the weapon gets only a one-time use.

nthing · August 2003

I totally agree. Needs putting back in, as it was so awsome. Now it just sucks again as it always did.

th0r0n · August 2003

check here, i've got a suggestion.

<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=5&t=45539' target='_blank'>Linkage</a>

GoldenShadow · August 2003

The ammo it gives you puts it in your pockets, how can it magicaly refill your clip without you doing it yourself by taking out the magazine and putting a new one in. reload times are there for a reason, just because you got pushed back to your base doesn't mean you need to get a huge advantage of reducing your reload times. the whole idea in the change was to STOP that advantage

sk84zer0 · August 2003

i agree xero, i usually dont even bother reloading with a hmg or shotun cuz it takes so long.

Xero · August 2003

GoldenShadow - NS is a science fiction/fantasy game. It doesn't need to be realistic. What matters is the gameplay. How can a Fade heal itself? How does redemption magically transport aliens back to the hive? It doesn't matter, so long as it promotes fun gameplay.

th0r0n^ - Not a bad idea. I think it's worth trying in a beta patch, at least.

fo_sheezy_my_neezy · August 2003

it has absolutely nothing to do with being pushed back, but I as well find it pretty harsh having to reload my hmg because I used 20 bullets to kill a skulk before I left. Marines are still behind enough that I think direct-fill for everything but GL is fine. Besides, the nerf wasn't because there was a problem with the HMG or shotty or LMG or pistol reloading directly, it was all about the GL. I just don't know if there's a way to code it for the specific weapon.

GhostBomber · August 2003

Personally, I think the game flows a lot better as a marine when I have to worry about reloading. Really. Not totally sure why, but it just seems better this way. I mean, how fair is it that I can shoot 60 bullets with an HMG, turn to my armory, tap e, then fire another 60 bullets out, and never reload? I think it's just as bad as grenade spamming.

Xero · September 2003

I understand there are difference in opinions. Some people like clip reload, some don't. But 2.0 includes it, so that must mean Flayra doesn't think it's too much of an imbalance. In fact, I believe it is more fair. The reason they did away with clip reload was specifically for the grenade launcher, so I'd like to see clip reload come back with this one exception.

Jaml · September 2003

I think ammo should go directly into the clip as in 2.0. It sucks when you run out of ammo that you have to get a clip, reload get more ammo, switch to pistol get a clip reload , get more ammo.(Man did i hated it in 1.04 where with autoload it always loaded half clips) To counter grenade spam i would add a nade counter to the armory. Say when you drop an armory the counte starts maxed out with 60 nades. Now a gl rine takes 10 nades dropping the counter to 50. From now on the armory produces 1 nade every 3 seconds till there are 60 nades again. This method would allow loading directly into the guns while stopping nade spam since once the counter reaches zero no more nades are available for the gl and the spammer would only get 1 nade every 3 secs out of the armory giving the aliens plenty of time to rush the base. And 60 nades would fill 2 gl launchers without having to wait for nades to be produced so its usually enough in normal games where usually few people in a squad are equipped with gl. And with 20 nades a minute it fills up pretty fast.

BLUNTSWORTH · September 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (GoldenShadow @ Aug 31 2003, 10:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> just because you got pushed back to your base doesn't mean you need to get a huge advantage of reducing your reload times. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
Thats exactly what it means. The hive heals you, please don't be an <span style='color:white'>be nice.</span>

Balance · September 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Xero @ Sep 1 2003, 06:12 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>GoldenShadow - NS is a science fiction/fantasy game. It doesn't need to be realistic. What matters is the gameplay. How can a Fade heal itself? How does redemption magically transport aliens back to the hive? It doesn't matter, so long as it promotes fun gameplay.

th0r0n^ - Not a bad idea. I think it's worth trying in a beta patch, at least.</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
Do consider it to be fun for everyone if few marines with good aim (like 2-3 marines) can stop 6-9 skulks rushing in waves? <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'>

How <b>fun</b> can it be?

I agree to earlier post: Reload time is there for a reason. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>

If you are afraid that your team can't fire while reloading, don't reload at the same time as others! <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'>

BLUNTSWORTH · September 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Balance @ Sep 1 2003, 06:06 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Do consider it to be fun for everyone if few marines with good aim (like 2-3 marines) can stop 6-9 skulks rushing in waves? <img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
Yes, i consider that fun. I dont consider it fun for someone to need a 1:1 skulk to marine ratio in order for you to save your base. Make some sense.

Plus that has nothing to do with the armoury. <span style='color:white'>This space used to contain pointless flaming. Now it contains some pretty daffodils. Ooo, pretty!</span>

Mythr1l · September 2003

yeah, its good GL spam is fixed, but it should auto reload, its very annoying having to fill up, then reload ur clip halfway away from the armoury <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'>

A_Damn_Fool · September 2003

I have never died from a grenade as a skulk I mean its loud as hell you here it you can see it you just either run at the shooter (if no turrets around) or back away either I've never played these "Godlike" grenade launcher users that seem to be running aroun or some people just had a really bad experiance with them.

Align · September 2003

How about light weapons only? That is, only for shotgun, LMG, and pistol.

Ollj · September 2003

no it should not refil in any gun.

fo_sheezy_my_neezy · September 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>I agree to earlier post: Reload time is there for a reason</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
exactly how dense can people possibly be? The reason there is a reload time is for reloading weapons in the field. If this wasn't so, there NEVER would have been a direct-fill FEATURE in the game. The only reason the reload time has been implemented near the armory is because of GL spam. There NEVER was a problem with an lmg, a pistol, a shotty, or an hmg reloading directly. EVER. The problem was with the GL, so isolate the GL for having to reload.

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>no it should not refil in any gun. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
Thanks OLLJ, I usually respect what you post. Usually. Give me a reason please, don't just take the nub way into and out of an argument and just say "NO NO NO IT SHOULDNT" and leave it at that. You're more intelligent than that bro.

taboofires · September 2003

Having to reload wouldn't bother me nearly as much if I didn't have to reload twice on empty. The simplest way might be to give you a whole clip (instead of half) if you have no ammo at all.

Supernorn · September 2003

i'm not too keen on the new way ammo is put into the weapons either.

like a few weeks back on hera. I've used all my GL ammo on Hit and run onos attacks on our relocated base in holoroom. So i head to the armoury to get some more. As this happens an onos strolls into base and starts eating the CC. So i go to shoot him only to find i have nothing in my clip. Hence the very very long GL reload time as my player insists on putting every single nade into the barrels. I finally get the opportunity to shoot but its far too late. I know why its there, to stop GL spammage, but its not neccessary for the other Marine weapons.

Darkseed · September 2003

Armories not refilling your current magazine is just fine IMHO, but there should be an option to turn off auto-reloading. I can't see any reason not to have that option really.

Stormy · September 2003

Hells, why not just go the whole hog and have mannable turret emplacements that never run out of ammo?

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'>

ViolenceJack · September 2003

One of the main disadvantages marines is they have to reload. some ppl have just got used to the old easy option and complain cos its gone.

look at the HMG, what are the disadvantages ment to be when u have an HMG. u walk slower and has long reload times. it was stupid to have it where they didnt have to reload with an armoury around, now ppl have gotten used to it they complain cos its gone.

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Xero @ sep 1 2003, 03:12am)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> NS is a science fiction/fantasy game. It doesn't need to be realistic. What matters is the gameplay. How can a Fade heal itself? How does redemption magically transport aliens back to the hive? It doesn't matter, so long as it promotes fun gameplay.</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

Humans in the real world can heal them selfs, ok its not as fast as the fade but whats to say its not possible to heal so fast. redemption works from cloning, the alien actualy dies but a clone is made at the hive. I think its put somin like that in the manual. humans have probably been cloned before, u just didnt hear about it <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>

SMOKEDHAM · September 2003

The armory should fill into the clip. The armory filling into the clip is the only advantage marines have in their spawn. Its not much compared to the advantages aliens have in their hives, but it gives the marines that slight edge they <b>need</b> to guard their main base.
Since this change was implemented to stop excessive GL spam, i think the best solution would be to have the armory load a single grenade at a time. (if its possible, only 1 grenade when loading into the clip, 2 when loading into the reserve)

Drk1 · September 2003

1 nade into the clip? How'll that stop GL spam? All people need is 1 nade. Just keep on humping the armory while shooting. You'll fire 1 nade then load a nade. Not much good for stopping GL spam.

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>like a few weeks back on hera. I've used all my GL ammo on Hit and run onos attacks on our relocated base in holoroom. So i head to the armoury to get some more. As this happens an onos strolls into base and starts eating the CC. So i go to shoot him only to find i have nothing in my clip. Hence the very very long GL reload time as my player insists on putting every single nade into the barrels. I finally get the opportunity to shoot but its far too late. I know why its there, to stop GL spammage, but its not neccessary for the other Marine weapons.</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

An idea for the GL tho, have it more like the shotty where you can shoot while reloading. With the shotty you can load 1 shell then fire it, if the GL was like this people wouldn't have some of the troubles.

Theres no real way to stop GL spam, 2 GLs can keep up a pretty constant stream of nades, one every few seconds. If the guy shooting doesn't waste them all at once, he can shoot and take as long as the reloading guy to empty the clip.

Stormy · September 2003

However, armouries can be dropped around the map, meaning that it is no longer a purely base-located advantage (as with the kharaa hive-healing), but can also be used in an offensive capacity to lock down areas, which is a good reason for not allowing it to load into the clip.

As for the fiction note, you can justify it in any way you like, so long as you have a good enough reasoning behind it. Plug your weapon into the armoury and nanites move into the clip and form bullets with themselves?

ViolenceJack · September 2003

what about the fact that marines can build an endless ammount of turrets at their base till the game crashes. marines can also be on the other side of a wall to destroy a hive and neva actualy need to go and look at it staying out of healing range so aliens dont get healed. aliens have to leave their hives to defend them, marines dont need to leave their base to defend it.

it be quicker to just reload than plug ur weapon into the army.

Kwil · September 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SMOKEDHAM @ Sep 1 2003, 07:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The armory should fill into the clip. The armory filling into the clip is the only advantage marines have in their spawn.  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Your commander puts the IPs somewhere other than your spawn?

Weird.

Salty_Justice · September 2003

Put an upgrade on the armoury (in the area of 20 res) that enables auto-loading for everything except GLs. This puts a price tag on enhanced defenses but guarantees that you can't drop an armoury just anywhere and get them benefits.

As another note, it sure is awful to be firing at a skulk when POP you pick up someone's shotgun, just to find it empty. Now you're helpless, and an auto-load armoury will save you. Otherwise, waste a lot of time getting ammo and loading. Oh well, you could just drop the shotgun and pickup your lmg, cursing someone else to the fate of a no ammo gun. And if that happens in the field... goodbye mr. no ammo, maybe whip out your pistol and pray you got those fast-twitch skills.

Armories Should Still Refill Your Clip

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