Ns 2.0, Balance Issue Or Shift In Priorities?
Jeb_Radec
Join Date: 2002-08-09 Member: 1128Members
Join Date: 2002-08-09 Member: 1128Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Strats could be to blame.</div> After reading balancing thread after balancing thread I started thinking and although that’s not my strong suite I fought through the smoke my poor 2 stroke brain was pouring out and came up with this:
In 1.04 Hives where everything for both marines and aliens, marines needed to hold hives or die because of what they gave to the aliens. It was that simple. But in 2.0 take a look at what Hive 2 actually gives to the aliens, a very nerfed umbra, that stupid fade healing, stomp is pretty good but CERTAINLY not a game turner. And bile bomb which is actually pretty good. But still NONE of these are the game deciders that Hive 2 provided the aliens in 1.04. The fade, that was the game turner, now still higher life forms decide the game but Hives are no longer needed! Res, the all mighty buck, that is the game decider, marines have a difficult time expanding b/c of what it takes to hold a node, now I'm not saying this is bad. But aliens in 99.99999% of all games can move around 99.99999% of the map unchecked building node after node, THIS MY FRIENDS is the crucial balancing issue.
Marines MUST attack nodes with the ferocity they attacked Hives in 1.04, it is the only way to prevent the higher life forms. Remember the last ditch Hive JP/HMG rush in 1.04? We need to find the 2.0 equivalent and I believe it lies in res hunters, u have to have a highly mobile team CONSTANTLY knocking out alien res nodes. Unfortunately this is a very difficult thing to practice in game. Alien res towers still cost too damn little, they can rebuild them to fast. Forlorn had a very good point in his balancing post, alien res is simply worth much much more then marine res. So the fact that we keep killing non-res producing hives and leaving their cheap nodes alone is the problem. F*CK THE HIVE PEOPLE!!!! let that lerk umbra till his hearts content b/c we got their nodes, he won’t be supporting fades or onos b/c they wont have the damn res.
Two balancing ideas to augment the strat "balancing":
1. Make alien RTs either cost more or have an activation time like the marine res (do the marine RTs actually have that 60 second timer? they don’t seem to but it’s in the change log)
2. Give alien RTs a lot less health so they MUST spend res and man power to defend them. If they don’t a highly mobile rine team could then actually take them out b4 being eaten.
In 1.04 Hives where everything for both marines and aliens, marines needed to hold hives or die because of what they gave to the aliens. It was that simple. But in 2.0 take a look at what Hive 2 actually gives to the aliens, a very nerfed umbra, that stupid fade healing, stomp is pretty good but CERTAINLY not a game turner. And bile bomb which is actually pretty good. But still NONE of these are the game deciders that Hive 2 provided the aliens in 1.04. The fade, that was the game turner, now still higher life forms decide the game but Hives are no longer needed! Res, the all mighty buck, that is the game decider, marines have a difficult time expanding b/c of what it takes to hold a node, now I'm not saying this is bad. But aliens in 99.99999% of all games can move around 99.99999% of the map unchecked building node after node, THIS MY FRIENDS is the crucial balancing issue.
Marines MUST attack nodes with the ferocity they attacked Hives in 1.04, it is the only way to prevent the higher life forms. Remember the last ditch Hive JP/HMG rush in 1.04? We need to find the 2.0 equivalent and I believe it lies in res hunters, u have to have a highly mobile team CONSTANTLY knocking out alien res nodes. Unfortunately this is a very difficult thing to practice in game. Alien res towers still cost too damn little, they can rebuild them to fast. Forlorn had a very good point in his balancing post, alien res is simply worth much much more then marine res. So the fact that we keep killing non-res producing hives and leaving their cheap nodes alone is the problem. F*CK THE HIVE PEOPLE!!!! let that lerk umbra till his hearts content b/c we got their nodes, he won’t be supporting fades or onos b/c they wont have the damn res.
Two balancing ideas to augment the strat "balancing":
1. Make alien RTs either cost more or have an activation time like the marine res (do the marine RTs actually have that 60 second timer? they don’t seem to but it’s in the change log)
2. Give alien RTs a lot less health so they MUST spend res and man power to defend them. If they don’t a highly mobile rine team could then actually take them out b4 being eaten.
Comments
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...balancing thread after balancing thread...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You do realize your balance thread <b>is</b> adding to the number of balance threads out there. And just because <b>this</b> balance thread is <b>yours</b>, doesn't make it any more special than the rest. Theres nothing that posting more and more balance threads can do. Helpful advice and constructive criticism are good, but telling people what <b>you want</b> to be changed in the game doesn not solve any problems. If you're not happy with the game, don't play it. Its that simple.
Simple ways to cut down alien expansion:
- Gorge costs 15 res, allowing them to NOT be able to build every RT on the map right away
- Alien RT costs 20 res, same basic thing concept, just changing a different value
- Marines start with...lets say, 20 more res, 120 res total.
- All alien chambers cost 15-20 res, this would slow the aliens down quite a bit.
Aliens can basicly conquer most of the map before the Marines can accomplish anything. Thats the problem with 2.0, and nothing more.
Aliens are too strong! Nerf these three things and make the Marines better. Crap! Now the marines are too much better! Nerf a couple things and make the Aliens better. Damn! Now the Aliens are way better again!
Ad nauseum.
First off team work is absolutly so f*ing essential that you must have a good team. The commander MUST be fast, assertive, and most of all, liked and trusted by the team so they will follow his orders that many people find to be too far out there.
Second this is not for a quick win, these games will probably be around 30 min if not a bit more. The marines can't have large expansion bases that tie them up in supporting them, You entire team needs to be devoted to hunting down alien RTs.
Now these two things are the ground work for this strategy, these are all I had in the first game and we lost horribly. Then in the second game i realized even with the entire team hunting for res you can't be as responsive as you need to be. The absolute KEY to this strategy is knowing exactly where the alien RTs are as soon as possible, it will take several determined attacks to take one RT if the aliens are even half way decent. So how do you get this intel? Observitories, thats right this needs to be one of the first things you build. I dont have a concrete build order yet but it needs to be right up there with your armory and first RT (first and only for a very long time, can't split your forces to defend multiple RTs if the aliens are good). Then you use this Ob to scan sweep res nodes. The second you find one route your entire strike force (the majority of your team) to it and kill it. It probably will take several tries.
This still needs some work but every game I'v played it worked even better then the game before as i prefected the strat. Try it for a few games and tell me what you think.
Throwing wave after wave of marines into the double res, and you get a grind of 5-10 minutes, with Aliens invariably being better off after it. The marines wil be licking their wounds, while the Aliens will be chuckling with their brand new shiny (gooey?) hive.
The battle for the double res is often a smokescreen for them to get their hive(s) up. And I wish commanders would forget it, until lockdowns and upgrades are accomplished.
"What Comm? You DONT want the double res? What a nub! Vote him out!"
Bile bombs change games. The second hive changes the game. And noone in the universe is gonna tell me otherwise.
But I'll try any strat once <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->