Armor Vs Weapons

n4s7y · August 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">Hmm...</div> For some reason, some of the best players (pubbies and clannies) all prefer weapon upgrades first. The fact that armor lets them live through one more skulk bite doesn't convince them. I've seen players upgrade weapon x3 and either ignore armor or upgrade it later. What's your upgrade order? Why?

ZiGGY · August 2003

somepeople believe that if a skulk gets in range to do damage youll die regardless. this is probably more likely in larger groups though completely debatable.

Sarisel · August 2003

Depends on alien upgrades.

If defense first, I'd go for weapons upgrades before armor. Not all three of course. Maybe w1, then w2, then a1, and then see what is needed when I'm finished.

If sensory or movement first I'd go for armor. Armor will allow a marine to take one more bite against a cloaked skulk. Same for the silence. So in these cases I usually go a1, w1, a2, and then work from there. You really need the weapons upgrade before you get the second armor in my opinion.

In combinations though it gets trickier. I don't prefer to upgrade weapons and leave armor alone.

Spazmatic · August 2003

I generally always grab a1 and w1 first, though order depends on chamber/tactics/my marines' skill. After that, I grab w2 and w3, since I find the armor to be less useful than big arse guns at that point (maybe because my dudes are in big groups facing guys who do big damage?)

Silent-Turtle · August 2003

well, more people get weapons first casue we group up, so we armour is less useful since we usually kill all da skulks that try running into us, and if were facing cloaked skulks, the skulk usually takes 1 marine down and the rest kills it. But i'd say armour is more useful, cause the alien upgrade cycle usually goes liek this: sensory (many aliens prefer this, cloaking, moving around while cloaked, and having cloaked structures is quite good for them) , defence 2nd (at this point someone will be close to having 100 res for onos, so redemption will help them out), and finally movement 3rd.

sometimes i might suggest getting motion tracking first, than armour, but this is only sometimes (armour is less expesnive than motion tracking)

Spazmatic · August 2003

Well, I'm not referring to mt... Just weapons versus armor. MT and armory upgrade are a whole 'nother can o' worms.

And, really, weapons are more useful in a lot of respects... Oni don't care about your armor, really. You're fast food no matter how you look at it. L3 shotties, on the other hand, that makes an oni go "HOLY!"

Kid-A · August 2003

I say weapons, maybe armour as an sens counter but scanning is a better sens counter....

The fact is marines should ALWAYS be in a position where they will get a decent amount of shooting at any incoming aliens. Unless its really not possible which is rare, except with sens.

If people thought more about their environment they'd do alot better as marines. The amount of times I see two marines close together just asking for a skulk to eat them up. Even defending places people think that hopping in the middle of the room is the best place to stand, then a skulk leaps in and bites off their face. In a corner however is a different story...

Imrik · August 2003

omg! i was in this game once where there was like this CRAZY armor bonus on the skulks and i totally rushed them with my knife and i cut through them, and then i spun around and was like dodging bullets everywhere and no one could touch me. The skulks all tried to bite me but I was just like "yeaaaaaa" and I kept on shooting them and slicing them up with my knife.
So don't mess with the armor, man. It'll totally own you.

Imrik · August 2003

Oh wow guys. Sorry about that. Just ignore that last post - crazy younger brother. Sorry.

As for my opinions on this....

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'>

Marines should always stay in a group. Generally there is enough safety in numbers to make the armor bonus less important than the weapon bonus. I always go with weapon first, usually going to two before even considering armor. However, i'm sure armor has its uses.
Whenever I command, I ask my marines which they would like more, after the first weapon upgrade.

Necrosis · August 2003

IMHO upgradewise, its situational.

If they go Def first, then you'll probably want better guns to counter. If they're exceptionally good aliens, you might want to armour up.

I'd be wary about asking the marines, more honestly I'd listen to their reports from the front and watch them die. If they die quickly, go def so they can live long enough to fire. And so on.

Asking them seems to be a sign of insecurity, at least until you get weapons and can ask preferences of HMG or GL.

Soberana · August 2003

Armor lvl1 always... that gives your marines confidence and survival. Instead of a skulk charging a group and killing 3, he may end up only killing 1 or none at all.

DrunkenSailor · August 2003

One of the best reasons to take weapons before armor is turrets. Every weapons upgrade you take helps improve the turrets you've probably got in MS and maybe a hive or a dual node room, in addition to the increased marine firepower. Armor, though, does nothing for turrets.

Also, if upgrades affect knives (?), marines will be able to rip through rt's faster. Again, armor does nothing here.

Anderval · August 2003

During the tail end of 1.04 carapace used to come very early for skulks so instead of lvl1 armour lvl1 wep became popular again (weakened skulks by 20%).

In 2.0 however with the new stronger skulk (i.e. armour that lasts until the skulk runs our of life) lvl1 weapons dont recduce the skulks bullets to kill as it used to, whereas with lvl1 armour an ambushed marine (and lets face it most marines are ambushed these days) can have the time to react and kill the skulk. However regardless of the first upgrade be it lvl1 armour or lvl1 weapons, getting lvl2 weapons should be your next objective as this is 2.0's lvl1 weapon equiv and will make skulks much easier for your marines to kill (11 lmg to 9 for non carapace).

Edit: Not absolutly sure but i dont think weapons upgrades affect the knife damage (30). Weapon upgrades are very useful for turning pesky sentrys, into Onos killing Uber turrets though.

Ryan · August 2003

I also look in the long run- if an onos/fade gets close, those few extra armor points arent gonna help a whole lot. The weapon ups help isure they dont get that close.

Stoneburg · August 2003

a1, w1, w2, w3, a2, a3

Ollj · August 2003

... > attack > expand > defend > attack > ...
Attack = Movement chambers. - Weapon upgrades ...
Expand = Sensory chambers. - Protolab, phasegate, electrtify ....
Defend = Defense chambers. - Armor upgrades ...

simple theory.

Armor Vs Weapons

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