Admin Ettiqute With Suspected Cheaters
imsuxok
Join Date: 2002-12-04 Member: 10441Members
Join Date: 2002-12-04 Member: 10441Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Would a bit of courtesy be out of order?</div> I'm hesitant to post a thread like this, for fear that I may get flamed for bragging or other such nonsense. However, due to my continuing problems, here it is...
I get accused of cheating fairly often. I don't mind the accusations themselves, because I don't cheat; However, what I do take issue with is the way I am dealt with by most server admins. The only way I begin to suspect that I have been accused of cheating is when I get kicked to console. I have <b>never</b> received a message with any one of my numerous kicks. For all I know, I may have been kicked because a reserved slot was activated. Upon rejoining most servers to inquire as to why I was kicked, I rarely get a line of text typed before I am kicked and banned.
The ambiguity in the process is what really irks me. If an admin is assured of my guilt and is compelled to the point of kicking/banning me, is it so hard for them to make that clear? One line of text is all it takes. I'd be overjoyed to get kicked with a message that says "**** off. No cheaters on this server."
In an ideal world, I would like server admins to record a demo of my play and then confront me with an accusation of cheating. However, that is time consuming and is more work for someone who is already doing an unpaid job. So, I'll just request this: <i>The next time you feel like kicking someone, at least have the courtesy to tell them why they are being kicked and point them toward a forum (if the server has one) where they can defend themselves.</i>
edit: butchered the spelling of "etiquette" in the title. Would appreciate it if a mod could fix that. Thanks <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I get accused of cheating fairly often. I don't mind the accusations themselves, because I don't cheat; However, what I do take issue with is the way I am dealt with by most server admins. The only way I begin to suspect that I have been accused of cheating is when I get kicked to console. I have <b>never</b> received a message with any one of my numerous kicks. For all I know, I may have been kicked because a reserved slot was activated. Upon rejoining most servers to inquire as to why I was kicked, I rarely get a line of text typed before I am kicked and banned.
The ambiguity in the process is what really irks me. If an admin is assured of my guilt and is compelled to the point of kicking/banning me, is it so hard for them to make that clear? One line of text is all it takes. I'd be overjoyed to get kicked with a message that says "**** off. No cheaters on this server."
In an ideal world, I would like server admins to record a demo of my play and then confront me with an accusation of cheating. However, that is time consuming and is more work for someone who is already doing an unpaid job. So, I'll just request this: <i>The next time you feel like kicking someone, at least have the courtesy to tell them why they are being kicked and point them toward a forum (if the server has one) where they can defend themselves.</i>
edit: butchered the spelling of "etiquette" in the title. Would appreciate it if a mod could fix that. Thanks <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Comments
It's nice to see a server with a well defined policy on cheating.
It seems to me that the logical step would be to have your server admins submit gameplay demos to you. It would make your job easier and reduce the possibility of innocents being banned.
Some solutions are too simple.
Some solutions are too simple. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The vast majority of servers don't run cheating death. That's really beside the point, however. I'm trying to address the issue of admin conduct.
Cheaters ruin the game for everyone, they have issues. Play with CD on CD servers. My own experience is that CD req'd servers attract the better players anyway. Good players simply get fed up with the cheaters on unprotected public servers. Punks are usually too lazy or scared to run CD.
CD isn't fool proof but it does trap all but the most sophisticated cheats.
They don't last long, the UA-I team and the UA-AC team are all over it. Many of times in our private channel i've see someone report a cheat they bypasses CD, then hullu replies "i know, already fixed in this next verstion"
There are a lot of CD required servers, so you should just check out one of those.
Not that any of that excuses their behavior. Just kicking someone is a lot easier then arguing with them about whether or not they're cheating, but it's still rude. Yeah, you probably deserve a better explaination as to why you got kicked, but face it... You're dealing with real people, and rudeness is the order of the day. People, in general, are rude. Expect it. Occasionally you will be pleasantly surprized by someone who isn't, but as a general rule, just deal. There's really nothing you can do to change people, and in all probability you'll just make them angrier by complaining about it.
Take a deep breath, hold it for a sec, exhale slowly and just... let it go.
I recommend you check out the h20 servers.
Also at: <a href='http://www.h2ocs.com' target='_blank'>http://www.h2ocs.com</a>
MANY admins believe themselfs to be the dogs bollocks at the game on thier server, the believe noone can defeat them.
when you do overcome them time and time again, thro the use of your eyes and ears, and a quick mouse hand, there are two outcomes:
Outcome 1: You are on a clan server, the admin asks you if you would like to trial/join the clan.
Outcome 2: Either on a clan server or public, the admin kick/bans you without a word of warning.
I have found outcome 2 can depend on a few things, nationality (not going to say who is worst for it), age of admin, previous games (you will find if the admin was a TFC admin or anyother game apart from CS basically, that they are more willing to accept they are not so amazing and that joe public may be able to beat them) and mood of the admin.
there are ways to avoid being kicked from servers, even if you have 60 kills to 0 deaths and everyones calling hax:
A) dont rise to it, accept they think it, and take it as a compliment.
B) dont use words like "owned" when u take out 3 or 4 of the other team.
C) just generally be nice on the servers (elite speak is bad maners, and will bring admin wrath to those suspected of cheating).
Have fun in your quest to not be banned <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> good luck
Some solutions are too simple. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The vast majority of servers don't run cheating death. That's really beside the point, however. I'm trying to address the issue of admin conduct. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
*BZZZZZZT* Wrong!
I occasionally do profiles of all NS servers to determine how many run Cheating-Death. My last count, on June 14th, showed that 31.7% of all Natural-Selection servers run Cheating-Death. Now, it is true that the majority of servers don't run cheating death, but I'm afraid that 68.3% is most certainly NOT the "vast majority".
My last count showed 111 servers running Cheating-Death. They're not exactly hard to find.
Some solutions are too simple. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The vast majority of servers don't run cheating death. That's really beside the point, however. I'm trying to address the issue of admin conduct. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
*BZZZZZZT* Wrong!
I occasionally do profiles of all NS servers to determine how many run Cheating-Death. My last count, on June 14th, showed that 31.7% of all Natural-Selection servers run Cheating-Death. Now, it is true that the majority of servers don't run cheating death, but I'm afraid that 68.3% is most certainly NOT the "vast majority".
My last count showed 111 servers running Cheating-Death. They're not exactly hard to find. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Fair enough. I honestly didn't know there were that many.
I only get <150 pings to a handful of servers, so I guess the small sample of servers I tend to frequent skews my opinion.
It's condescending responses like this that curtail any attempt at rational discussion. I made this post to discuss the way admins conduct themselves; My personal accounts were included to illustrate my points, not to win sympathy or attention, or make me the center of the universe as you so hyperbolically put it.
Kindly keep your snide remarks to yourself if you have nothing more to add to the discourse.
The first was on my clan's server. I suspected him of using a wallhack, and possibly an aimbot, though the wallhack was what seemed to be most apparent. After noticing it myself, several team members complained to me. I spectated him for a while, and noticed all the signs of a wallhacker (Stares at walls, runs into walls, knows where enemy is when he can't see them), but wasn't completely sure. Instead of kicking him, I simply reported him to the clan leader. The clan leader decided to ban him.
The second was on TheVille 5... A fellow who was using the tag "*[MGN]Viper" (with random letter case of course). His use of the common ClanMod exploit (a * before one's name hides you from the ClanMod player list) didn't exactly give him a favourable impression. But it was his obvious use of an aimbot that was his primary offence. He litterally never missed. Ever. No matter how fast you moved, how little of you he saw, or how close you were, he always ALWAYS hit. While playing alien, he was the best lerk I had ever seen, flying madly about the room killing marine after marine despite the fact that he was moving quite rapidly. Even though he was on our own team we began to suspect. Then he went marine, and this cemented it for us. The only times anyone was able to kill him was when he was reloading. After he racked up a rediculous number of kills, and completely locked down Viaduct as an unupgraded marine with nothing but an LMG, it was obvious to the entire alien team that he was cheating, and even several members of his own team were convinced. Having no admins present, we attempted to get him to leave, but he wouldn't budge. After the game I filed a complaint, and when the server admin reviewed the logs, he was banned.
As of yet I have not seen, on my clan's server, or on a public server, someone be banned without just cause. However kicks usually just look like the player left to the rest of the server, so if a player was kicked without warning I suppose I would not know it.
I get accused of cheating fairly often. I don't mind the accusations themselves, because I don't cheat; However, what I do take issue with is the way I am dealt with by most server admins. The only way I begin to suspect that I have been accused of cheating is when I get kicked to console. I have <b>never</b> received a message with any one of my numerous kicks. For all I know, I may have been kicked because a reserved slot was activated. Upon rejoining most servers to inquire as to why I was kicked, I rarely get a line of text typed before I am kicked and banned.
The ambiguity in the process is what really irks me. If an admin is assured of my guilt and is compelled to the point of kicking/banning me, is it so hard for them to make that clear? One line of text is all it takes. I'd be overjoyed to get kicked with a message that says "**** off. No cheaters on this server."
In an ideal world, I would like server admins to record a demo of my play and then confront me with an accusation of cheating. However, that is time consuming and is more work for someone who is already doing an unpaid job. So, I'll just request this: <i>The next time you feel like kicking someone, at least have the courtesy to tell them why they are being kicked and point them toward a forum (if the server has one) where they can defend themselves.</i>
edit: butchered the spelling of "etiquette" in the title. Would appreciate it if a mod could fix that. Thanks <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Go to my server man, I'm better then CHi :-p
Cheating is much harder to spot and it would be unfair to kick someone without allowing them to defend themselves. We make a point of letting players know in the consgreet what is and isn't allowed, what the servers about and where to contact the admins if things go wrong.
I have luckily never had to kick someone for cheating. I have suspected a few but I sit back, remain quiet and gain evidence. So far before I am 100% sure they leave or I am convinced of their innocence. The problem is a cheater will always claim not to be, and strangely so will someone who doesn't cheat so asking is pretty pointless, it comes down to 'do you trust this person'. If you already have strong suspicions of them cheating then the answer is no.
Cheaters on internet games get less than 0 respect. No even worth talking to so thats probably why you dont get a warning. Yes it's rude, but why be polite to a cheater? Hopefully with 1st person view in 2.0 we can tell the skilled from the cheater a little easier.
When we're running again come over to Roob's new server and see if you can pwn some of our better players <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
It's nice to see a server with a well defined policy on cheating.
It seems to me that the logical step would be to have your server admins submit gameplay demos to you. It would make your job easier and reduce the possibility of innocents being banned. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
rthe problem atm is metamods epxloiters ad yes lots of hackers, but what i have found out is server admins wont kick of temp ban own clan members for exploiting, thyis is not on, how is a clan ment to be creditable if they can't even deal with the cheaters/exploiters in their own clan. In my book this adds to the tarnish of a clan makig it known for cheating, because if you condone it you must do it.
This is why i retracted my clan from ns because of this. I have a hudge break from ns which is good coz if you seen me on comm you know i can be that dam loud brit <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Anyhow i return to find half my clan on the server we norm play and have joined that clan, and also find the ones with comon sense have left coz they do not find the admins to be good at dealing with exploiters and cheaters. Also they feel that certain clan members are to good for realism.
I find other mods like DoD have better admins in general, not good but better, and less cheaters.
I know this is due to the VAC support etc... but I will find in v2.0 that not much will change in this side, even is the gameplay is better to make up for it.
(I got so stressed out today with noobs i teached em all how to wipe their own bottoms)
Can someone plz pm me or post some good admin'd servers so i can at least have a decent game, and i will make sure ppl know how to mute loud me <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
zippy
<a href='http://www.unitedadmins.com/cdeath-dl.php' target='_blank'>http://www.unitedadmins.com/cdeath-dl.php</a>
United Admin news-mailinglist (important for admins):
<a href='http://list.unitedadmins.com/mailman/listinfo/news' target='_blank'>http://list.unitedadmins.com/mailman/listinfo/news</a>
But is it possible to upgrade CD without restarting the server?
in linux (since it uses softlocks) you can overwite the file and then on the map change it will load the new version. If your using winblows your SOL
CD will not unload once its loaded...it will reload on the map change thus updating the cd version