i wish ppl would stop whining about whiners <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> we're just all very excited about 1.1 and wanna discuss it <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--James H4xwell+May 30 2003, 07:44 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (James H4xwell @ May 30 2003, 07:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Umbraed Monkey+May 30 2003, 06:17 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Umbraed Monkey @ May 30 2003, 06:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I gotta say, i thought there would be a more offensive ability in the fade's 'mystery slot'. Im a little dissappointed, if you will. And if the game plays a sound when this is activiated, wouldnt the marines just...stop shooting for (literally) a sec?
also, id like to slip in a suggestion...wouldnt this be better as a movement upgrade? it would be a passive thing, where the alien would get a bit of energy for getting hit (taking damage, however). silence would then be moved to the sensory's upgrades, filling in for pheroumns (however its spelt). Doesnt it make sense? <b>metabolism=> movement, silence => sensory</b>. and it sounds fitting too... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> ok stack of 10 mines.... you have 10 hp.... metabolize and run through the mine wall. FULL HP! also, nade spam, metabolize and run into it, FULL HP! HMGer rounds corner, METABOLIZE AND CLAW! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> assuming you didnt understand the original description of the ability, you still shoulda understood what Metabolize is and what im suggesting...if you read my post. *sigh* non-reading posters these days..
What I said in my post was just my idea of how Metabolize could be implemented and be balanced, as you would never be able to do it twice in battle and it would require extreme planning. I am unsure of the actual energy costs and my statement about time and increased speed are completely fictional. Please stop using my post as a reference to how the ability works, it is just my balancing speculation.
k, dont whine about things we dont know... so ill whine about the fact that the name has no easy shortening for n-game speed typing.. omg he is meta-, RUN!
doesnt sound right, we need a name with a differentiable first syllable <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Zel+May 31 2003, 09:21 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Zel @ May 31 2003, 09:21 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> k, dont whine about things we dont know... so ill whine about the fact that the name has no easy shortening for n-game speed typing.. omg he is meta-, RUN!
doesnt sound right, we need a name with a differentiable first syllable <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> how about
"Whaddaya mean, M-ing? Morphing? Shouldn't we shoot the egg before the onos comes out then? Moving? Run after him? Mocking us? Let's shoot him to get our revenge then!"
The "pull" idea mentioned sounds much cooler and more in tune with the atmosphere. plus it can counter jetpacks.
<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=5&t=32496&hl=pull' target='_blank'>Pull Idea Link</a>
Pull a marine from the armory and have your way with him... Or notice a HMG is reloading and trying to duck behind a wall.... pull him out of cover for more abuse
<!--QuoteBegin--Dogg+May 31 2003, 05:52 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dogg @ May 31 2003, 05:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The "pull" idea mentioned sounds much cooler and more in tune with the atmosphere. plus it can counter jetpacks. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeehaaww! Round up the 'rines boys, it's time to put 'em back in the barn were they belong! *imagines fades with cowboy hats riding on onos*
Ok did i misread? or does the changelog mention nothing of invurnability, It doesnt say in increases HP, only energy..... I assumed if u metabolise, change to acid rocket and aslong as you are taking damage you could acid rocket 6, 7, 8, or nine times without having to wait for energy for one...... But thats how i read it and interpreted it with the information supplied.
i figured metabolize's main purpose was <i>one second of invulnerability</i> for helping its role as a shock troop. this 1 second is to help you close the distance and survive while taking fire.
i thought that the ability to regain energy spent by using this was a <i>bonus</i> if you were SMART in using it that you could get your energy expenditure back, NO MORE. it's main purpose is not to fill energy, but to take the full brunt of marine fire...
why are people talking about constant invincibility?? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
I have no idea what you guys are complaining about. I gives you just one second of invulnerability, and refills energy instead of you taking damage. You don't hold the fire button or anything, just click and for one second you get energy for damage.
Whoever it was that said you could use it again when you had the energy... firing rates. It can be set to have a minute-long delay between "shots".
Also, the "blink metabolize claw blink" strategy probably would not work, if metabolize drains enough energy when you use it.
Could someone quote the part that says anything about invincibility?.... i must have misread it or be totaly blind to it, but from what i see it says
O New Fade Hive #2 ability: Metabolize. Drains energy when used, but for the next second, converts incoming damage into energy. Depends player knowing when he's going to get hit, and using it to maximize his energy. (kinda like the Utwig from Star Control II). Sounds are placeholder.
Perhaps the Utwig recieves invincibility, BUT the word kinda makes the actual paragraph the true defination...
the energy bar if im not mistaken is the bar at the bottom right of the screen, when you bite as skulk it decreases.
My interpretation of metabolism is this.
You use the ability. your energy begins to drain much like an onos's energy drains when you charge with him just now. but if you take damage for the alloted time it boosts your energy back up to ultimately full. (energy being the stuff needed to make attacks not the health of the creature...
I just cant see where the invincibility part is....
Since it is compared to Utwig, it might cause invincibility... then again, it might not. We'll know for sure when Flayra elaborates or we get the chance to try it out ourselves.
matsoMaster of PatchesJoin Date: 2002-11-05Member: 7000Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, Reinforced - Shadow, NS2 Community Developer
<!--QuoteBegin--DarkFrost+May 31 2003, 01:25 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DarkFrost @ May 31 2003, 01:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> O New Fade Hive #2 ability: Metabolize. Drains energy when used, but for the next second, converts incoming damage into energy.
*snip*
I just cant see where the invincibility part is.... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
"convert damage to energy" - the usual meaning of convert would imply that ALL damage taken would be translated to energy, meaning that NO damage is taken for a second.
Another word for not taking any damage is invulnerability.
The real question is of course if you can chain-metabolize. While not a very good way to attack (if you manage to time it perfectly, you might get in one attack in every meta-period, but risking not having enough energy for the next attack then), it would be an excellent way of getting marines to waste ammo or wading through minefields.
Not very hard to stop for a marine though - just stop fireing for a moment, and the chaining is broken.
Now that they've gotten a chance to see it in action, can we get the verdict from the PTs/Vets on Metabolize? Do you foresee a lot of changes to it, or is it well-balanced right off the bat?
I think the anti mine aspect is cool, from what ive heard mines are overpowered in 1.1 and its nice to be able to take em out easily, fade REALLY need the power to kill mines since they 'lost' acid rocket at the 2 hive stage.
also yeah, the quote definatly implies that the effect is limited by time not energy, hence 1 second is all you get, use it well.
I also have no clue what people are complaining about with this unlimited invincibility thing. How Metabolize works, as I understand it:
1.) Fade hits Metabolize. A portion of his energy is immediately used(not confirmed how much). 2.) For the next ONE SECOND, the Fade is immune to damage, and all "damage"(bullets at least, mines/nades too presumably) taken is instead used to refill the Fade's energy. 3.) After the one second is up, Metabolize drops and the Fade is as normal. Whether or not there is a reuse timer to prevent Meta-spamming is not known.
Guys, it's been said many times already. Metabolize's primary purpose is a simple one second of invurnerability: all the energy gain does is allow them to regain their investment if the Meta is timed properly. It allows Fades to act as shock troops, by letting them close the distance with marines without getting shot down before they start swiping. This is especially important now that Fades can't get Acid Rocket till Hive 3, so they will usually need to get up close to do any damage at all. The only other real purpose is to allow Fades to act as the Hive 2 minesweepers that they were in 1.04, by hitting Meta and slamming into a minefield to clear them out for teammates.
The invurnerability is in no way "uber" - it's extremely limited, and in combat is only viable for letting Fades get closer to Marines before they start eating lead. That's it, end of story. What's the big deal? The only way Meta could ever give a Fade longterm invurnerability is if there is no reuse time, and even then you wouldn't be able to attack and if the Marines stop shooting at you for one second the chain is broken.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> con·vert ( P ) Pronunciation Key (kn-vûrt) v. con·vert·ed, con·vert·ing, con·verts v. tr. To change (something) into another form, substance, state, or product; transform: convert water into ice. To change (something) from one use, function, or purpose to another; adapt to a new or different purpose: convert a forest into farmland. To persuade or induce to adopt a particular religion, faith, or belief: convert pagans to Christianity; was converted to pacifism by the war. To exchange for something of equal value: convert assets into cash. To exchange (a security, for example) by substituting an equivalent of another form. To express (a quantity) in alternative units: converting feet into meters. Logic. To transform (a proposition) by conversion. Law. To appropriate (another's property) without right to one's own use. To change (property) from real to personal or from joint to separate or vice versa. Sports. To complete (a conversion, penalty shot, or free throw) successfully. To score (a spare) in bowling. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Comments
we're just all very excited about 1.1 and wanna discuss it <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
also, id like to slip in a suggestion...wouldnt this be better as a movement upgrade? it would be a passive thing, where the alien would get a bit of energy for getting hit (taking damage, however). silence would then be moved to the sensory's upgrades, filling in for pheroumns (however its spelt). Doesnt it make sense? <b>metabolism=> movement, silence => sensory</b>. and it sounds fitting too... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
ok stack of 10 mines.... you have 10 hp.... metabolize and run through the mine wall. FULL HP! also, nade spam, metabolize and run into it, FULL HP! HMGer rounds corner, METABOLIZE AND CLAW! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
assuming you didnt understand the original description of the ability, you still shoulda understood what Metabolize is and what im suggesting...if you read my post. *sigh* non-reading posters these days..
doesnt sound right, we need a name with a differentiable first syllable <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
doesnt sound right, we need a name with a differentiable first syllable <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
how about
oh no... hes m-ing... run!
<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=5&t=32496&hl=pull' target='_blank'>Pull Idea Link</a>
Pull a marine from the armory and have your way with him...
Or notice a HMG is reloading and trying to duck behind a wall.... pull him out of cover for more abuse
Fun fun fun!
Yeehaaww! Round up the 'rines boys, it's time to put 'em back in the barn were they belong!
*imagines fades with cowboy hats riding on onos*
i figured metabolize's main purpose was <i>one second of invulnerability</i> for helping its role as a shock troop. this 1 second is to help you close the distance and survive while taking fire.
i thought that the ability to regain energy spent by using this was a <i>bonus</i> if you were SMART in using it that you could get your energy expenditure back, NO MORE. it's main purpose is not to fill energy, but to take the full brunt of marine fire...
why are people talking about constant invincibility?? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
I have no idea what you guys are complaining about. I gives you just one second of invulnerability, and refills energy instead of you taking damage. You don't hold the fire button or anything, just click and for one second you get energy for damage.
Whoever it was that said you could use it again when you had the energy... firing rates. It can be set to have a minute-long delay between "shots".
Also, the "blink metabolize claw blink" strategy probably would not work, if metabolize drains enough energy when you use it.
O New Fade Hive #2 ability: Metabolize. Drains energy when used, but for the next second, converts incoming damage into energy. Depends player knowing when he's going to get hit, and using it to maximize his energy. (kinda like the Utwig from Star Control II). Sounds are placeholder.
Perhaps the Utwig recieves invincibility, BUT the word kinda makes the actual paragraph the true defination...
the energy bar if im not mistaken is the bar at the bottom right of the screen, when you bite as skulk it decreases.
My interpretation of metabolism is this.
You use the ability. your energy begins to drain much like an onos's energy drains when you charge with him just now. but if you take damage for the alloted time it boosts your energy back up to ultimately full. (energy being the stuff needed to make attacks not the health of the creature...
I just cant see where the invincibility part is....
*snip*
I just cant see where the invincibility part is.... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
"convert damage to energy" - the usual meaning of convert would imply that ALL damage taken would be translated to energy, meaning that NO damage is taken for a second.
Another word for not taking any damage is invulnerability.
The real question is of course if you can chain-metabolize. While not a very good way to attack (if you manage to time it perfectly, you might get in one attack in every meta-period, but risking not having enough energy for the next attack then), it would be an excellent way of getting marines to waste ammo or wading through minefields.
Not very hard to stop for a marine though - just stop fireing for a moment, and the chaining is broken.
also yeah, the quote definatly implies that the effect is limited by time not energy, hence 1 second is all you get, use it well.
1.) Fade hits Metabolize. A portion of his energy is immediately used(not confirmed how much).
2.) For the next ONE SECOND, the Fade is immune to damage, and all "damage"(bullets at least, mines/nades too presumably) taken is instead used to refill the Fade's energy.
3.) After the one second is up, Metabolize drops and the Fade is as normal. Whether or not there is a reuse timer to prevent Meta-spamming is not known.
Guys, it's been said many times already. Metabolize's primary purpose is a simple one second of invurnerability: all the energy gain does is allow them to regain their investment if the Meta is timed properly. It allows Fades to act as shock troops, by letting them close the distance with marines without getting shot down before they start swiping. This is especially important now that Fades can't get Acid Rocket till Hive 3, so they will usually need to get up close to do any damage at all. The only other real purpose is to allow Fades to act as the Hive 2 minesweepers that they were in 1.04, by hitting Meta and slamming into a minefield to clear them out for teammates.
The invurnerability is in no way "uber" - it's extremely limited, and in combat is only viable for letting Fades get closer to Marines before they start eating lead. That's it, end of story. What's the big deal? The only way Meta could ever give a Fade longterm invurnerability is if there is no reuse time, and even then you wouldn't be able to attack and if the Marines stop shooting at you for one second the chain is broken.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
con·vert ( P ) Pronunciation Key (kn-vûrt)
v. con·vert·ed, con·vert·ing, con·verts
v. tr.
To change (something) into another form, substance, state, or product; transform: convert water into ice.
To change (something) from one use, function, or purpose to another; adapt to a new or different purpose: convert a forest into farmland.
To persuade or induce to adopt a particular religion, faith, or belief: convert pagans to Christianity; was converted to pacifism by the war.
To exchange for something of equal value: convert assets into cash.
To exchange (a security, for example) by substituting an equivalent of another form.
To express (a quantity) in alternative units: converting feet into meters.
Logic. To transform (a proposition) by conversion.
Law.
To appropriate (another's property) without right to one's own use.
To change (property) from real to personal or from joint to separate or vice versa.
Sports.
To complete (a conversion, penalty shot, or free throw) successfully.
To score (a spare) in bowling. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->