Entities And Hints

taleden · April 2003

Ok, I'm trying to use hint brushes to cut my r_speeds, but when I turn gl_wireframe on I can see that it's drawing entities in areas where neighboring world brushes are NOT being drawn because the area isn't visible. Are entities just always drawn no matter what? Do hint brushes affect them?

I think what I'm really confused about is what happens when entities cross hint brush boundaries. It seems to me one of two things would happen - one of which I'd like and expect, the other of which I think I'm seeing, so let me know which is right (the language here is lawyerish, I want to make sure I'm stating the situation accurately):

1) If any brush in an entity is in a vis node that is visible, then all brushes in that entity will be drawn. This makes sense, no problem.

2) If any brush in an entity is in a vis node that is visible, then all brushes in all vis nodes which contain parts of this entity will be drawn. This is overkill, it implies that your sight somehow curves around to follow entities, so if you can see part of a long catwalk structure, you can not only see the whole catwalk entity, but you can see the whole corridor it's in - even if that corridor is absolutely not visible otherwise, and even if the catwalk passes through several hint brushes which, if it weren't for the magical-sight-relaying-catwalk, would be hiding the geometry in that area because it's not visible.

Method 2 seems to fit what I'm seeing, but it's really annoying.. it means I have to break up my entities at hint brush boundaries manually, which adds to planes, faces and entities, which sucks.

Ideas?

ChromeAngel · April 2003

I know that a brush entity is not effected by HINTs and that if they are larger than about 340 units (in any dimension) they become visible in ALL vis nodes.

I'm not sure about the magical sight relaying catwalk. Can you give us a screenshot and the overhead view of the area from WC, that would give me a better idea what you're on about.

taleden · April 2003

I was actually wrong about that, I looked at the wireframe more carefully and realized it was, in fact, only entity faces that were being drawn when they shouldn't, not the surrounding world brushes.

So, is it worth chopping up all entities into 340 unit blocks to keep them hidden at a distance, or am I liable to hit entity limits right away? Does anyone know for certain what the magic number is?

Jedediah · April 2003

I believe brush entities are drawn all-or-nothing regardless of how many brushes they contain. As CA stated, small entities will be culled according to the portal leaf(s) that they intersect but if an entity is too large, it will be drawn all the time. I'm not sure what the criteria is for "too large".. somehow I doubt it's a simple matter of size.. it probably has something to do with how many portal leafs it intersects.

Ben128 · April 2003

Crude, so if any brush entity is over 340units in any size it is then calculated into r_speeds no matter where you are in the map?

Excuse my noobnish here. But I just finished my first map ever, and my first NS map ever....ns_genesis, its availible at <a href='http://www.sonsofmetal.org/images/ns_genesis_v1.bsp' target='_blank'>http://www.sonsofmetal.org/images/ns_genesis_v1.bsp</a>. I dont think its too horrible, but I started as sort of my test map. I would love to get some honest opininions on it.

I think I am just scratching the surface of understanding r_speeds, patches, portal leafs and such. My r_speeds are way to high in genesis, and I think its just that I have to many bits of architecture that I did not turn into func_walls...but if brush entities still count towards r_speeds, then I may have to rework my current plan.

Ben128 · April 2003

*bump

Any help here guys?

Entities And Hints

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