A Ns_hera Strategy I've Been Tossing Around

Chopper_Dave1Chopper_Dave1 Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2353Members
<div class="IPBDescription">...but never really used cause of n00bs</div> OK, so, Hera kinda sucks for marines right now. Inexplicably, everyone who actually knows their way around the map, or has some skill, finds their way over to the aliens. Probably because of autoteam- all the newbies seem to flock to marines especially on that map. So even if I wanted to devise a good strategy, I can't really use it, because n00bs have this terrible problem where they can't follow orders, or can follow orders but can't shoot for crap.

So, this stategy is assuming that people can follow an order and actually shoot a quick, dog-like creature that wants to eat them. Maybe you guys can try it on Nano-Gridlock or something <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->.

1) Ditch the marine base...for now. This is a minor relocation, and by a minor relocation, I mean we're going to a new area, but without having to build an extra CC. Tell your marines to head through the maintenence corridor, shoot any aliens they come across, then use the door/tunnel to get into General Cargo Storage.

2) Drop an infantry portal in General Cargo Storage. Because the starting CC is so close to the wall, you should be able to get one near the door, or one on top of the crate stack. Whichever suits your fancy. Don't forget to grab the resource node, and the one in maintenence if the aliens seem to be staying out of the area.

3) Drop an armory on the upper level, top of the elevator. Signal your marines to that nifty ladder (amazing how many people dont realize it exists) and get them to build it. With the armory up here, you'll at least have the armory-humpers in a positon where they can be useful, as they have the higher ground. If an alien runs in, it'll either be through the door on the upper level or on the lower level, and the humpers shoudl be able to kill all of them before they do any damage. In the same way, building the armory on the lower level is BAAAD. This allows aliens to jump on your humpers from above. Baaaaad.

4) Drop a welder to a reliable soldier. Tell him to weld the two points in the room, which will both a) allow you back into your original base so that you can guard the CC and resource node and b) close off a vent to keep the skulk inflow to lesser entrances. Once this is done, signal the welder to the crate vent tunnel thingie, and get another player to guard him. The tunnel will lead to Holoroom, where another weldpoint awaits. Get him to weld this, and you'll limit the alien entrances into your new main base to a grand total of two, both which involve slooooooowly opening doors (much better than the original base location!). Meanwhile, have your marines pour out of your base and harass either processing or Holoroom - whichever the aliens seem to want more. This'll keep them from attacking you in other locations and allow you to expand in relative peace.

5) Drop a turret factory in the upper left-hand corner of General Cargo Storage. If you place this correctly, the range will cover General Cargo, Holoroom, and parts of Processing. This is good. Dont build any turrets in base to cover the turret factory; just mine it for now. Build a few turrets in both Processing and Holoroom, on the upper levels where aliens will have a harder time reaching them.

6) This step depends on the starting hive. If the aliens' starting hive is Ventilation or Data Core, then you're going to want to take Data Core Alpha and get it nice and phased. Once again, this is a strategic turret factory area: if you put it in the right place (upper level, near vent to Holoroom), your turrets can cover the Data Core Alpha resource, the Holoroom resources, and the Hera reception resources, AND be in range to siege Archiving Hive in case it goes up. If, however, the aliens start in Archiving, you're going to need to use your superior position in General Cargo Storage to push your way into processing and try to get a siege there that will cover both the other hives. Leave the resources on the the left side of the map alone for now in this case.

7) At this point, you should have anywhere from 7-9 resources under your range of influence (you might not necessarily cap them due to harassment, but aliens wont be able to either, and you're the one who'll eventually be able to get turrets there), a strategic hold on 1-2 hive(s) and a good position to assault the others, and a battlefield heavily welded in your favor. You should be able to easily buy some upgrades, get your marine team suited up, and obliterate the alien threat before or around the time they get the second hive.



  • ZhangZhang Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2477Members
    excellent strategy. feel free to try it on cofr fr31ns anyday; i'm all the way with you chopperdave.

    This is much safer than a hera processing rush and relocation; i've seen that work man times, but when marines fail, it's a quick gg.

    At least with this strat, marines can tech up in peace and not be harrassed, in addition to having tons of res nodes.

    Very good; I've never seen this done before. I hope this soon becomes a standard relocation strat such as relocating to cargo hive.

    <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • CrowCrow Melbourne Join Date: 2003-01-16 Member: 12376Members
    One of the main problems i have with this otherwise interesting stratergy... even i didn't want to believe it. If they do attack your spawn.....(generally breakable vent). They'll find the cc undefended and nice 2 chew on. Your defence (both turrets -due to the tf in the top left courner??? and marines) will however be on the other side of the wall. Suppose u could get a tf up the top of the crate to cover both sides. You should try this strat however and clean up any of the errors you found and get back to this post. I for one am wondering if it'll work. I think i'll try it neway too if i com on hera in the future.
    Thx for the idea. gw
  • Alpha_1Alpha_1 Join Date: 2002-12-18 Member: 11041Members, Constellation
    There is one flaw though, if you weld the vent panel in holo room to close off the vent behind the crates, anyone from either team can reopen the vent with the panel.

    How do you propose to get around that (just wondering, it sounds good otherwise)?
  • Chopper_Dave1Chopper_Dave1 Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2353Members
    Hmmm....that's not much of an effective weld spot then :/. I always thought that welding it would allow marines, and only marines to open the door - that's what would make it useful. Oh well, if you build turrets and a phase in Holoroom and take it like in my strategy, then they shouldnt get into the vent without taking some heavy damage. And if they do...mines work wonders. =).

    As for turret placement, it's all a matter of opinion. I figure that once the door's open into main base (pretty quick event, only take around 30 seconds or so to relocate, get a welder, and open the door), mines can be used to guard the original CC. Up until that point, though, leaving 1 or 2 guards to guard the CC until the door is open isnt a bad idea I guess. I usually have one guy patrol the marine start and maintenence resources as well, just to keep any alien rambos out. If you place the TF in the bottom left, you can cover marine start, holo, and general cargo, but you can't build into processing (which helps a LOT in pushes against the Data Core hive). I suppose the best course of action is to either build two TF's, or just get a spare CC in General Cargo.

    ((BTW Zhang, I almost always play on the COFR fr31ns server...they're the ones who almost always have a good game in every other map, but inexplicably the marines always get n00bs up the wazoo on Hera. Think it's because they reg's don't know the map so well and are scared to be marines <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->))
  • StoneburgStoneburg Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8174Members
    I'm a n00b <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->

    Never took the time to properly learn hera because:

    1. It is laggy as hell
    2. I don't like it (has a little to do with #1 and a lot to do with the actual map design)

    The strat sounds interesting, I'll try to help you if I'm on the marine team next time on hera, even though Chopper Dave as COM = Automatic lose.

    <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • Chopper_Dave1Chopper_Dave1 Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2353Members
    Heh, I'm telling you Stoneburg, it's only when you're in the server. If you're gone, I lead the marines to quick and decisive victories. When you join, a black hole descends and sucks up every marine's intelligence and distributes it to the aliens, leaving my marines as little more than little armory-humping bunnies. It's amazing... <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • ZERGZERG Join Date: 2003-02-04 Member: 13132Members, Constellation
    The only flaw in this strategy is the amount of coordination you will need to pull it off quick enough. It's not my style to take huge risks and take a more definate approach that doesn't require a lot skill from my marines. Like if those marines die while guarding your CC (huge skulk rush, they suck, etc), then you're plan has already gotten off at a rough start. Though if I get a nice group of marines, I might try it sometime. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • EvenFlowEvenFlow Join Date: 2002-12-18 Member: 11046Members
    Nice strat, I like it, one thing I may wanna try is sending a 'rine to be a decoy at double siege, on the server I play on both teams still seem hellbent on getting this area. Kharaa rarely patrol cargo storage so it seems like a highly viable strat, will definately give it a go <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> .
  • ApotheosisApotheosis Join Date: 2002-11-16 Member: 8899Members, Constellation
    Maintenance corridor can be a death trap, especially if the aliens start in ventilation hive - it is dark, winding and tall enough for good skulks to hide above you and drop on the marines as they run through.

    Having said that, it is indeed an interesting strategy, and one I'd like to see tried out on Hera.
  • K_e_r_b_e_r_o_sK_e_r_b_e_r_o_s Join Date: 2003-02-01 Member: 12966Members
    edited March 2003
    I agree with this strategy; usually Marines have a lot problems on public servers because noone seems able to cooperate. Its like throwing eliptical fish at a keyboard and expecting a well typed-sentence. Its just not going to happen!

    The point is though its good to overall see strategies that at least utilize prudent methods instead of ones that pour resources into making a team of idiots with heavy weaponrey. (I'am of course referring to those who lack the want or knowledge to use the weapons as we all figure they should).
  • ThaymeThayme Join Date: 2002-11-15 Member: 8814Members
    There is no reason to relocate. If you put your armory as close to the back wall to cargo as you can, you can drop a welder though the wall. Weld open the door and you got a res which your base defenders can guard, as well as the base. grab entrance + reception = jp/hmg, gg aliens
  • taboofirestaboofires Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9853Members
    Yes, all you need is 2 or so marines to meander their way to cargo, and you can drop a welder right there for them.

    Also, being within seige range of a res doesn't mean that you control it. It just means the aliens have to choose res locations more carefully, or just keep rushing your base to take out the observatory. If they can sometimes sneak a hive past a siege turret, they certainly can do it for res nozzles.
  • Chopper_Dave1Chopper_Dave1 Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2353Members
    Hmmm, I never really thought about dropping welders through the door. Might try that sometime.

    Though, I do still stand by my original strategy, just because I feel General Cargo is a much more defendable location than the marine start. Marine start is just a deathtrap - four possible entrances, each from different sides...even a good marine team has trouble defending against that many possibilities. Add the fact that maintenence corridior, as already stated, is a deathtrap for marines, and the Hera reception hall tunnel becomes a HUGE deathtrap at the elevator (believe someone around here calls it the "Coffin"), and the vent isnt even usuable by marines until later in the game...yep, I think it'd be a really, really good idea to get out of the marine start.

    But I will say this - definitely not a strategy recommended for uncoordinated teams. I've led 4 newbie teams to slaughter with this strategy at this point (though I do think it was a bit inevitable). I did have two games where I executed it beautifully with some good players, so do not give up hope! =)
  • EvenFlowEvenFlow Join Date: 2002-12-18 Member: 11046Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Chopper Dave+Mar 14 2003, 01:40 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Chopper Dave @ Mar 14 2003, 01:40 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I did have two games where I executed it beautifully with some good players, so do not give up hope! =) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I take it you won these 2 games ?
  • NicatorNicator Join Date: 2002-12-15 Member: 10829Members
    Hera is a kickass map for marines. Easy access to large amount of res, and **** easy hives to JP down (particularly vent and data). Marine's dream. With a decent comm, it's one of the most marine friendly maps out there. Without a decent comm, it's one of the most marine unfriendly ones <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • qweazdakqweazdak Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2761Members
    I always find making your base in processing (near data core) to be the best spot for relocation. You can seige two hives from the same spot (ventilation and data core). Naturally the best time to do this is when they start in archiving.
  • ZiGGYZiGGY Join Date: 2003-01-19 Member: 12479Members
    edited March 2003
    yeah easy hmg jp hives double siege point res nodes you can seal off res **** easy access to centre of map via vents res nodes that can be covered 2 at a time (x3) its a lame map(from an exploit point of view only it is nice in most other respects) ;/ fun to lerk on though
  • LucidLucid Join Date: 2002-12-11 Member: 10534Members, Constellation
    the bast IP rush using this same idea is my favorite thing to do as comm. It's so funny to see all the nubs aliens be all like "WTH h4x?" ahahahaha, i even did it in a clan scrim the other day, owned
  • NiteowlNiteowl Join Date: 2002-09-04 Member: 1274Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
    nicely thought out, excellent strat. nicely done chopper dave, i'll try it out on Over Medicated.
  • MindmeldmeMindmeldme The Evil One Join Date: 2002-10-27 Member: 1637Members
    personally I'm not a fan of relocating...but I like the idea..it's an intersting one at least. I don't have to much trouble in Hera...it depends, like almost all things on the team of course, as said. Having a good team is critical on all maps but it seems hera is more so. The hope is that if at least half the team can listen and survive you'll be doing good.
  • Roger_DodgerRoger_Dodger Join Date: 2003-03-11 Member: 14392Members
    Hey dood great strat quite well thought out, i would like to see a decent marine team that knows this strat and a decent alien team that also knows it and see wat the outcome is, seems very efficient but with a team of good aliens who knows wat could happen??
  • XenogearzXenogearz Join Date: 2003-03-04 Member: 14323Members
    I hate to say this.. even though it's risky.. I still think charging into processing is always your best bet.. If the alien's starting spot is Archiving.. Then it's gonna be really difficult for them to get to Processing.
  • ElricElric Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8448Members
    In games where I've quickly opened up cargo storage, I just have marines hold cargo and meander back through the door to base whenever necessary. If cargo starts going to hell in a handbasket, I lock the door (sometimes on dying marines, oh well), recycle the rt, let them do their thing, regroup, reopen, take it back. Build up on the top area for ip/armory, mine that area with a pack or two, put the upgrade areas in behind the boxes in between cargo and marine start, make on huge run-on sentence, and you're good. From cargo, you can hit maintainence both quicker and safely (by avoiding the previously mentioned tunnel) as well as processing and opens a flank on holoroom. Cargo is truly the Mess Hall of Hera, it's just most don't use it because of the weldable door. You have to be attentive to lock the door as commander when necessary however (which is great since it can only be opened by the comm/inside main base.

    I just drop the welder through the door as well.
  • CatpokerCatpoker Join Date: 2002-06-25 Member: 816Members
    i actually tried this in the CoFR server yesterday, those 2 nodes guarded by a singale base guard with a welder really helps.

    plus the fact that the range gives the marines one heck of a advantage with cargo door open, hera and processing were QUITE easy to get to, and as soon as i had nodes in the both of them, the aliens f4ed <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->

    i would however say that my marines with lvl2 weps and lvl1 armor were really giving the aliens a spanking....

    was it the marines or the strat? who knows <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • MeltedSnowmanMeltedSnowman Join Date: 2002-11-08 Member: 7779Members
    edited March 2003
    Did anyone mention the fact that a few marines can take the vent from base to holoroom? One will have to stay behind, as he needs to boost the other marines, but it's a good way to get your troops there if they're willing to listen to you.

    Aliens won't expect you to be in holo quite that fast, and it allows your marines to take up defensive positions for a phase/TF/armory/pony factory.

    EDIT :: It's a good way to relocate there, I guess, but relocations to holoroom are never pretty.
  • Aries8Aries8 Join Date: 2002-12-12 Member: 10719Members
    The big problem that I see with thiss strat is that the aliens can close the big cargo blast door from the marine spawn side and then the marines are lockout of their orginial spawn and have to go all the way around to get their(or use distress but that 15 resources a pop). Because the gargo blast door cant be opened from cargo. After the aliens close they blast door they can then just continue to bite the rt or cc while the marines go around. If you put turrets around cc it would be safe i guess but then the rt in marine spawn would keep getting destoryed. I think its just better to stay in spawn a weld the door open and then build a tf by the CC so u can protect marine spawn and cargo. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> besides that it seems like it would be cool to try out. I think it would confuse the aliens for alittle making them wounder where you went. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • ElricElric Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8448Members
    If the aliens close it, the comm can open it just as quickly. Once it's open, it stays in marine hands essentially.
  • BreakfastSausagesBreakfastSausages Join Date: 2002-12-19 Member: 11148Members
    Nice strategy

    Ive always been a big fan of opening the cargo bay door, it solves so many problems that marines have on Hera.
  • IntruderIntruder Join Date: 2003-02-26 Member: 14022Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--qweazdak+Mar 14 2003, 09:48 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (qweazdak @ Mar 14 2003, 09:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I always find making your base in processing (near data core) to be the best spot for relocation. You can seige two hives from the same spot (ventilation and data core). Naturally the best time to do this is when they start in archiving. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Umm I think the whole point of the post was to give a Different strategy. We all know about Proc Strat, and that was not what we were talking about.

    To the Strat Author, great strat, though I cant see it working that well if the aliens start in Vent, since you cant really go via maitanace, since thats where the rushing skulks will come from, and going the other way, is a long long way...
    but for the other 2 hives, good strat!
  • That_Annoying_KidThat_Annoying_Kid Sire of Titles Join Date: 2003-03-01 Member: 14175Members, Constellation
    thats a good strategy, very good, I play alien and that would work
    yikes, must make counterstrategy!
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