Should Model Skins Be Legal In Games?
KboT
Join Date: 2002-11-20 Member: 9436Members
Join Date: 2002-11-20 Member: 9436Members
in Discussions
Hey everyone, I just wanted to get a Discussion started about this Topic which really bothers me.
Ok the Question is: Should Model Skins be Legal?
I'm taking about Skins that can make Hostages In Counter-Strike look like Brintey Spears, Sniper's in Day of Defeat look like Giant green Glowing Blobs, Skulks in Natural-Selection look like Rats, etc...
I think this brings a great Disadvantage to the games.
For Example: If I make a skin in Day of Defeat that makes all Snipers look like a Giant green-glowing guy than that will give the hidden sniper a great Disadvantage! That goes for any game where taking Cover is important. Although Natural-Selection is probly the least affected game to these Skins It really does make a difference to a game like Day of Defeat where taking cover in the shadows will keep you alive and greatly help you win.
Well please give me your feedback, -KboT
Ok the Question is: Should Model Skins be Legal?
I'm taking about Skins that can make Hostages In Counter-Strike look like Brintey Spears, Sniper's in Day of Defeat look like Giant green Glowing Blobs, Skulks in Natural-Selection look like Rats, etc...
I think this brings a great Disadvantage to the games.
For Example: If I make a skin in Day of Defeat that makes all Snipers look like a Giant green-glowing guy than that will give the hidden sniper a great Disadvantage! That goes for any game where taking Cover is important. Although Natural-Selection is probly the least affected game to these Skins It really does make a difference to a game like Day of Defeat where taking cover in the shadows will keep you alive and greatly help you win.
Well please give me your feedback, -KboT
Comments
It actually pisses me off greatly, but like I said, what can be done about it. All I can do is cry <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Im no programer but it seems quite possible or maybe Hl's aging engine doesnt support it.
There's some games where models don't matter. Example: in Quake 3, so long as the model isn't something crazy (such as cloaked or something), it really doesn't matter if it's a Darth Vader model, Lara Croft Model, or one of the standard ones.
In others, which may encourage some element of surprize and hiding, such as Day of Defeat, NS, or the Theif mod for UT, the model/skins are important to varying degrees. But there are 2 kinds of models: those that are made to have more polys, better textures, etc and just look better than the originals, or those that look flat-out silly to offer an advantage to the person viewing them.
I'll use CS as an example simply because it's popular. CS-nation offers a "skin of the day" feature, where they rate models/skins and put them up for download. The ones with higher ratings do tend to look a heck of a lot better than the originals -- my favorite is a custom model for the M4 with a realistically-animated shoulder strap and a custom animation that reloads the way a real person should (instead of dropping the empty clip and carelessly slamming in the new one, it drops the empty, puts in the new one, checks both sides of the gun for defects or possible jams, etc. -- think America's Army: Operations)
But for every good custom model for the mod, there are just as many gimmick models or models whose quasi-cheating purpose is quite obvious.
Ideally, modellers would make a custom model and submit it to the makers of each mod for approval. If the makers of the mod accepted it, the ability to use it would be hard-coded into the mod itself. Every other custom model would just violate checks.
Im no programer but it seems quite possible or maybe Hl's aging engine doesnt support it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree. There should be an Easy way to put in Concreat Models
NO custom models should never be allowed.
And there is a way to stop it already, Its just disabled on a few servers due to a small bug (which will be fixed in 1.1 i assume)
This is an engine function related to it...
<!--c1--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->
void pfnForceUnmodified(FORCE_TYPE type, float *mins, float *maxs, const char *filename)
{
(*g_engfuncs.pfnForceUnmodified)(type, mins, maxs, filename);
}
typedef enum
{
force_exactfile, // File on client must exactly match server's file
force_model_samebounds, // For model files only, the geometry must fit in the same bbox
force_model_specifybounds, // For model files only, the geometry must fit in the specified bbox
} FORCE_TYPE;
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
NO custom models should never be allowed. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I totaly agree! Model not only ruin the game creators hard work they may also make the game unfair
My knife model is now skinned to look like wolverine claws. I can't hear the knife sound any better than I could, (Unlike the popular Light-Saber replacement), so I see no harm in it. If I competed competitively in CS, I'd conform to any rules that my league did, but I stand by my claim that all of these changes make the game better TO ME.
My knife model is now skinned to look like wolverine claws. I can't hear the knife sound any better than I could, (Unlike the popular Light-Saber replacement), so I see no harm in it. If I competed competitively in CS, I'd conform to any rules that my league did, but I stand by my claim that all of these changes make the game better TO ME. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes CS is probly one of the games that do not need cover. I want you to go Play some Day Of defeat and be a sniper. then Ill use a skin that makes all sniper models a bright green and then tell me if skins are fair
If you need to change skins to feel better about playing a game, means the game aint worth playing. Nuff said CS(counter-strike the game, not anyone that could possible be named CS or any version of that) blowz! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Even if your new models reduce your muzzle flash bu 0.01% you already have an adavntage over someone who is not using those models. If youre using T models that look cooler, maybe they dont blend in as well giving u an advantage at distance (and I know your gunna say they dont change any of that, but thats not my point) If EVRYONE cant have access to it (meaning its not the default setting) it aint fair, same goes for key binds and scripts that dont Exist in the games GUI
The point is that if said "glowing green sniper" is hiding where he would not be seen normally - the person viewing that model has an unfair advantage over him. This is what we call "cheating" (omg he used the 'c' word!!). No matter how you look at it, it provides an unfair and unecessary advantage to the person using them, as compared to the person who uses all default things.
For those of you who use different models for æsthetic reasons, well that's alright I suppose - but only for pub/screwaround play - they should not be used in any sort of league.
And if you're using a model that exploits anything, damn you to hell...you should be made into a eunuch whose tongue has been severed!
Good point...
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->If you need to change skins to feel better about playing a game, means the game aint worth playing<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
...Even better point!
If you need to change skins to feel better about playing a game, means the game aint worth playing. Nuff said CS(counter-strike the game, not anyone that could possible be named CS or any version of that) blowz! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Even if your new models reduce your muzzle flash bu 0.01% you already have an adavntage over someone who is not using those models. If youre using T models that look cooler, maybe they dont blend in as well giving u an advantage at distance (and I know your gunna say they dont change any of that, but thats not my point) If EVRYONE cant have access to it (meaning its not the default setting) it aint fair, same goes for key binds and scripts that dont Exist in the games GUI <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Couple things here...
1) Now, specifically MY replacements actually make it more difficult. My terrorists don't blend in any worse, and more of my weapons are silenced because of my custom sounds.
2) Everyone DOES have access to these things. Whether they're included with the original or not.
Now, I'm not going to argue that replacing your models with a bright-green skin is both lame and a sort of "cheat", but mine only improve visual quality. I would never install anything that gave me a huge advantage over other players, but that's where a player's morals come into play more than anything.
Ohoho, lets see you back that up. You are going to play two games: Natural Selection, and Natural Selection where the models are fuzzy, unanimated blocks with low res textures and terrible sounds. They look, move, and sound like complete crap. Now tell me that it is just as fun.
Owned by the safety pance. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
I tried the black aliens skulks, for instance, and sure, being black they show up easily in bright areas, this could be seen as giving me a cheaty advantage yes? I say no, because those same models are almost completely invisible in dark areas, of which NS maps have a LOT. Balances iself out I say. As long as you arent using spiked flourescent yellow models, so what. Adds variety and interest to a game.
I beg to differ.
1. Remember that 99,99% of Half-Life's popularity right now is because of the modding community. Based on changing
the original work. So it's kinda weird to say "you change that, you're **** on someone else's shoes!". Assuming
that the change is cosmetic, not gameplay-changing.
2. Many models most probably are inspired by the original work, and are a tribute to it, making the original work more,
not less.
No modifications are needed. If any modifications are to be made, have the developers approve them, and include the modifications in the next patch. That would be the farthest I would go.
I used to modify my games. TFC and DoD were one of my favorites to modify, and I changed all sorts of sounds and models. It didn't make them any easier to play really, and in many cases it made it harder. However, I found the reason that I modified the game was because I was bored of it, and was trying to bring the fun back in the game. It didn't work. I don't play DoD or TFC anymore. I don't even have DoD on my harddrive anymore.
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Or at least make it able that there is an Optition able so you can make Custom Skins Disabled. This would help when it comes to making Tourny Servers and what not.
Its called File Consistency and its already implememented. If u dont like custom models, play at GWB's NS1 v1.04 server at 128.163.80.131:27015. They have file consistency on, and he has 2 other servers w/o them on. I use to use custom models, for the purpose that i liked how they look. But i took them off so i could play at servers w/ file consistency on. I mean if the original developers didnt want custom skinz why whould a put a section on it in their forums.
If people have a gun sound for Scilenced Weapons that is loud then that will TOTALY defeat the the concept of "Silenced Weapons" because they are not "Quite" or "Silenced" they are loud! Now I don't care what ANYONE says, THAT IS UNFAIR!