I Still Think Sensory Is Just A Novelty

Nether · February 2003

With 1.04 people seem to be using cloaking alot more and many "say" that its better, but it isnt really at all apart from some every minor changes.

If you like ambushing marines from convinient places then thats fine. If you like being able to actually attack marines or an outpost without dying in 1/2 second, carapace is a million times better. Cloaking is for sitting on a wall waiting for a choice kill it has nothing to do with helping the team or achieving a goal. Ive seen aliens set ambushes in rooms and sometimes it does work well, others it doesnt but ambushing is only one ability. Aliens cant just sit in a room and hope the marines come this way they need to be actively moving around the map aggressivly engaging the marines which cloaking is useless for, eg marines goto a different key location than presumed aliens have to try to stop the outpost being built, meaning they have to attack without carapace = owned aliens.

Cloaking is also more usefull on certain maps than it is on others, id say nancy is probably the best map to take cloaking although id still say defence is far better. But I see poeple putting sensory on maps like eclipse which is useless for 90% of the map. I dont know whether I have particularly good eye sight or not but, if I know aliens have cloaking I look that little bit harder when im moving around and I can usualy see aliens upto 15 metres away pretty easy.

As for the other sensory abilities they arent even worth mentioning.

Also if you take sensory that means you dont get Mov till 3rd hive (I cant imagine any sane person taking sensory then mov). Fading without adrenaline is ok IF your not up against upgraded marines AND you dont have to take out any turret farms, if any of these two do apply being a
fade isnt much more usefull than being a skulk.

Sensory is still the worst upgrade, stick to def>mov people \o/

BadVoodoo · February 2003

Agreed, DC's are by far the best first chamber, not just for carapace. Redemption is better and good for gorges if they get their fat lil butt in a fix with almost enough res for a hive. And DC's themselves provide much needed healing as foward attack posts.

matso · February 2003

Cloaking is better than it was in 1.03 - but it still far, far worse then defense. Not so much for the early game - in fact, the first five minutes can be better than with defense - but it's a high risk strategy. If the marines manages to lock down two hives, then it's gg, as you can't attack. Once you have two hives, you can get carapace and start fighting again, but it takes a LONG time to win as aliens without adrenaline.

Xzilen · February 2003

Agreed, people may say oh you just don't know how to use it or whatever, but those are the same people whom I see ACid Rocket spam when they have def and mov's so they can't really claim that they are "1337" or anything.

Defense then Mov is the ONLY way to go.

sekdar · February 2003

once they fight organized marines, they will realize that dying in 9 lmg shots kinda sucks...

thats just my opinion. i know how to set up an ambush, and i still think sensory is useless.

Rue · February 2003

dc's the best? no way , for the gorge there amazin but for sneaky skulks its just a helpfully advantage , mc's is what u want at the start of the game , then get silence , if they dont know ur there they cant kill u , infact as a gogre silence is still a great skill , again they cant hear u so u can run behind them all the way to a hive <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'> , sensory is good fun but the prob is fades rock with cara and adren so there always the first 2 built.

leek · February 2003

i thimk rue makes a valid point here, mcs first then take silence for early skulks will help get those marines out of main base, as well as sheilding the gorge's location from the comm. most of my deaths when im skulks is when a marine hears me before seeing me.

havent had the oppertunity to try it though as no gorge has evr built mc first in a game ive pld, of course once the marines have mot tracking then silence becomes redundant.

Spura · February 2003

silence s stupid and useless as any good marines get one Infantry portal and observatory right away. That means motion tracking soon so they can camp those 2 res nodes they have better. They just have to camp few res nodes and tech to jetpacks, and they get them way before 2nd hive is up. skulks have hard time with jetpackers and even LMG jetpackers can kill hive. Counter to this is rushing their base, that means no stupid cloaking(which has been nerfed IMHO) and silence wonæt help. Thez have motion tracking anzwaz and u have to assault. And u get killed in 9 lmg shots=gg. This whole **** is just because ppl are bored with def first and now they are looking for excuses to get some variety, though they will lose. And yes u can win with sensory. But ur team better be a lot stronger than theirs.

Link · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nether @ Feb 4 2003, 11:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Cloaking is for sitting on a wall waiting for a choice kill it has nothing to do with helping the team or achieving a goal.  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Please learn to play the game correctly before you make such statement.

Getting carapace and the screaming "BUNDLE!!!!!!!!" is not the only tactic that works.

Rue · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Spura @ Feb 5 2003, 01:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> silence s stupid and useless as any good marines get one Infantry portal and observatory right away. That means motion tracking soon so they can camp those 2 res nodes they have better.

This whole **** is just because ppl are bored with def first and now they are looking for excuses to get some variety, though they will lose.

 </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
sorry but ur wrong , at the start of most pub games the mariens will not get MT , its a great skill but normaly its goten after the first hive is locked down.

as to ur second point ur wrong again , i still dont mind dc's first it is rather good to have health spots around the map but i dont realy like getting shot at , so i dont like them hearing me , as gorge the commander cant tell where i am and mariens outside rooms cant tell im there. as for sensory as a second tower, imo its possible to win beacause sent of fear is probs one of best things NS has and cloaking again they cant c me so they die.

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Getting carapace and the screaming "BUNDLE!!!!!!!!" is not the only tactic that works. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

its the best choice for triggerhappy peeps that just run and try and kill stuff , which is a good tactics but imo steal is more fun.

Harry_S_Truman · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Spura @ Feb 5 2003, 08:17 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> silence s stupid and useless as any good marines get one Infantry portal and observatory right away.  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
It's funny that people tend to forget that motion tracking only shows where aliens are in the direction the marine is looking! All too often, a marine that hears the little "pitter-patter" of skulk feet but doesn't see a "blip" will swing around to check his rear. I disagree that silence is stupid and useless.

DaStompa · February 2003

people complaining about cloakings "not perfect cloak" : If you dont move (that includes rotating your view like nuts) you are invisible, I have never been shot at once when not moving AT ALL

Frogg2 · February 2003

to even it up they need to increase the base armor for most of the aliens when uncarapaced then nerf carapace.

Then add in a few better upgrades for sens and improve the movement ones..

Crisqo · February 2003

Thats what 1.1 is for....

Spura · February 2003

Yeah but some pub games marines don't get MT. But still don't know for sure that they won't take MT early. I have seen it happen on pubs.

As to my second point. What do u do with silence to a marine caping say eclipse hive. He has a lot of open ground a he can see u coming for a long way. U will get killed in 9 shots instead of 19 <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>. And besides the other stuff about movements like moving between hives is just not viable at 1 hive.

OWA · February 2003

Ask yourself this: who lives longer, the skulk with caraprice who gets seen and shot at, or the skulk with cloaking who doesn't get seen and jumps the marine from behind.

With cloaking you can easily deny marine after marine after marine access to an area, caraprice just gives you a better chance of getting the first one. Early on your main priority is to deny the marines access to hives and resources, and for that cloaking is superior.

Also look at the value of a SINGLE chamber. 1 defensive chamber gives you a minisqule amount of extra caraprice on a skulk, but 1 sensory chamber gives you the full 90percent stealth, and costs less res.

Also note: cloaking is great for letting your gorge save for a hive without worrying about getting whacked.

leek · February 2003

but sensory isnt as good for fades as the other, if u want stealth i suggest mc first, skulks with silence can be just as useful as cloaked skulks. also the silenced gorge wont be singled out by the comm for hunting down.

this also has the benefit that when u get to 2 hives u can build dc and fades can get adrenaline/dc upgrade they need.

Pege · February 2003

I did 2 S-M/0-D/0 rounds just today. Both were 8vs8. In the first round 3 of our unupgraded skulks did a rush to marine base, killed about 6-7 marines, took out the armory and 1 IP and told me to get a sensory "just for fun". The marines barely made it to unnamed hive, they didn't even get mess hall and the best gun they managed to get was a shotgun. Talking about skill balance <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>

The second round had even teams skillwice. People wanted sensory so I made one. We got our as*es handed out for us in about 10 minutes by rushing marines who got a 2 hive lockdown. We desparately tried to attack their bases, but got killed in about 2 seconds after showing our faces from vents and doors. 5 skulks slaughtered by a couple of sentries and 2 marines. Way to go, sensory!

Sensory is only fun when your people outskills marines 10000-0. The round will be really non-fun for marines, but hey, you get to build a cool new chamber.

Crisqo · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>The second round had even teams skillwice. People wanted sensory so I made one. We got our as*es handed out for us in about 10 minutes by rushing marines who got a 2 hive lockdown. We desparately tried to attack their bases, but got killed in about 2 seconds after showing our faces from vents and doors. 5 skulks slaughtered by a couple of sentries and 2 marines. Way to go, sensory!</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

If it was even skill wise....How were the marines able to take two hives?

sekdar · February 2003

because they went sensory.

Cabal · February 2003

Yes sensory and movement can be negated early on in a few ways, but so can defense. If you always go defense first, the marines expect it and it wont work as well just like skulk rushes dont work as often as they used to. So if they know you're going for defense first, not only can they can hear you coming, they can upgrade their weapons to level 1 or 2 and/or use shotguns.

Personally I do a whole lot better with silence. I cant stand carapace. I dont care for cloaking without silence since the cloaking sound can sometimes give you away.

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
If it was even skill wise....How were the marines able to take two hives?
</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
because they went sensory.
</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

Maybe its just a case of people needing to play with the other upgrades for as long as they've played with defense first so they can adapt.

Crisqo · February 2003

Do we really need to start another "defense is better then sensory" thread? If not I suggest you stay away from comments like </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>because they went sensory. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

Torgo · February 2003

Hey, I'm always up for another marathon 9 page post again. It gives reason and purpose to my meaningless existence.

Canadianmonk3y · February 2003

Sensory and movement first still sucks 1.04.
Movement MIGHT be good if marines do not watch their back, which is the only place a movement skulk can attack from and benefit from his upgrade. ANY skulk can hide behind a corner, but they will be heard running up from behind without silence. A group with one guy watching the team's back can effectively reduce the viability of a good rush from the back... And then from there, if the marines get MT, gg... <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'> (Celerity sucks, dont even mention it.)

Sure sensory had a LITTLE improvement, but is still nowhere near the greatness of defense.
Again, as BlueGhost put it, going sensory relies on the other team being STUPID.
Laying down a cheap 25 res obs, and using a couple of scans to get to hives and holding them = gg aliens.
Ok, even if they keep doing the JP+HMG tech, they get to 1-2 RTs and defend them before the aliens get any upgrade options. Once JPs are there, cloaked skulks are just as useless as unupgraded skulks fighting JPs. 'Rine with JP is faster than a skulk, so ambushing is not a possibility anymore.

Either way, sensory still sucks. Arguing that it is a matter of opinion is pointless. Sensory just has too many weaknesses to be a viable option.

Crisqo · February 2003

Well thats your oppinion.
If sensory has so many flaws I must be God at NS because I win with it when I put it down...Now I feel sorry for the mortals who can't win with it though..

sekdar · February 2003

play against competant marines.

marines that never travel in less than a pair.

marines that have 90%+ accuracy

marines that turn around to look at their buddies an eighth of a second after they hear a skulk chomp.

you can pick off 1, maybe 2 marines with impunity with cloaking...

but aren't skulks supposed to be fully capable of winning the game on their own? the best sensory will ever let you do is contain them in their base until you get a second hive. wouldn't it be simply preferable to win?

yes, i've played with sensory. More times than i'd like. i've played with sensory in clan games. i've won with it before. but it was a lot harder than defense. from a realistic approach, sensory is still just not worth it.

OWA · February 2003

THat's what you're supposed to do is contain them in thier base until you get the hive up.

And, incidently, your arguement works against you

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>marines that have 90%+ accuracy</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

If they have 90 percent accuracy caraprice is only going to allow you 1 maybe 2 seconds more life if that LMG stream is right ontop of you, so really, against super accurate marines cloaking is BETTER because they never see you to get the aim on you.

Crisqo · February 2003

And the numbers Sekdar pulls out of his head backfires...Ouch.

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>but aren't skulks supposed to be fully capable of winning the game on their own? the best sensory will ever let you do is contain them in their base until you get a second hive. wouldn't it be simply preferable to win?</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

Give me a skulk rush early to mid early where skulks have won with these <i>über marines</i> and I'll buy your theory. Sure carapace might help with the attack but if the marines are so sweet it shouldn't matter because no matter what you do 45 out of the 50 lmg bullets WILL hit you because they can hit 90% of the time.

You brought this marathon thread on yourselves.

sekdar · February 2003

*shrug* have fun with your sensory chambers

Crisqo · February 2003

Will do.

Xzilen · February 2003

I agree, unless the Marines are stupid, you'll proabably loose with Sensory. Whats going on here is sort of like what went on with the TMP in CS.... Some people become super good with it, but otherwise, it sucks.

I Still Think Sensory Is Just A Novelty

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