I Bite, But Nothing Happens!
Forlorn
Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2634Banned
Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2634Banned
<div class="IPBDescription">This is not a hitbox issue... its wpc</div> Okay, my question: Does WPC work for the aliens melee attacks?
I have notice that it is INCREDIBLY hard to hit people with a melee attack whenever I lag above 400.
And if WPC is not activated for an aliens bite/swipe/gore then it should be, it's complete crap not to have it so it works this way.
I have notice that it is INCREDIBLY hard to hit people with a melee attack whenever I lag above 400.
And if WPC is not activated for an aliens bite/swipe/gore then it should be, it's complete crap not to have it so it works this way.
Comments
and this was at about 180-220
I'm quite good at predicting whether my jaws finish off a marine or not, so whenever I bite I only have to bite the number of times I think is needed (I do not hold down the bite key).
When my latency is below 100, I can do this very smoothly. I don't have to bother with a second bite at all if I knew my first bite was very powerful, ditto with a leapbite. However, once my latency goes above 100, I have to fight a little differently.
I hold down my mouse1 and push myself into the marine, only THAT will finish them off. Simply stopping near them won't work anymore. Also, when the marines start jumping backwards in attempt to dodge me, they seem to become invulnerable. That just sucks.
A very slight lag causes this... so it ends up I like being the gorge on hera. *shrugs*
Using a non-predicted melee weapon with a high ping is always difficult. Your actual position can be considered to be a good way behind where you appear to be on your screen, that combined with the way HL tries to predict your collisions with another player makes close range fighting confusing.
On a high ping, if you are moving towards a player who is dodging sideways across your viewpoint, and you time your run (according to your screen) to intersect his path and run directly into the player's model for a bite, what will actually happen is the following:
While running towards the player, your own position can be considered to be a few meters behind where you appear to be, upon reaching where you think your opponent is, you are infact a few meters away from him. As you collide with the player moving across your view, HL movement prediction assumes you have made contact with him and on your screen you appear to stop - running against his model and probably hammering the bite button.
The problem is, as far as the server is concerned you never touched him. According to the server, you were a few meters behind, meaning that by the time you actually reached the position where you appeared to collide with him, he was several meters off to the side. You ran straight past him, and didn't touch him at all - now as soon as the client catches up, it realises that visibly stopping you was a mistake, and all the time you thought you were running against his model, you were actually running past him. The result is, you appear to 'teleport' forwards, to the position you actually ran to. Now the marine is no longer on your screen, he's behind you, and the 2 bites you thought you landed on his torso never connected.
With unlagged melee, wether client side or server side, the hits you made when you appeared to be running against his body should have been counted.
A similar problem occurs if you're running towards a marine who is backing off, in order to register a hit on him with a high ping, you will have to run through the position where the marine appears to be - in other words you will have to run against where his model is on your screen for a short period of time before you reach his actual position. The problem with this is, when you touch the position of his model according to your client, the HL movement prediction kicks in and you begin losing track of where you actually are because of all the teleporting around you will be doing everytime your client catches up with what really happened. You can observe the same behaviour in other games when using a melee weapon, it's a pain in the ****.
I run into him client side and get stopped, but then server tells me I'm still exactly as far I away as I was before so I teleport forward a little, unfortunately I am teleported to HIS current position on MY client, and I get stopped again by the collision prediction code...
It also seems to explain why skulks kill me from so far away when I run away from them in a straight line
Now does this work the other way? Does me being a HPB make it harder for ppl to hit me? Also, what happens if I cut infront of a marine, and so client side I made it past him but server side I collide with him? Do I get teleported back? Would attempting to cut infront of marines while biting solve my problem of bites not hitting?
[edit: lol @ forums automatically taking the "f" out of my lower case omg and capitalising it for me...]
Now does this work the other way? Does me being a HPB make it harder for ppl to hit me?
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In general, no, being a HPB does not make it harder to hit you. Except in some extreme cases where the server does not recieve enough information about your movement, and your movement can become choppy to other players (How much of a problem this is in the HL engine im not sure). The problems with prediction and locations of players being inaccurate is entirely client orientated, only your own ping effects it, not the ping of another player. Unless we get into hitscan prediction code for certain weapons.
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Also, what happens if I cut infront of a marine, and so client side I made it past him but server side I collide with him? Do I get teleported back? Would attempting to cut infront of marines while biting solve my problem of bites not hitting?
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Yep, if your client thinks you avoided the marine but you actually collided with him, you'll get teleported back when the client catches up. If you've ever bunnyhopped down a coridoor in a group, you'll see this occuring loads as client/server versions of who is colliding with who are constantly clashing. Aiming your bites infront of where the marine is going can result in your actual server side bite being in the right place at the right time to chomp the marine. Problem is you have to know in advance where he's going, and you also run into the problem of the movement prediction warping you around as soon as you get in range. The warping effect is purely a visual at your end, as far as the server and other players are concerned you did not teleport at all, however is it very off putting when attempting to bite something, as it makes it difficult to tell exactly whats going on.
Having played NS on both a low and high ping, i would say a regular high ping (200-300 without too much packet loss) is more of a dissadvantage to a skulk than to a marine. Skulks still move relatively smoothly on the marines screen, and the marine benefits from hitscan prediction on his weapons which allow him to hit the skulk consistantly. Meanwhile the skulk suffers from all the problems mentioned above. On the other hand, once connections begin to get unstable and both sides suffer from high packet loss, the movement of skulks on a marines screen becomes very choppy. Making it difficult to target them. In this situation, skulks have the advantage because they can close the distance easily against the handicapped marines, and although they cannot aim bites accurately, jumping around and aiming randomly at close range is alot more effective with bite than it is with a LMG.
I so need cable... <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
Word to Developers:
<span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'> IS THERE ANYWAY TO FIX THIS? FOR THE LOVE OF GOD AND ALL THAT WAS EVER 56K!!!?</span>
Word to Developers:
<span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'> IS THERE ANYWAY TO FIX THIS? FOR THE LOVE OF GOD AND ALL THAT WAS EVER 56K!!!?</span> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
i havent seen one reply conscerning this, doesnt mean they havent noticed..
try posting in the bugs section?