New Low Entity Version Of Hera

BigD · January 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">and why I don't like it!</div> Currently being tested on one of the 1.04 beta servers.

Okay... I understand their purpose... less server load... etc... but the way hera's dark creepy hallway by marine spawn is now just a overly BLACK hallway without the fog is rather boring. It totally loses the atmosphere it gave off. Instead, you can't see anything and it feels kind of out of place... or something. I think fixing the leak in the readyroom and making the secret room less fancy ought to be enough. (Never got to check if those were changed at all)

Hopefully a better compromise can be met than losing the foggy hallway!
I hate to see my favorite map... "dumbed down"! <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'>

Sirus · January 2003

Yes, Stripped maps are no fun, they have no atmosphere. I'd gladly take atmosphere over +25-50 ping anyday

MasterEvilAce · January 2003

also framerate <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'>

i have a Geforce 2, and that map plays fine (all of them do)

Remember kids: Games are easily playable with 25 FPS (sometimes lower), i've played TFC with 5FPS (STEADY) and gotten really high scores before... it's not that hard to play games with low framerates, but it DOES detract from the game, yes... but better hardware is becomming more readily available... HL is a pretty hold engine, so you won't need a Geforce 4, 2ghz computer to get very good framerates

Silver_Fox · January 2003

too bad you guys will never see "Old Hera"

That map was bloody <b>huge</b>.

I loved it ...

Kotau · January 2003

ooh ooh silverfox... You wouldnt happen to have a copy of that sitting around would you?

MasterEvilAce · January 2003

Old hera?

how much bigger is it? Screenies~

Silver_Fox · January 2003

no, during the PT's it was constantly being updated, so I dont have a copy...

I dont have an exact figure, but I think it was anywhere to double the size of the current Hera

Immacolata · January 2003

Why was it scaled down then? too heavy load on the server due to total number of entities?

Squeal_Like_A_Pig · January 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Immacolata @ Jan 13 2003, 02:17 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Why was it scaled down then? too heavy load on the server due to total number of entities?</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
Yes. But this was not a change made by, or approved by, the NS development team. In fact, Flayra actually asked server admins not to make these changes, as they can greatly impact the atmosphere, mood, and, to some degree, gameplay that the mappers worked so hard to achieve.

Flayra will be working on some changes to try and help improve performance, so hopefully the servers that are running the stripped down maps will be able to go back to the originals.

BigD · January 2003

Ahhh... thank bloody god. That was exactly what I wanted to hear. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'>

Infinitum · January 2003

hmmm it would be great if the old hera was available even as a custom download.

I still love Hera to death, it's one of my favourites if not my personal fav NS map.

peeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeez Merkaba if you have an old copy of this gigantic version of hera I would love to see it.

Soldier_of_Misfortune · January 2003

Thats good to hear. I've played the "Low Entity" maps...it just kills the whole atmosphere :\

Venmoch · January 2003

Hera is what it is because of that foggy corridoor.

(Hera and Bast are my favorite maps BTW)

ViPr · January 2003

hera and bast are also my favourite maps.

anyway this talk about server lag due to maps compels me to tell you something strange i found on eclipse.

on eclipse and other maps there is a texture that depicts a mess of wires tubes and pipes that is sagging down. because i have a lot of lag, when i came round a corner i saw that texture suddenly appear after a split second and every time i ducked round the corner it dissapeared and reappeared. this sort of thing is expected to only happen with dynamic things in the map which move such as other players, structures, lifts, doors, equipment etc. since that texture thing is static and doesn't animate at all i don't know why it is doing this.

things that don't move do not need to be server side where the server calculates if we can see it and then sends the info on it's positional state to us. this might be one of the things you may want to look at. other things that are animated in seemingly random ways do not need all their data to be sent to everyone so that it looks exactly the same on everyone's computers. examples are the particles from the phase gate and steam spewing from pipes. the exact positions of every particle do not need to be sent to the clients.

please do not simplify the maps or allow people to simplify them in order to improve server performance.

andyaml · January 2003

The only big differences I've seen are the foggy corridor from the marine spawn, and the steam from the huge vent outside being removed. (You can see it in the glass hallway that leads to the reception area)

Geronimo · January 2003

For as long as the atmosphereand the general mood in the game stays CREEPY...I like it...more fog, more darkness...Brightness 50 for the people!!!

Larofeticus · January 2003

the entity stripper (there are two versions, one is a plugin, and one is a program that processes the map and creates a new bsp) removes two types of entities from maps, particle effects, and ambient sounds. Thus all fog and steam leak effects are removed. Of course it hurts the atmosphere... all those little tweaks and such that flarya worked hard to put in... (no wonder he doesn't care for these entity strippers) Personally, I'd rather leave a laggy server, or a smooth no atmosphere one to find a server run by someone with adequate cpu.

ViPr · January 2003

i'll be mad if this is allowed to continue. people should not be allowed to mess with the creator's original vision, they can make suggestions but not change things themselves. just because it is their server does not give them the right to edit the mod as they see fit because it is not their mod. people who do that should be banned from hosting the mod on their servers.

Aaron · January 2003

Tip: One week of a minimum wage job will buy a top of the line graphics card.

someoneElse · January 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Aaron @ Jan 14 2003, 01:16 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Tip: One week of a minimum wage job will buy a top of the line graphics card.</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
How would a new expensive video card help out the load on a dedicated server?

Jeb · January 2003

Just a note, big flashy maps, even the best, will fade away after time due to people not wanting to play them due to lower FPS and higher pings.

Everyone knows you don't need 100 FPS in CS, but everyone still wants it. Its the way the players percieve things thats important, so if they are not happy with a maps performance, the map won't get as much use.

I have seen this happen to a few great maps in Counter-Strike. I would prefer to see a "hacked" version in use of a great map, then lose the map slowly from server rotations.

rebo · January 2003

Problem with Hera is not really the lag its being able to siege both data core and ventilation from 1 TF at the holoroom. Im pretty sure this still works in 1.04.

New Low Entity Version Of Hera

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