Idea for Marine item: Trapper device
Emton
USA Join Date: 2014-11-07 Member: 199502Members
USA Join Date: 2014-11-07 Member: 199502Members
Hey so I tried out this game Evolve where you play as some space marines trying to kill a monster, well there is one character that has an item you throw and it makes a dome forcefield that traps the creature. I thought this would be a pretty cool idea for NS2. It could cost like 10 - 20 res and when you throw it makes a dome forcefield (must be transparent and blue colored of course) and about big enough to hold 3 Onoses squeezed in. No one can shoot or attack through the forcefield but Marines could pass through if they felt brave enough to get inside. This could be useful for slowing down retreating aliens or an assault. That's about it I think it would be perfect in NS2
Comments
Mobility limiting Items are Bad Items, period.
Aliens have a lot of tricks to circumvent or deny main marines' advantage - ranged weapons. (corners, stealth, umbra, spores etc) But marines don't have effective tools to deny aliens' mobility. That's why i think that some mobility reducing item is needed. But it should be used against fade not against onos.
* to lower the radius
* jack up the price
* increase the difficulty of casting it
* decrease range of the casting
* increase animation times
...and so on and so forth.
This skill would be fairly easily tweakable.
So talking about whether it is inherently op or not, I think is unproductive.
However, there are several reasons why I'm opposed to this.
It is one of those sorts of abilities where I think it will EITHER be OP or UP. I don't really imagine a sweetspot. But for the sake of the argument, let's pretend there is:
I believe it would only add more frustrating ways to do die as a higher lifeform.
It would just add more junk content for new players to sort through, without adding much depth to the game. Adding content for the sake of adding content, I don't think is particularly great. It's not really serving to fill a void in the game as it stands.
So my vote is : no.
Well I think it would be just plain fun to use, even to be on the receiving end as alien. I don't really see how it would be overpowered if it cost like 15 res and lasted something like 8 seconds so my vote is: YES, YES WE CAN
Rules will be too complex.
This thing is lategame buff for marines.
Aliens already have a difficult early game. No need to make the lategame harder.
this idea however not so interested
Judging from some of these comments people seem to think it's a magic grenade that freezes all aliens from moving and makes everything invulnerable. If it cost 15 - 20 res for 1 and only lasts 8 seconds well you could only spam so many of them. Not to mention they wouldn't be perfectly accurate as you have to get fairly close to throw it. It offers a lot of new tactical play but I guess the fanboys are scared of any change...
You know what, you changed my mind. Great idea. Also let me just throw in:
* Incindiary grenades that disable alien buildings. * Blink for Onoses. * Add cyclones (the new terran unit in LotV) for marine commander. * Grabbling hook for skulks. * Magnetic boots for marines. * Gorge invincibility cloak.
In all seriousness @Emton. Adding more and more junk content for the sake of adding content, does not really add depth to the game. You simply did not present well enough why your suggestion is needed in the game. Your idea might be worth reconsidering, but you have to do a much better job presenting it. We can all come up with a thousand items that would be "useful" or "cool" or "fun" to have in the game - this is not enough justification on its own. We have to be effective with the time we spend, and we can't do that without shooting down some ideas.
The game has too much junk as it is.
Well gee I don't know what to say but if you think it would be junk content you're just not using your imagination. For a device so simple that naturally fits in with the game it adds a lot of new tactics. It could be used for defense protecting marines in a hostile area, protecting a structure in an attack, blocking a hallway, blocking a gorge tunnel, trapping an onos, while never really being overpowered due to the timed aspect and the fact that the creature still has a chance to survive since you can't shoot through. You say there's a lot of junk content already I don't see how that's so, if there's any junk content it would be the least used items which from what I've seen would be "Electrify Grenades" Let see, they slow down Alien attack speed by whatever percent, if you ask me that's kinda boring and probably the reason it doesn't get used much. So if you replaced those grenades with Containment Grenades then you wouldn't be adding anything at all. Would it help if I drew a picture, maybe I'll make something in Photoshop for fun, I mean I'm not trying to get famous by suggesting some off the wall idea, I truly really do actually think it would increase NS2 to HYPER-INSANE fun level or at least just Insane fun level x2. Maybe since the "Community is the developers" someone could make a poll everyone will see and vote on it. Or you all can forget about and I'll keep playing NS2 as long as it interests me.
Like I said before... Marines are all about aim and positioning, this would basically be a reset button for a mistake on their part, being out of position or not having a fully loaded rifle. While the aliens are all about dynamically being able to move and speed up.
Not to mention it would also mess with the Fade bounce shadowstep/blinking speeds, Skulk walljumping speed gains and lerk having to flap some more because they are. Well they are kinda being put on the naughty chair and not allowed to move or participate in the game...
The problem, in addition to those already pointed out, is that as an item, all marines can carry one, so one onos against six marines will in reality be against up to six trap domes. That onos will be taken out of the equation for a very long time while the marines just cycle their use and win the game. That's not only frustrating, but very boring for that trapped onos.
I think what it should instead be is slows the alien down, and also a weapon, and I mean a primary weapon, so no using trapper and whipping out the shotgun to wait for the cooldown to headshot instakill that gorge. Think of it as the Marines' version of Web: a webbed marine is vulnerable, but can be covered by friendly fire (or of course killed with ease). And like web, it is a teamwork tactic: webs don't kill, webs don't even slow or stop marines for a significant amount of time, and more importantly, webs can be destroyed by explosives or flame. Aliens don't really have either readily on hand, so a weapon that slows down an alien is already a significant tactical manouvre, even if the guy wielding it has no backup with firepower.
Let's call this weapon the Globber (can't think of a better word, and in nay case is hypothetical) and what it does is basically a glue version of grenade launcher: it shoots a glob of goo that on contact (either on the ground/wall or hitting alien) slows down the alien significantly, and allows all other marines to use their regular weapons to finish off. Unlike a trap dome, the alien can still manoeuvre and escape, just no as well as if it had full mobility.
The reason why it should be a primary weapon (ie no shotgun) is thus: it promotes teamwork, so if you chase after that onos and slow it down, you need a teammate with the heavy weapons to do the damage. As a team-based game, what this game needs are items that promote teamplay; if you really want to go the rambo route, you can always do the usual jetpack plus shotgun/ grenade launcher configuration (which the team will need in any case later on). If you really want to be gutsy and slow down an alien running for its life (and potentially towards a consolidated position to to nearby friends), you can always whip out your pistol/ welder/ grenades/mines.
A bit of in addition to the above idea of a forcefueld, an actual item could be used instead in a defensive mode: a grenade-like item that, when thrown, generates a small forcefield that blocks attacks and movement (or perhaps slows them down if you attempt to pass through?). Think of it like a futuristic smoke screen for a marine that is on the retreat: to prevent being shot up when running away, it can be thrown to provide some standoff as he makes that last turn arund the hallway before his health falls to zero due to the hail of spikes or spit or acid rockets and such coming after him. The drawback is that it goes both ways: a retreating marine cannot shoot through this forcefield either, it is there to protect you as you run from danger.
The shield is small so that it usually cannot cover an entire hallway, so aliens that wish to continue pursuit must manoeuvre around it. This could also be used in a proactive measure, such as throwing it into a vent to prevent aliens inside from rushing out to exploit a flank. And of course this force field only lasts for some seconds.
Of course depending on size of the team and whether this item occupies certain slots presents some balance issues, such as using it offensively to section off parts of a fortified area to attack piecemeal, knowing that the enemy can't really do anything about it as access to the trouble area is denied.
Perhaps to solve that problem this is a commander ability that requires recharging: the item can be carried by default by all marines, but only the commander can actually activate the forcefield, which costs energy or resources. How it works is that when thrown, the game activates a warning notification to the commander that a marine needs help on the retreat: the commander can then quickly press a key to activate it immediately, and hopefully the forcefield does it's job in blocking attacks that might have killed the marine. In this case the forcefield can be very large to prevent further pursuit: the effect of course is only momentary so the marine isn't necessarily home free.
I have one thing too: ceiling walking improvement for skulks. Current mechanic seems too hard, it should be more 'sticky'.
Or I don't know something?
Makes more sense to me, since JPs currently can go wherever they want.
Yup, made a post about the "JP trap" idea a few days ago.
JP trap sounds just as awful.
I don't see why.
Marines got a handful of ways to disable Aliens (pulse nades, flamethrower)
Aliens got no way to mess with movement or aim or the marines. Webs are stupid because the cost res and get instantly removed with flames or nades.
Movement-
Parasites (psychological effect)
Spores (area denial)
Stomp (full paralysis)
Clogs (obstacles)
Bonewall (obstacle, movement inhibition, group seperation)
Aim-
Phantom (nothing to aim at)
Ink (how do I aim with all this LSD still in my system?!)
Hallucination (multiple targets)
Generally having good/erratic movement
Clogs again (line of sight breakers)
Bonewall again (see clogs)
Rupture (cant see a damn thing)
Marines don't actually have any way to directly mess with alien movement in the way the OP wants to.
Pulse grenades slow attack speed.
Nerve gas for localised area denial (more like chip damage though tbh)
And technically you could count sentries as area-denial weapons in the early game
Flamethrowers drain energy but this doesnt trap you, it just forces you to use energy more conservatively and/or disengage, which is mainly only deadly for fades and lerks. Its your failure to manage energy that kills you, not literal movement inhibition.
Aliens main advantage is movement, anything that stops an alien moving literally makes them dead against marines that can aim.
That give an interesting idea, not quite a "freeze grenade" but what about a "stopping power" grenade/thing. It basically stops all alien movment and resets it to base. Any gained speed becomes nil. Onos Charge resets, everything goes back to base speed.
Could be intruiging.
Anyway, the only thing we need to say here is that This doesn't solve any existing problems with gameplay or balance. It doesn't fill in any gaps that need to be filled, and thus while it may be cool and fun and even a great idea, it's simply not necessary to add in something else to this already overly complicated game.
Is is because marines are having trouble hitting enemies. I mean isn't that the entire idea behind your skill ceiling, why add something that hard counters movement skill... TF2 has one of the most annoying weapons and they seem to have no idea how to balance the game anymore with all the crap that is being added constantly. Sandman ball of stun, Natasha bullet stopping power, mini sentries screwing up the fun etc... Let's not add things to NS2 like they do just because of "reasons". If we're going to add things to NS2, there'd better be a well defined roll and damn good reasoning behind why/who/where/when etc...
Adding stuff for the coolsies is just going to turn it into Hatsim TF2
Just putting out half-baked ideas.