New Grenade Type?
MashpitSquared
Texas, USA Join Date: 2014-01-13 Member: 193053Members
Texas, USA Join Date: 2014-01-13 Member: 193053Members
From the average pubber's perspective, the grenades available currently don't have much use (even with the recent buff). Sure, some people may choose to chuck a cluster in a vent, or a nerve gas against a rush. But I feel (in my own opinion) that cluster is disgustingly ineffective at doing any damage, and while nerve gas can be handy to have around at times, it doesn't do its job fast enough to matter in anything other than a siege. I never see pulse getting used outside of combat mod, so there's that too. But what if there was a new incendiary grenade type?
Basically, it would work similarly to a molotov cocktail. Throw it, has a small bit of explosive damage where it lands, but spreads fire around the landing point, which would have about 1/2 the damage you would receive from standing in a flamethrower's line of fire. This would have a multitude of uses:
- Clear out vents in early/mid game without jetpacks (flame will spread inside the vent further than it would in an open area) - no, cluster isn't even remotely useful for this job.
- Force alien reinforcements to flank, increasing alien travel time without the TRes investment of sentries
- Set Fades and Lerks on fire, even without AA.
- Protect high value assets without using destroyable, expensive mines.
In return for being quite a bit more useful compared to the other grenades, maybe the nades should be split into two tiers: Burst Damage Grenades (Cluster, Pulse) and DoT Grenades (Nerve, Fire). The tiers individually will be cheaper to unlock as a comm, but should be more than the current grenade research costs when added together.
The fire should burn shorter when on infestation, but should not be extinguishable by a Gorge (teammates and buildings that have caught fire will be able to put out - just not the original fire from the grenade). After all, one of its main uses would be getting Gorge forts out of vents.
If this is ever considered seriously, it can probably use the Spore clouds, except invisible and sinking much faster, to do damage, while using the fire particle effect caused by the flamethrower on the affected region. I can see how spamming the incendiary nade would cause huge amounts of lag, though.
Basically, it would work similarly to a molotov cocktail. Throw it, has a small bit of explosive damage where it lands, but spreads fire around the landing point, which would have about 1/2 the damage you would receive from standing in a flamethrower's line of fire. This would have a multitude of uses:
- Clear out vents in early/mid game without jetpacks (flame will spread inside the vent further than it would in an open area) - no, cluster isn't even remotely useful for this job.
- Force alien reinforcements to flank, increasing alien travel time without the TRes investment of sentries
- Set Fades and Lerks on fire, even without AA.
- Protect high value assets without using destroyable, expensive mines.
In return for being quite a bit more useful compared to the other grenades, maybe the nades should be split into two tiers: Burst Damage Grenades (Cluster, Pulse) and DoT Grenades (Nerve, Fire). The tiers individually will be cheaper to unlock as a comm, but should be more than the current grenade research costs when added together.
The fire should burn shorter when on infestation, but should not be extinguishable by a Gorge (teammates and buildings that have caught fire will be able to put out - just not the original fire from the grenade). After all, one of its main uses would be getting Gorge forts out of vents.
If this is ever considered seriously, it can probably use the Spore clouds, except invisible and sinking much faster, to do damage, while using the fire particle effect caused by the flamethrower on the affected region. I can see how spamming the incendiary nade would cause huge amounts of lag, though.
Comments
In the 170 (hive recorded) matches I've played, I've never once been killed by a cluster grenade, and I have about two deaths due to a pulse grenade. Two deaths out of 929.
THROWABLE grenade spam is present but basically useless, unless it's nerve gas against a hive. If this is implemented, it will REDUCE nerve gas spam against hive, since it will cost more for marine comm to research.
Now, GL spam, on the other hand, is painfully effective and used often. But we're not talking about the GL, are we?
Don't see how this could be a bad thing, to be honest.
But i do disagree with cluster nades - they are awesome. Ever had 2/3 skulks in a vent? No? Boom crackle boom, 3 dead skulks.
Im thinking about pretty much a more expensive grenade with a very small aoe with much higher DoT and it could also set things on fire as a bonus.
The fact that they cost 3 pres now, you have to purchase them every spawn, and they don't drop on player death is what often deters their use. One or more of these options could help:
1) They drop on player death. Other players can pickup unused grenades. You drop a 3 pres welder, why not a grenade?
2) For 3 pres each, most players don't buy them since that can go straight toward mines (much more effective) or a shotgun. As a purely economic choice they're not a very good investment.
3) Make grenades free, and you can spawn with your preferred type once selected at the armory (and researched by the comm). This might be IMBA, so grenade damage may have to be lowered.
Holy cow I hope I misunderstood you. I can just picture marines standing next to an armory, "buying" their free grenades, THROW, THROW, get 2 more, THROW THROW, 2 more... etc.
Maybe even having bought a pack of 3, it would add on-to your free grenade letting you have 4 in your pocket?
Or something similar?
Also try and play Gorge and have a nerfgas nade in your face and then still call them useless.
However, there are some concerns, although they are probably just number tweakings.
If they disable structures, they could severely shift balance. The only way I see to remedy this, is make it ridiculously expensive.
And about FF. Could you for example drop an incindiary grenade on your team mate, and have your comm spam meds on him, and basically make an invinsible marine for a time?
You have to be very careful about implementing a grenade like this. But it is a very simplistic way to add depth to the game, which I love, if done correctly!
Pulse Grenade Re-work? Needed.
I do like some of the ideas on here regarding how grenades are given out. NS1 you spawned with 1 hand grenade after research, that was it. I don't recall anyone complaining about it.
I have played Gorge with nerve gas in my fort, and for the most part, you can heal yourself well enough to survive the spam until the Skulks can clear out the push. I never remember people using grenades much against gorge forts; usually, it was just "run in, shoot tunnel, shoot hydras, end".
I find that babblers are useless for attacking marines. I owe several Fades to Gorges who stuck babblers onto me, and babblers tend to make a handy distraction at times - throw a babbler bait onto a building, hide somewhere else, and marines coming your way will waste their time by ignoring everything else and searching the area immediately next to the building 9/10 times.
One idea which has not been tested is a non-stacking energy drain over time (eg 50 net energy drain over 5 seconds) which stops when an alien's energy is below a level (so it can never completely drain an alien's energy, similar to how Lerk bite poison affects health, except on energy).