Deluxe Player with a first time ever comment
Alicethechain
Nunya Join Date: 2013-10-18 Member: 188753Members
Nunya Join Date: 2013-10-18 Member: 188753Members
So I've been playing this game (NS2, not NS1) for a long time. This is the first time I've ever made an account to post here.
I just wanted to say that I'm a little disappointed at the current state of the game as far as balance is concerned.
It feels marines early game are absolutely stomping the vast majority of public games. It seems from playing skulk and marine, that I am faster as a marine than as a skulk in combat situations. I'm not sure if thats because of the side jump (since I do get a huge acceleration from this in combat against skulks) or if the marine run speed is very close to that of the skulks. Its just making public games really boring and one sided. Especially if you get some real solid shooters on the marine side.
I'm not really that good of a player, despite having been playing this since it was first available to early supporters of the game about 4 years go or however long that was. So I'm not saying I'm the absolute authority on the matter but just speaking from someone who has been playing NS2 for a very very long time. The balance seems out of sync at the moment. I felt I needed to voice my opinion and experiences.
Thanks
I just wanted to say that I'm a little disappointed at the current state of the game as far as balance is concerned.
It feels marines early game are absolutely stomping the vast majority of public games. It seems from playing skulk and marine, that I am faster as a marine than as a skulk in combat situations. I'm not sure if thats because of the side jump (since I do get a huge acceleration from this in combat against skulks) or if the marine run speed is very close to that of the skulks. Its just making public games really boring and one sided. Especially if you get some real solid shooters on the marine side.
I'm not really that good of a player, despite having been playing this since it was first available to early supporters of the game about 4 years go or however long that was. So I'm not saying I'm the absolute authority on the matter but just speaking from someone who has been playing NS2 for a very very long time. The balance seems out of sync at the moment. I felt I needed to voice my opinion and experiences.
Thanks
Comments
I've heard top level players complain about it, too - so you're not alone on this one.
I'm for just allowing the skulk to be better at changing directions abruptly whilst in very close combat - that'd probably fix it.
http://forums.unknownworlds.com/categories/ideas-and-suggestions
Yeah, skulk is hard at VERY early game, in the first minutes, but once lerks roll out it's alien-sided in my experience. Also once you have upgrades it becomes balanced, actually even alien-sided later, as they make the skulks into that really powerful free unit.
IMHO the balance scaling is off as whole, skulks could use a tiny boost in the beginning, but a nerf in the late game. But it goes with other lifeforms too, lerks are too strong early game (30 pres lerk should fix that imho - or 15 starting res); fades are odd alltogether as is onos ('strong' but so weak at the same time).
Also some meta balance, i.e. certain weapons vs certain lifeforms or for certain objectives, like LMG doesn't do shit against fade anymore because of the massive Fade HP.
Though, to annoy @BestProfileName it is actually partial to a L2P issue too, I don't see many skulks walljumping or setting traps, or attacking together. Also, many people don't seem to know 1 Para + 2 bites = dead marine, so they just bite 3 times, even though it's unnecessary until Armor 1.
I agree with BestProfileName with lowering the movement speed. Play a little and you'll realize this is the real problem. Just chase a marine as a skulk or lerk and wait till they 180 turn. It's so freaking fast it looks unnatural, and is near impossible to keep up with unless you're Miss Cleo. Maybe lowering this would make SJ not so bad...
Welcome to the forums, btw.
Considering the numerous problems with the shotgun, it does not in fact oneshot skulks all the time.
Also, phatom skulks that make no noise while moving can get a free bite easily [or alternatively with Aura they can pick you off as they see you're on low HP], if you add cloak, you might have free 2 bites. With celerity, leap and walljump they can catch up to you and move around quickly to avoid damage, and with biomass and carapace, they tank a whopping 150 DMG.
Sure, shotty does 221 dmg (assuming W3), but it's easy to miss multiple of the 17 pellets because of problems with game and to some extend shotgun (i.e. large sperad on outer circle [outer 8] - skulks have to be VERY close to oneshot, close enough to get a bite off; the spread rotation is random, which means in the same situation you will NOT reliabily hit the skulks in the same way (which is stupid).
Then you have ns2 annoying lag compensation and broken hitreg, resulting in funny little situations like marines killing you that DON'T EVEN FACE you, getting killed AROUND CORNERS, or COMPETE HITS going MIA (i.e. hit sprites, no hit registered - or partial), resulting in skulks not being reliably killable with a shotgun as well as odd kill situations on the skulk. And yes, this happens on stable 30 Tick servers. It even happens vs bots, not as bad like versus real players though.
Now also consider that a shotgun is worth 20 PRes and a skulk is a free lifeform. With JP, it's an added 15 PRES. With welder and an added 3 PRES.
It's quite possible, especially with phantom or a way skulk, to take down a JP guy worth 37 PRES. It becomes easier if marines don't have full armor upgrades.
2 skulks > 1 marine in bad spot
3 skulks > 1 marine in good spot
deal with it ?
lol so you want the game to be 12 vs 6?
Dont try to win the game with skulks only. There are other lifeforms.
I like the current marine movement, but skulks need a small boost in speed. Right now early game can be very hard for skulks without celerity.
I would like the skulk to maybe accelerate a little faster (so you can fix a mistake) or be a bit more forgiving but I don't feel its a massive imbalance, just harder to reach the same goal as an alien than a marine.
Also I see quite a few topics on this forum regarding game balance (tweaking hit and health numbers a few percent) when in my opinion player behavior is a far bigger detraction to the play experience than faction balance at the moment.
A couple perfect shooters playing rookie server all stars ruin games.
Those same people stacking (intentionally or otherwise) ruining a server.
Other players giving up the second they see two badged players on a team.
Players declaring a match over 2 minutes into the game (It may be valid but there is a huge emphasis on the initial battles).
Players dropping or quitting immediately (hello team balance)
All this has a far more negative impact on my play than not winning every engagement I feel I should. Respawn and win the next engagement. But because of stuff like the above I played almost 4 hours yesterday an never had one of the coveted "barn burners" or close games. I would say that games that don't end up as one of the above are less than 15% of my gameplay experience.
TLDR - It's becoming more common to scroll through my steam library and pick something else than it is to fire up NS2. Not because I don't like the game (a fun close game is still one of the best experiences in gaming in my opinion) but because that's not how I picture the game anymore. Good games are a rarity.
it's indeed annoying but you can easily adapt your playstyle to limit the annoyance. as skulk i only go for sure-fire kills and the rest of the time i sneak behind marine lines and attack RT's (if there are good shooters on marines i'm more cautious and try to avoid 1v1's entirely as skulk).
put it into perspective... if there's a marine on his way to kill your RT, you have two options:
a) try to kill him - oh no he has an overpowered side jump and killed you cheaply
b) attack his undefended RT - the marine has to stop, turn around and spend (waste) time running back to defend, only for you to potentially go into a vent and attack another undefended RT - constantly causing marines to waste time doing nothing.
remember - your job as alien is merely to STALL until you get higher lifeforms. you really don't need skulk vs marine combat skills unless you lose your higher lifeform - especially as marines require about 22 bites to kill at that stage, imo only then does the 'iwin jump' unfairly tip the scale in favour of marine
tl;dr: in pub play, issues such as this are not game-breaking or even a problem if you adapt to a smarter playstyle.
What are most skulks doing in this situation?
They ran back to courtyard one by one to an position they cant attack alone and doing this again and again.
This is nothing about missing balance. If skulks try to engage a good shooter in an area like courtyard alone over and over they are dumb, thats all.
But instead of changing the tactic, they calling "cheater", "stacked teams" or ragequit.
Every defense I see for the current strafe jumping always comes back to the same excuses. Blaming the players skill and competence on how to play skulk.
Also, skulks alone can't run the party - the other lifeforms need something to do, too.
Apart from that, a smartly played skulk (as mentioned above) in combination with some practice is actually quite dangerous.
I think the current game balance is pretty fine. (Maybe fade movement needs a small buff, they are no fun to play currently, imo.)
The same amount of times I've seen a jetpacker chase down an onos and kill him with a shotgun.
yeah let's make ns2 into a pve-only game, that'll attract the crowds for sure.
I'm so glad whips have become a big part of competitive play, aren't you?
tl;dr base lifeforms should not feel incapable of engaging other base units ever.
*Yawn* Another strafe jump whine thread. Aliens have had it way too easy since this game launched. Skulks should not be 1v1ing against a marine. Skulks already have unlimited ammo (bite) and too fast respawn times. Lay traps, ambush, and hunt in packs.
But OP, you didn't feel like posting when there was the 6 minute onos issue, the 1 hive onos egg drop issue, or the 6 min fade rush issue. Neither did you post when the marine upgrade costs were increased, when exos were nerfed, or when whips deflected grenades, or when grenade damage was reduced, or when marine spawn time was increased. No, then, while aliens enjoyed >70% win rate, all was fine and dandy. Marines get one buff and the freeloader skulks come out from under every nook and cranny to whine.
Although you may feel like marines are winning, that is not what statistics show. Most of your predecessor whiners didn't actually mention win-rates, just that they found it unfair they couldn't 1v1 win against a marine. I guess you've made a contribution in that respect. Perhaps spend some time spectating better skulks on other servers and learn some better tactics?
Welcome to the forums, but I have to disagree with you fundamentally.
So now you want the turn speed to be lowered? Sheesh...
Lots of times, and most of the time, it is because the Exo pilot was a bad player and decided to push into an Alien area alone.
A bigger issue is Xenocide, that is incredibly frustrating to deal with as a Marine player (a single Skulk can wipe out the Marines welding an Exo) and isn't much fun as an Alien because you die as a result.
That can be countered with teamwork (Gorge webs, Bone Wall etc). On the other hand, the only counter to Xenocide is to kill the skulk before they get in range, which isn't always easy depending on location (corners, room entrances etc).
A good skulk will be able to kill the welder.
[/quote]
A good exo will have no problem killing a skulk, even at close range.
A good Skulk can kill every welder with Xenocide. All they need to do is wait until the Exo has no line of sight before attacking, for example, waiting in an ambush position for the Marines to walk through a doorway or around a corner, then making your move. And you can activate Xenocide then Leap as well to quickly close the distance. It is very effective, and difficult to counter, and doesn't take a great deal of skill to pull off. The only saving grace is that Xenocide takes a while to obtain.
But anyway, that isn't really what this thread is about. If I had to make a guess, I would say the OP is a smurf account from one of the regular forum users. If the forum account had been around for longer, I would be more inclined to believe it. When a forum account is created for the sole purpose of complaining about a balance issue, chances are it is from someone that is trying to create the impression that there are more dissatisfied players than there actually are (because every normal attempt to get the balance changed results in being shot down by players that don't agree).
Tip 1 - Move! gain as much ground at the very start as possible by wall jumping for extra speed and try to gain that extra bit of map control. But watch out for that sneaky competitive player pushing forward to pick you off.
Tip 2- SHHHH!! be quite! The marines greatest weapon early on is his ears. Hold shift as soon as you are in the far near vicinity. The most annoying thing on pub is trying to sneak close to the marines and some gimp runs up behind you as loud as a onos. A decent marine will hear you from the next room easily.
Tip 3- Parasite first! Unless you dont want to give away your pressence (like being in a vent, waiting to ambush) Every skulk should be parasiting as soon as they see a marine. Not only does this show your WHOLE team and commander where they are, they wont have wielders early on and this will allow you to kill them in 2 bites.
Tip 4 - Team up, Group up! If the whole team follows the above 3 tips, you should have had no silly head on early engagements. The marines will be stuck in their room, with a built RT, all lit up from the parasites, waiting for the noob pub skulks to come in 1 by 1. But you don't. Your commander is busy capping the whole map and upgrades are on their way. As soon as they push out of the room they will be ambushed by the 3/4 skulks in close quarters combat and with 2 bites each they fall.
Rinse and repeat until life forms.
Don't get shade hive, its useless against noisy marines when the aliens play properly. Celerity FTW against those strafe jumping rines.
And again, parasite first, engage when he's close, Bite, Marine strafe jumps, land that 1 last bite and boom. Your a hero.