ns2_wade_public_alpha (07/02/13)

SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
edited February 2013 in Mapping
An original map by Smaug

ns2_wade_public_alpha


TP: 4
RT: 10

Current Version: Alpha 2 (07/02/13)

Hello everyone,

My name is Meurig "Smaug" Jenkins, and I've been mapping as a hobby for several years.

When I bought NS2 a few years ago I decided that I really wanted to try and make a map for this game, so two years ago I set out and designed a map with a few friends, and set off making it.

I've been at the map on and off ever since, but I came to the conclusion a few days ago that I should just get it released, as I don't often play this game anymore.

I did wish for this to be a competitively played map, however, seeing as I started making this map whilst the game was early in beta, the gameplay shifted so drastically so often, that I couldn't keep up. I do believe this has the potential to be a fun map regardless, however!

I really do enjoy mapping, so I really hope that I get a lot of feedback on here, because regardless of how often I play these days, I want to complete the map, and I want people to enjoy playing my map!

Map Layout

[img]http://i.imgur.com/cz11mew.jpg[/img]


The map is Cross-spawns (north vs south) with Aliens in the North and Marines in the South.

I really want Marines and Aliens to fight it out in Harvest Point, and it used to be a double tech room, but I have now changed it to be a double RT room only.

Please see the video I made below for more details.

Screenshots

[img]http://i.imgur.com/KHUq3PA.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/fIl5RfH.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/WbZcMjc.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/XtZpEYQ.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/fjsz9Ui.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/hkvTNW4.jpg[/img]

Video walkthrough + commentary

I have made a walkthrough video of the map for Alpha 2 of ns2_wade, mainly highlighting the rooms I've remade, and what I've done to combat the Marine LoS issues.

You can find the video here:

http://youtu.be/UF0iP_ZH6kM

Old Videos:

Alpha 1: http://www.twitch.tv/smaugpendraig/c/1765190

Feedback

A list of things I am specifically looking at:

- Where vents should be added
- Brightness Levels
- Awkward Geometry
- Real Accounts of how Harvest Point affected the gameplay (and personal feelings towards it after trying the map out in a well filled server)

Download

You can download the map by subscribing to the map on the Steam workshop.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/file...s/?id=112168678

Additional Comments

As I said before, please bare in mind that this is an alpha, and the first time I've let anyone really see it.

I really want to keep working on this map until it is finished. If people think this map is worth checking out, then please let me hear the feedback!

If you would also like to help out with things, such as models, textures etc, or you have an idea how to make some of the rooms in the map really amazing, you don't need my permission to just do it and show me, the chances are I will be more than happy to add any extra things people make for the map into it.

I do strongly recommend watching the video I made as well!

And please, do try to be nice about the feedback, I am not thick skinned, and I am not a professional mapper, but I do want to make it as well as it can be made.

Special Thanks

Special thanks goes to

Chi
Savior
Vez

For helping me loads with the layout, the looks, giving me ideas, and just generally keeping my spirits up.
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Comments

  • insane_enufinsane_enuf Join Date: 2003-06-09 Member: 17160Members
    <3 smaug

    Love your map!
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  • MisterYoonMisterYoon Join Date: 2012-08-18 Member: 155747Members
    looks good, but the lightning is way too much bright. That kills atmosphere i think. I do think that it would be much better if it's darker.
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  • schkorpioschkorpio I can mspaint Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16635Members
    <!--quoteo(post=2042210:date=Dec 9 2012, 11:09 AM:name=MisterYoon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MisterYoon @ Dec 9 2012, 11:09 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2042210"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->looks good, but the lightning is way too much bright. That kills atmosphere i think. I do think that it would be much better if it's darker.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    +1
    some areas are super bright/intense
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    edited December 2012
    Thanks for taking a look!

    I'm having some trouble getting people to play the map at the moment; I don't know any server admins personally. I think someone called Mr. FruityFunCakes is putting it up on his server, I spoke with Gliss and he's gonna take a look at putting the map up, and Ryne told me the sad news that the all-in server that was running 3rd party maps was down, and I'm gonna ask on the KKG forum if they'd put it up on one of theirs.

    If anyone knows of any people that can put the map up, even for an hour or so, that would be very helpful.

    And thanks to the people who messaged me in private that they like the map too! Hopefully I can get people to play it as well as look at it :P

    Edit: Might be an idea of collecting a database of server admins who run 3rd party maps, so that 3rd party mappers can let people know of a map they just released, with someone responsible (like Hugh, for an example) to keep the list private, and determine if it's worth letting the admins know (so server admins aren't spammed).
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  • KingKahunaKingKahuna Join Date: 2008-03-23 Member: 63944Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=2043249:date=Dec 10 2012, 08:46 PM:name=Smaug)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Smaug @ Dec 10 2012, 08:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2043249"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Thanks for taking a look!

    I'm having some trouble getting people to play the map at the moment; I don't know any server admins personally. I think someone called Mr. FruityFunCakes is putting it up on his server, I spoke with Gliss and he's gonna take a look at putting the map up, and Ryne told me the sad news that the all-in server that was running 3rd party maps was down, and I'm gonna ask on the KKG forum if they'd put it up on one of theirs.

    If anyone knows of any people that can put the map up, even for an hour or so, that would be very helpful.

    And thanks to the people who messaged me in private that they like the map too! Hopefully I can get people to play it as well as look at it :P

    Edit: Might be an idea of collecting a database of server admins who run 3rd party maps, so that 3rd party mappers can let people know of a map they just released, with someone responsible (like Hugh, for an example) to keep the list private, and determine if it's worth letting the admins know (so server admins aren't spammed).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    We will playtest this map tomorrow on KKG3. Can't wait to see what the map is like.
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  • BicsumBicsum Join Date: 2012-02-27 Member: 147596Members, Reinforced - Gold
    <!--quoteo(post=2043249:date=Dec 11 2012, 01:46 AM:name=Smaug)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Smaug @ Dec 11 2012, 01:46 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2043249"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Thanks for taking a look!

    I'm having some trouble getting people to play the map at the moment; I don't know any server admins personally. I think someone called Mr. FruityFunCakes is putting it up on his server, I spoke with Gliss and he's gonna take a look at putting the map up, and Ryne told me the sad news that the all-in server that was running 3rd party maps was down, and I'm gonna ask on the KKG forum if they'd put it up on one of theirs.

    If anyone knows of any people that can put the map up, even for an hour or so, that would be very helpful.

    And thanks to the people who messaged me in private that they like the map too! Hopefully I can get people to play it as well as look at it :P

    Edit: Might be an idea of collecting a database of server admins who run 3rd party maps, so that 3rd party mappers can let people know of a map they just released, with someone responsible (like Hugh, for an example) to keep the list private, and determine if it's worth letting the admins know (so server admins aren't spammed).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I'll check this out today.
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  • FlaterectomyFlaterectomy Netherlandistan Join Date: 2005-02-03 Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    Just played this map on a full KKG server. We played two rounds, both won by marines. The alien team overall didn't seem to like the size of most rooms; they're pretty big and it's difficult to escape after getting close to marines in most those big rooms. I believe shrinking those areas down a bit would be helpful. Lowering some ceilings here and there could be helpful as well.

    There was a lot of combat in the double res node location, so that worked out like you wanted to. The power node is a little too exposed, though. Lerks can hide in darkness and just keep spiking.

    I understand that the map is an alpha version, so I'm not sure how finalized your geometry is, but to be safe I'll just comment anyway. ;) Some of the walls are a bit bland. You may want to break long empty walls up with some detail work.

    You seem to be aware of the brightness issues and fog (specifically the atmospheric density on spotlights being too high; I prefer to stick to values of 0.1 - 0.3 myself) in many places, but I wanted to point them out regardless. There's often a stark contrast between darkness and foggy spot lights that I find a little unsettling. Also, most your lights seem to be white. I think what you should do is figure out a main lighting/colour scheme to give the map some uniformity.

    Like I said, we only played two (fairly one-sided) rounds, so it's hard to comment on the layout.

    I look forward to seeing this map progress! \o/
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    <!--quoteo(post=2043984:date=Dec 12 2012, 12:05 AM:name=Flaterectomy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Flaterectomy @ Dec 12 2012, 12:05 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2043984"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just played this map on a full KKG server. We played two rounds, both won by marines. The alien team overall didn't seem to like the size of most rooms; they're pretty big and it's difficult to escape after getting close to marines in most those big rooms. I believe shrinking those areas down a bit would be helpful. Lowering some ceilings here and there could be helpful as well.

    There was a lot of combat in the double res node location, so that worked out like you wanted to. The power node is a little too exposed, though. Lerks can hide in darkness and just keep spiking.

    I understand that the map is an alpha version, so I'm not sure how finalized your geometry is, but to be safe I'll just comment anyway. ;) Some of the walls are a bit bland. You may want to break long empty walls up with some detail work.

    You seem to be aware of the brightness issues and fog (specifically the atmospheric density on spotlights being too high; I prefer to stick to values of 0.1 - 0.3 myself) in many places, but I wanted to point them out regardless. There's often a stark contrast between darkness and foggy spot lights that I find a little unsettling. Also, most your lights seem to be white. I think what you should do is figure out a main lighting/colour scheme to give the map some uniformity.

    Like I said, we only played two (fairly one-sided) rounds, so it's hard to comment on the layout.

    I look forward to seeing this map progress! \o/<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    That's awesome feedback, thank you!
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  • AzaralAzaral Join Date: 2012-11-19 Member: 172408Members
    Just played it on KKG. The rooms are just way too big. Harvest point is interesting, but still way too open. Just, way too big.
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    <!--quoteo(post=2044761:date=Dec 13 2012, 03:41 AM:name=Azaral)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Azaral @ Dec 13 2012, 03:41 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2044761"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just played it on KKG. The rooms are just way too big. Harvest point is interesting, but still way too open. Just, way too big.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yep, gonna be downsizing a lot of rooms - I prefer to downsize things than to add anyway! :P

    Thanks for the feedback!
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  • swalkswalk Say hello to my little friend. Join Date: 2011-01-20 Member: 78384Members, Squad Five Blue
    edited December 2012
    I would suggest removing the two tech points close to eachother in the middle of the map.
    The double resnodes in that room should be more than enough incentive to hold it. :)
    I think the map could be more interesting being a 4 tech point map.
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    <!--quoteo(post=2048056:date=Dec 19 2012, 04:12 PM:name=swalk)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (swalk @ Dec 19 2012, 04:12 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2048056"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would suggest removing the two tech points close to eachother in the middle of the map.
    The double resnodes in that room should be more than enough incentive to hold it. :)
    I think the map could be more interesting being a 4 tech point map.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yes, I think that might be an interesting idea!

    Thanks!
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    edited January 2013
    I have started working on this again, going through downsizing the rooms etc. Thanks again to everyone who've tested and given me feedback and words of encouragement!

    I've turned this into a 4 tech point map now as well, the central room is a double RT room only now. With Gorges getting new abilities, not having a tech point in that room should be fine, I hope!

    A quick picture of what I've been working on today. Nothing amazing, but the ceiling and the feel of the room should be noticeably different to before!

    <img src="http://i.imgur.com/hU8PsEB.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    Hello.

    For anyone who is interested, I am relatively close to getting another alpha out on to the steam workshop, but before that I was hoping someone would have some idea on how to fix a problem I've been having

    Video Demonstrating nav mesh problem

    I apologize for the frames dropping, it's the first time it's ever done that, but it does clearly show the problem areas.

    Easier to view the video, but I have tried everything from removing the door frames, widening the corridors, heightening the corridors, using the pathing entities, and I just cannot crack it, it simply refuses to path through 50% of the door frames - but the other 50% it is happy with.

    I really hope someone can throw suggestions my way, as I do not want these issues to persist so I can get feedback again!

    Thanks for checking this out, and thanks for any help given.
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  • Evil_bOb1Evil_bOb1 Join Date: 2002-07-13 Member: 938Members, Squad Five Blue
    I'm not sure but I seem to understand that you are using multiple pathing_settings entities? One is enough for the whole map.

    What values are you using for your pathing_settings?
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  • AurOn2AurOn2 COOKIES&#33; FREEDOM, AND BISCUITS&#33; Australia Join Date: 2012-01-13 Member: 140224Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Forum staff
    edited February 2013
    woahly moahly. this map looks fantastic, though you have some small problems and layout issues, it has great potential.
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    Evil_bOb1 wrote: »
    I'm not sure but I seem to understand that you are using multiple pathing_settings entities? One is enough for the whole map.

    What values are you using for your pathing_settings?

    Yeah, sorry, I meant tweaking the various settings in the pathing_settings entity, not that I was using multiple, I was poorly wording it.

    On the plus side, after messing around with the pathing_settings more, I've got it to work, and it's now pathing through doors as it should! Hurray!

    Thanks for the kind words, AuroN2! I think I will be able to get a new version out in the next few days now that the pathing bug is gone. The map is still heavily in Alpha, and I intend to make the map really nice once I feel that the map is balanced enough - the texturing and lighting in it at the moment is a rough representation of what I'd like it to look and feel like, as all that stuff does add to balancing etc. Having more groups of people test the map would be amazing, thank you!
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  • Evil_bOb1Evil_bOb1 Join Date: 2002-07-13 Member: 938Members, Squad Five Blue
    Cool, glad you got to work it out :)
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    Alpha 2 Released 07/02/13

    Hello everyone,

    I have finally finished making the second alpha to ns2_wade. If you have subscribed on the steam workshop page, it should automatically download.

    If you haven't, please subscribe and try the map out! http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=112168678

    Overview of changes

    Alpha 2 has mainly been about giving the skulks some leverage, as there was massive line of sight issues throughout the map. I've also given the map some uniformity in lighting, so it should look a bit more pleasant.

    There are areas in the map that are still just crappy walling and stuff, but I will make it look more part of the map when the balance is a bit better.

    I've also fixed the bug that meant you couldn't cyst or path any of the AI around.

    And the big thing to mention is the map is now a 4 tech point map, instead of 6.

    New screenshots may be seen in the original post and on the steam workshop.

    Video Log

    I have made another video log, which is roughly 15 minutes long, just going through the map and showing the stuff I've done to change it. Please do check it out, as I go over the main thoughts of what I've done differently. It cuts off abruptly as I didn't want to go over the 15 min mark, sorry!



    Changelog

    Alpha2

    - [~General~] Fixed mesh bug with going through doors
    - [~General~] Removed 2 tech nodes from Harvest point - map is now a 4 Tech Point map.
    - [~General~] Improved Occlusion Culling brushes

    - [Marine Start] Renamed Marine Start to Airport

    - [Shipment Bay] Lowered ceiling considerably, now on 2 levels
    - [Shipment Bay] Lowered glass to compensate for lowered ceilings
    - [Shipment Bay] Opened doors to dinner table room with broken window
    - [Shipment Bay] Alligned left hand light fixture
    - [Shipment Bay] Doors resized
    - [Shipment Bay] Corridor tightened and reshaped, ceilings lowered
    - [Shipment Bay] Side room made smaller (useless space)
    - [Shipment Bay] Added working door to close LoS down corridor
    - [Shipment Bay] Replaced a few crates in relation to the new ceiling height
    - [Shipment Bay] Added minor details
    - [Shipment Bay] Added ambient lights
    - [Shipment Bay] Added extra compartment on a bare wall

    - [Harvest Point] Lowered central ceiling considerably
    - [Harvest Point] Resized models to fit new ceiling height
    - [Harvest Point] Removed both Tech Points
    - [Harvest Point] Doors resized
    - [Harvest Point] Moved Power Node to safer location on Marine Side

    - [VIP Hallway] Added pillars to reduce LoS down corridor
    - [VIP Hallway] Resized doors
    - [VIP Hallway] Resized corridors

    - [Pipe Hatchway] Remade entire corridor geometry from scratch to be perfectly circular and tighter
    - [Pipe Hatchway] Resized Doors

    - [Waste Disposal] Lowered ceiling
    - [Waste Disposal] Lowered Geometry Pipes
    - [Waste Disposal] Added pipes for LoS blocking
    - [Waste Disposal] Resized Doors

    - [Shipment Delivery] Shifted helipad + left half of room geometry south (less awkward, makes more sense, helps a bit with LoS)
    - [Shipment Delivery] Added rock models underneath/above glass to look more indented into the wall
    - [Shipment Delivery] Fixed bug causing buildings not to be powered in certain areas of the room

    - [Cave Access] Shifted geometry to fit in with new Helipad position

    - [Alien Start] Shifted vent exit to correspond with new positioning of Shipment Delivery
    - [Alien Start] Lowered ceiling on the sides
    - [Alien Start] Resized door
    - [Alien Start] Renamed Alien Start to "Incubation"

    - [Storage Room] Resized doors and geometry

    - [Power Maintenance] Added placeholder props to break LoS a little

    - [Stairwell] Added new glass ceiling
    - [Stairwell] Removed ugly wall mods
    - [Stairwell] Renamed Stairwell to "Engineer's Stairwell"

    - [Recreation Room] Added new glass ceiling
    - [Recreation Room] Removed ugly wall mods

    - [Processing Plant] Moved tech point for an easier natural RT expansion for Aliens.

    Help and stuff

    As always, it would be amazing if pub servers would throw this up for an hour or so, even if it only gives me one reply for feedback, it's better than none.

    Seems to be that pug groups is where testing is at at the moment, and it would be great to be included in those if I'm around.

    Recording the games is also super amazing, as sometimes you see something and forget it later on, and it's nice to see where players are more frustrated and where they're happier.

    As always, if any clans or teams would be so kind as to try this map out, please do record and let me watch the game, it would make my day!

    Thanks again to the usual trolls, Gliss, Vez etc. And thanks to the KingKahunaGames lot for testing the map last time!
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  • SmaugSmaug Join Date: 2011-05-23 Member: 100283Members
    Thanks to everyone who's played the map and been giving me feedback!

    Here's a video of a pug game we had on it today - sadly, it decided to cut recording right near the end of the first round. 4 Games were played, all won by ie's team (So Marines won twice and Aliens won twice).

    Round 1 Part 1:



    Round 1 Part 2:



    Please please please keep the feedback coming, and let me know if you're intending on playing the map sometime so I can come watch/play!
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