F4: Why don't pubbers know how to concede defeat?
godrifle
Join Date: 2006-12-01 Member: 58815Members
Join Date: 2006-12-01 Member: 58815Members
There seems to be a disconnect from forum-goers that understand when an F4 is needed, and the pub players that want to stay until the very bitter end. I've been shouted at and called a retard for recycling. Hitting F4 or recycling is an accepted practice, especially in this game when a team can be deadlocked into one or two rooms, and stay that way for the next ten minutes. Not everyone has time to game; and the best part of the game is when there is exciting conflict, so starting a fresh round is in everyone's best interests (imo).
Should people be angry when a game is won/lost due to F4 conditions?
Is there a delicate way to allow the community to accept the practice of giving up, in the interest of time?
How do you feel about games that are F4'd?
Should people be angry when a game is won/lost due to F4 conditions?
Is there a delicate way to allow the community to accept the practice of giving up, in the interest of time?
How do you feel about games that are F4'd?
Comments
I am !
When you feel like you played like ###### the whole game, and that you're first of the team, this makes me mad.
As marine, people that doesn't understand how JP are useful for chasing onos, or retreating ; or people that waste their shotguns/GL going way too far alone, people that can't even try to kill a lerk (its so weak ! likes when a single one enter and you do half the damage by the way it goes out, and 5 to 10 of your teamates are beside you) makes me mad.
As aliens, people camping and not being agressive denying RT's makes me mad.
Oh boy...
But the "pub players" aren't the only one staying. Sometimes these other people are good and makes you feel that if the rest of your team wasn't that r* you could revert how the game goes easily.
There should be a vote, that would prevent a 12v8-because-some-quit-and-other-stays. Like a voterecycle. (There might be a plugin that exist; but that section in forum is so poorly done that it's not appealing to learn).
I was Commanding an Alien 7v7 pub the other night when it happened to me. We were on Tram starting in Sub and put up a Hive in repair. We held off a Marine push on Repair but they ended up being the stronger side (they were pushing from their main Warehouse base IIRC) and ended up taking control of it. Immediately we had a dude calling to F4, I said we're still good as we had Ele Transfer free and enough res to recover. He didn't care and F4'd, and 2 others followed him (I didn't realize this at the time, I thought it was just him). We ended up holding Ele and ninja'd Repair back, but unfortunately due to the game being 4v7 we didn't have enough manpower to hold the hives.
So in the space of about 8-10 minutes while these guys were sitting in the Ready Room, we put up another 2 Hives with 3 players down and managed to hold out for a while. I'd imagine the game would have ended a little differently had the team held up as 7v7...
f4'ing is not the solution, having aliens with some actual finishers would help (still stupidly easy to turtle last tech point as marines).
Either that or for the love of god count people in ready room as still being on the team they last left, they are leaving as they believe the game is over...we dont need to try to balance team numbers when one side is f4'ing (could be left with a 1 v 3 game on a 24 player server) we need to allow the game to finish.
Seeing as people often wont play out games we should not gimp the winning side due to one side trying to concede.
I have mentioned this ready room idea since the autobalance was first brought in...still we have not had any changes to how autobalance works.
I see it cropping up every 5-6 games I play (might have something to do with me...but game design has to contribute too) where one side leaves as they are losing, not everyone leaves and some of the winning team who died in the final assault now have prolonged spawn time waits....this needs addressing.
Expect to be kicked by admins if you do it though. I guess a lot of people who play this like wasting time?
Besides, if the game really is over, I don't like robbing the other team of striking the finishing blow. It just seems anticlimactic. And although stalemates do exist, if it's taking the winning team too long to finish, chances are, there's enough wiggle room for the losing team to do something to do something to turn the tables (i.e. if they can't work out how to finish, then they are beatable).
I would like the ability added to 'concede defeat', if it were brought to a majority vote. That way if the majority want to concede, they can without the minority who don't want to concede ruining it for them. And if the majority don't want to concede, they can still keep playing without the minority who do want to concede ruining it for them. The current problem with the f4 system of conceding is that the minority ruin it for the majority.
Game was past being lost...
We lost main base and aliens had entire map
All we had was 2 ips and a armory in on our second base
I asked him why waste 15 more mins of everyones time when the game is lost for sure?
All he said is rules are rules or something to that extant
I thought recycling or GGing was the good mannered thing to do guess not...
As far as f4ing goes I rarely do it and only if someone else already has
On a side note I am not one to give up on a game
If we have even a 1% chance to win or something like 2 RTs up and the other team have the rest of the map I fight on
But once the marines are confined to ONLY their base with no tech I dont see the point of wasting peoples time
See <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125359" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=125359</a> , which coincidentally, I just posted a few days ago.
You see the difference, right?
I REALLY REALLY hate server admins who are jerks about letting a team that wants to concede concede. I'm with the server admins who will ban for recycling irregardless of the desire of the team to continue, but if the comm asks if the team wants to recycle, and no one at all objects, then I think it's the RIGHT thing for them to go through with it, rather than wasting everyone else's time.
The game can be finished so quickly under this scenario it doesn't even matter.
We're talking about people refusing to f4 prolonging the game. A lone exosuit that can be dispatched of quickly doesn't prolong the game. Or just, kill the command chair and win? Not sure how this relates to the discussion beyond the fact that: yes there does exist a condition where it's completely impossible to win, apart from if the opposing team does absolutely nothing.
1. The player is on a team with 2+ more players than the opposing team
2. 50% or more of the players team are currently trying to return to the ready room
If you still want to leave the game, there is alwlays another server.
When i comm on pubs to warm up, i find the biggest challange is trying to get jetpacks out before the aliens f4.
I remember the glory days of NS 1.02, when a single Gorge had a chance at ninja'ing up an unattended Hive (before the ping of death was implemented) after going down to zero-hives. More often than not, the element of surprise was enough to come back out swinging, and even turn it around for a win (I still remember the two instances where I was that Gorge, and hearing people screaming 'HOLY **** WE'RE SPAWNING!!!' over voicecomm and the resulting cheers).
Fast forward to NS2.
Hard-fought map, playing as Marines. We're starting to lose some ground, but still 100% viable.
Commander jumps out to build something at base. Random 'come on guys F4' bro sees this, jumps in the chair, recycles EVERYTHING. Refuses to log out and lets the Kharaa know via global chat that the base is undefended, with only 4/7 alive.
I seriously cannot say this clearly enough. If you recycle to force a round-end? <b>**** YOU</b>.
There should be like, 1 minute chance to pick team and then you're booted.
When a server allows 16 players, it should be 16 players IN PLAY. Other players should be able to join and get on a side.
It sucks so bad when you're on the winning team and you're really contributing and holding off an RT, taking them out and then the game just 'ends', making me feel like I wasted my time when I could have gone on a kill-spree
I paid for NS2 to play games, not to win games or lose games, or to sulk over in a corner about how I'm just wasting time playing if I'm not going to win. I'm not a very good player so I tend to be on a losing team a lot. If I don't even get a chance to finish out the round it's robbing me of my game experience.
I just want to shoot things and bite things. If we're losing there's just a lot more opportunity to do so.
Sometimes last stands are fun. . .
Knowing this your thread is like reading "I can't believe other people want to have fun when I'm not!"
Should people be angry when a game is won/lost due to F4 conditions?
Is there a delicate way to allow the community to accept the practice of giving up, in the interest of time?
How do you feel about games that are F4'd?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
never give up NEVER SURRENDER!
Also I have noticed more and more people F4ing. A simple (just f4 team) in text or voice goes along way in getting people to follow.
I remember the glory days of NS 1.02, when a single Gorge had a chance at ninja'ing up an unattended Hive (before the ping of death was implemented) after going down to zero-hives. More often than not, the element of surprise was enough to come back out swinging, and even turn it around for a win (I still remember the two instances where I was that Gorge, and hearing people screaming 'HOLY **** WE'RE SPAWNING!!!' over voicecomm and the resulting cheers).
Fast forward to NS2.
Hard-fought map, playing as Marines. We're starting to lose some ground, but still 100% viable.
Commander jumps out to build something at base. Random 'come on guys F4' bro sees this, jumps in the chair, recycles EVERYTHING. Refuses to log out and lets the Kharaa know via global chat that the base is undefended, with only 4/7 alive.
I seriously cannot say this clearly enough. If you recycle to force a round-end? <b>**** YOU</b>.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That would happen in NS1 too. Although I guess it would be more common in the later stages of the game's lifespan. They're some really cynical players out there these days... They're not all terrible people, but from time to time something like this really does leave a really sour taste in your mouth.
I really can't blame any server admin for banning someone for refusing to be diplomatic about conceding the game. I feel it can sometimes go the other way too however. After a particularly frustrating series of events there are times when the team really just wants to start fresh, and one or two guys really making a stink about their lost honor can come off as really [water based tool for cleaning of private parts]y.