Why is EMP so terrible?

MaximumSquidMaximumSquid Join Date: 2010-07-20 Member: 72593Members
Robotics + MAC + EMP + Cast EMP = 38 res

EMP is on a global cooldown so you are essentially <u>upgrading it for a single MAC</u>

The blast is a small radius around the MAC so lets say it was actually threatening the aliens can very easily avoid it
This would almost require the speed upgrade so now we are at 53 res for what exactly?

Removing 33%-40% of an aliens energy. . . why bother?

The wiki claims it does 50 damage, but I'm not seeing it
This low damage might only be against structures and would only be effective against cysts that were literally just dropped

Or maybe I read the wiki wrong. . . does it deal 50 damage to the MAC?

Comments

  • Snypr18Snypr18 Join Date: 2012-11-09 Member: 168566Members
    Yeah, it seems to me the flamethrower does the same thing but better. EMP feels kind of gimmicky.
  • TechercizerTechercizer 7th Player Join Date: 2011-06-11 Member: 103832Members
    Gotta emp them onos mang
  • RiCexEaTeRRiCexEaTeR Join Date: 2010-05-10 Member: 71700Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    i agree. Its a gimmick in response to "well drifters have enzyme so macs have... hey the mac needs something!"
  • TimMcTimMc Join Date: 2012-02-06 Member: 143945Members
    Making it ranged would be useful, like enzyme.
  • HeatSurgeHeatSurge Some Guy Join Date: 2012-09-15 Member: 159438Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    edited November 2012
    It does 50 damage to the energy. Since aliens have 100 energy when full, it'll deplete 50% of the alien's energy pool if completely full, or all of it if it's 50% full (assuming no adrenaline).

    IMO it should do 100 damage to the energy pool, completely draining aliens without adrenaline. It might also be good to make it enzyme-like in range, or maybe increase the radius. It's pretty hard to use effectively as it is.
  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=2037448:date=Nov 29 2012, 01:20 PM:name=HeatSurge)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (HeatSurge @ Nov 29 2012, 01:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2037448"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->IMO it should do 100 damage to the energy pool, completely draining aliens without adrenaline. It might also be good to make it enzyme-like in range, or maybe increase the radius. It's pretty hard to use effectively as it is.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    That's about the only way I'd see it being useful as currently devised. The problem is that if you buff it, it'll just be used by marines to turtle.
  • _Necro__Necro_ Join Date: 2011-02-15 Member: 81895Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Than let it deactivate friendly buildings in the blast radius for 10seconds. But it needs a buff.
  • elodeaelodea Editlodea Join Date: 2009-06-20 Member: 67877Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited November 2012
    One simple buff would be to take it off global cooldown or whatever it is. If i select 5 macs, i should have 5 uses of emp with 5 clicks.
  • GorgenapperGorgenapper Join Date: 2012-09-05 Member: 157916Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Changes I'd like to see:

    - enzyme range, or at least a wider EMP radius
    - remove global cooldown, introduce a personal cooldown per MAC of 5 seconds where the MAC temporarily shuts down and is inactive
    - reduce cost to research (5 res) or have it included out of the robo factory

    This will undoubtedly increase the effectiveness of marine turtles for commanders who know how to use MACs, but bile bomb already owns them pretty hard.
  • TimMcTimMc Join Date: 2012-02-06 Member: 143945Members
    <!--quoteo(post=2037469:date=Nov 29 2012, 04:39 PM:name=Gorgenapper)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gorgenapper @ Nov 29 2012, 04:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2037469"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Changes I'd like to see:

    - enzyme range, or at least a wider EMP radius
    - remove global cooldown, introduce a personal cooldown per MAC of 5 seconds where the MAC temporarily shuts down and is inactive
    - reduce cost to research (5 res) or have it included out of the robo factory

    This will undoubtedly increase the effectiveness of marine turtles for commanders who know how to use MACs, but bile bomb already owns them pretty hard.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I'm not happy about non-global cooldown. Its not like enzyme where no stacking. You will just get people nuking fades using a few MACs.

    Everything else though, sure.
  • reasareasa Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 8010Members, Constellation
    I actually just used this as a commander last night for the first time, and it was horribly unhelpful.

    Ether buff what it does or take it out so coms aren't tempted to waste res on it.
  • MaximumSquidMaximumSquid Join Date: 2010-07-20 Member: 72593Members
    edited November 2012
    <u><b>Techercizer:</b></u>

    There's probably something wrong if one of the first researchable techs in the game is only useful against endgame units

    Also I've used EMP on Onos before and they just keep on attacking. . . it's seriously just a huge waste of res

    ---

    <u><b>HeatSurge:</b></u>

    I was originally thinking that 100 E-Drain would be too punishing, but with Adrenaline available to aliens as the obvious counter I think it would make a lot more sense

    There would also be a reason to see Adrenaline Onos lategame if marines were holding on for dear life using EMP

    ---

    <u><b>ScardyBob:</b></u>

    The cost to use EMP would prevent turtling or you could have the MAC sacrifice themselves to use EMP at no cost

    Makes more sense anyway since it's a machine. . . also this way you wouldn't need to have it be a researchable because it' a sacrifice move

    ---

    <u><b>TimMc:</b></u>

    Having EMP be a sacrifice move would solve everything and would let UWE greatly up the power, range, and remove the global cooldown

    -
  • flyjumflyjum Join Date: 2012-01-07 Member: 139849Members
    A combination of what heatsurge and scardybob said would make the most sense.
    This might help combat powernode rushes and at the same time make adrenaline potentially useful for onos
    It could also maybe be used to help save Exos from a full team rush if you have macs following them in enemy territory

    53 res for the current EMP is insane
  • TimMcTimMc Join Date: 2012-02-06 Member: 143945Members
    <!--quoteo(post=2037488:date=Nov 29 2012, 05:11 PM:name=MaximumSquid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MaximumSquid @ Nov 29 2012, 05:11 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2037488"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Having EMP be a sacrifice move would solve everything and would let UWE greatly up the power, range, and remove the global cooldown

    -<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    MACs are cheap, so if this extremely powerful ability was free but caused MAC suicide then would be interesting. Sacrifice welding to nuke a gorges energy? Might save an exo you are trailing.
  • ZekZek Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 7962Members, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    I think making EMP powerful enough to justify sacrificing the MAC would make it too frustrating for the aliens that get hit by it.
  • DavilDavil Florida, USA Join Date: 2012-08-14 Member: 155602Members, Constellation
    I'd like to see MACS take the place of the old mobile batteries. The batteries were kind of OP since they took away from the importance of the power node, but allowing macs to have a similar ability that temporarily powered things would open up a lot of new strategies and make them much more attractive. Say you lose power at your main and you have a MAC, well you can bring the ip's back up for a few seconds. Or maybe you want to do an actual ninja phase on a hive (the power building is pretty obvious usually), you could just move in a mac have it build a phase gate and temporarily power it without the aliens really knowing. Would be pretty sweet IMO.
  • HeatSurgeHeatSurge Some Guy Join Date: 2012-09-15 Member: 159438Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    edited November 2012
    <!--quoteo(post=2037452:date=Nov 29 2012, 02:26 PM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Nov 29 2012, 02:26 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2037452"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That's about the only way I'd see it being useful as currently devised. The problem is that if you buff it, it'll just be used by marines to turtle.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    ... and isn't that what all marine tech is used for. Get 75% of the team to go exos, the rest shotty jetpackers, and a few arcs around your base, have them arrange in a circle around the chair, and congrats, you have a troll game...

    Why not add macs to the already ridiculous tech? :-P
  • m0rdm0rd Join Date: 2012-11-26 Member: 173223Members
    What I don't understand is why would the TSF use an EMP on organic lifeforms?

    The ability really doesn't make sense in any form and needs to be revised or removed. Maybe give them mini turret upgrades or something Passive.
  • HazeHaze O RLY? Join Date: 2003-07-07 Member: 18018Members, Constellation
    EMP should just be scrapped it's obviously terrible.

    Once you build 10 MACs you should be able to combine them megazord style into MEGAMAC. It's an exosuit that is governed by a rudimentary AI but the comm can also assume control of it whenever he wants.
  • Omar - The WireOmar - The Wire Join Date: 2012-11-01 Member: 165320Members
    <!--quoteo(post=2037688:date=Nov 29 2012, 08:50 PM:name=Haze)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Haze @ Nov 29 2012, 08:50 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2037688"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->EMP should just be scrapped it's obviously terrible.

    Once you build 10 MACs you should be able to combine them megazord style into MEGAMAC. It's an exosuit that is governed by a rudimentary AI but the comm can also assume control of it whenever he wants.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    And shoots plasma beams that instantly kill Onos, while operating automated repair arms that self heal. Duh.
  • HazeHaze O RLY? Join Date: 2003-07-07 Member: 18018Members, Constellation
    No it just shoots more MACs.
  • JediPhreaKJediPhreaK Join Date: 2012-11-05 Member: 167028Members
    edited November 2012
    I like the idea of a mobile / temporary battery. Maybe have it turn itself into a short term power source on a GCD for all MACs so it can power a few devices within a radius like the sentry battery.

    Invisible while stationary might also be nice too.
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