Detecting Cheating
Pooptronix
Join Date: 2012-08-02 Member: 154590Members
Join Date: 2012-08-02 Member: 154590Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Aside from cheat protection, how can we detect cheating?</div>I think most importantly since there are so many good players from NS1, we need to be able to detect basic (and subtle) cheats.
This being the 'most mod-albe game', it's also the most hackable. Currently aimbots are hard to detect since we don't have a first person spec-mode built in. When will this be released?
I don't like accusing people of cheating, because I know there is a slim chance they might be that good (if it isn't obvious they're cheating).
Aside from cheat detection, it may be worth allowing people to see differences in others' net/frame performance. If someone has an insane rig that magically has really awesome frames and may simply be next door to the server their on, we can't be mad at them, just envious. :)
With as much complaints about hitboxes and performance being poor, it really bothers me to see someone with an insane kill/death ratio... And when things like an entire room of marines go down to 3 skulks and the person in question is the last skulk alive, it makes me wonder. As well as following a skulk around a map when both of you have leap and celerity and I can't keep up with them... Again, is it my computer/game performance versus theirs? Or is there something else going on... I WANT TO KNOW.
Another thread:
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=121156" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=121156</a>
This being the 'most mod-albe game', it's also the most hackable. Currently aimbots are hard to detect since we don't have a first person spec-mode built in. When will this be released?
I don't like accusing people of cheating, because I know there is a slim chance they might be that good (if it isn't obvious they're cheating).
Aside from cheat detection, it may be worth allowing people to see differences in others' net/frame performance. If someone has an insane rig that magically has really awesome frames and may simply be next door to the server their on, we can't be mad at them, just envious. :)
With as much complaints about hitboxes and performance being poor, it really bothers me to see someone with an insane kill/death ratio... And when things like an entire room of marines go down to 3 skulks and the person in question is the last skulk alive, it makes me wonder. As well as following a skulk around a map when both of you have leap and celerity and I can't keep up with them... Again, is it my computer/game performance versus theirs? Or is there something else going on... I WANT TO KNOW.
Another thread:
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=121156" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=121156</a>
Comments
I tried doing a client side only hack for first person spectating, but unfortunately wasn't able to fix it after it broke with the latest patch. Once the consistency checks are in, it will be completely useless anyway.
I would personally argue that detecting cheats is impossible unless they are extremely obvious and <b>meant</b> to attract attention (e.g. the good old CS 1.6 speedhacks with constant 360° turns more than 1 time per second) or just poorly written. The only thing that can separate cheaters from good players is that the cheaters are actually not good at the game (e.g. strategy, positioning, communication, ...), however this is hard to evaluate. I have seen what the human mind and body can do and it's simply not distinguishable from properly designed cheats.
Edit:
@Techercizer: I don't see how allowing <b>any </b>lua modifications could be done without also allowing blatant cheating. There is pretty much no place in the code base that doesn't have access to information the client can use to cheat.
You know if some player go faster then XX or kill some enemy in distance of XX with weapon XX.
Is that not possible? I mean take a look at alien swarm game code, you see a lot of achivements working like that what i mean.
So right now... You can't be sure if someone is cheating, but can an admin kick them?
I actually know real non-cheating NS1 players that used to get kicked from pubs. I've seen them play first hand and they're no joke, but there is a limit to what the human/game can accomplish before it's stretching the limits. 25/0 as an alien, I've seen (fade masters vs pub noobs). 48/0... that's a stretch... 25/0 as a marine? NFW.
I've done that as marine and I have seen FAR better players than me do that. The difference is how they are engaged. If they are 25/0 and consistently taking on 3-4 skulks at once and killing them all then I'm suspicious. If they are just having skulks trickling in then it is highly reasonable. The best anti-cheat as has already been said is good server admins and hopefully an upcoming 1st person spectator system.
(I go 1/0 and then leave to play warsow instead)
=P
I'd like to see lerk/fade aimbot, that'd be interesting thing to watch. As far as I understand writing marine one would be trivial. You have positions of enemies, of you, after adjusting for mouse sensitivity you know where exactly to look and when to press LMB and you send it to the game.
You can also make more subtle aimbot - one that activates only when your crosshair is close to enemy.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just run a Lua consistency check against the client's code when he joins.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What is that supposed to mean? Checksum? Cheater can send checksum of the valid code. I've seen cheater detection system (different than VAC/PB) where game asked client questions related to their game state. Amount of state tracking required to do it when your game is modified would be astronomical.
I think it was written in form of a research paper about Warcraft 3 cheat protection. They didn't even use WC3 source code. I don't remember if I've seen it on gamedev/gamasutra/GDC or some blog.
Do not want this turning into Day Z (I know I know easy scripting etc with Day Z Engine allows cheating).
.lua consistency checks (=client needs exactly the same .luas as the server) and VAC are the most important anti-cheat we need.
Oh and techerzicer, the opacity of alien vision gives the player an advantage. I don't see why this should be allowed. I really wish this would be finally official in the game, but right now it is like cheating.
But who decides who's "good and unbiased enough" to review demos?
I'm also fairly sure there are some players out there with outrageous aiming skills but almost braindead playing styles compared to it.
Everything else is just a step to catch the stupid cheaters.
I'm talking a game full of amateur to veteran level players.
So to reiterate the obvious:
1) Checksum/parity checks on deployed code (they're working on).
2) Need to have 1st person spec mode.
3) Admins need to kick.
Anything else?
I still think being able to look up their stats including fps, net rate, kills/shot, kills/bite, ... all of it basically can reveal warning signs.
At least for competetive games some kind of ingame recording is pretty useful. Right now you pretty much have to hope someone saw the disputed situation and was streaming or recording via 3rd party program, otherwise there's no way of going back and checking it afterwards. Having a HLTV replacement would be amazing of course.
I guess the same goes for public games too. You don't need an admin on the server each and every second if anyone can record the disputed play and hand it over for admin inspection.
third party programs never work.