Odd Changes.
DDRKhat
Join Date: 2007-11-06 Member: 62841Members
Join Date: 2007-11-06 Member: 62841Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Ones I don't particularly agree with.</div><b>This can probably seen as a "QQ" or rant thread. I am merely voicing my opinions over these changes and would like to know others views without the simple "get used to it, ###### will do nothing"</b>.
<b>Alien Commander</b> -- This change has brought about 2 (in my opinion) large game-play changes.
The Gorge is almost useless, the life-form is no longer the team's builder (except for the "Offensive Chamber" (Hydra?)), which feels dramatically different because NS1 had 2 distinctive game-play styles.
Marines had a commander and relied on him to do anything, the aliens did <i>not</i> they merely relied on a gorge, this painted a very good differentiation between the two teams which fit the theme of the game. The aliens were a hive-mind and worked as one unit, the Marines were not but worked as a team.
<b>Marine "Tech Points"?</b> -- A rather annoying (but also understandable) game-play change.
NS1 allowed the Marines to get all of their research done from any base anywhere they wanted in the map. They merely required the resources and the prior tech, example; You needed an "Arms Lab" and "Weapons Lv2" to get "Weapons Lv3". You didn't need to have certain parts of the map captured to allow this (except arguably, resource nodes).
<b>Marine "Command Station Bays"</b> -- This change is tied to the first two points and the next point.
This feels like a HUGE step-back in what the original game allowed. In NS1 you were allowed to deploy a command station <i>almost anywhere</i> this allowed a huge depth of re-playability because it allowed the marines to constantly try new strategies and new locations to set-up, defend and attack from. My <b>speculation</b> is that the alien players felt upset they could not build their hives anywhere and subsequently brought this change around.
<b>Multiple Command Stations Needed</b> -- This is a huge peeve of mine (But I also get the reason for the change).
NS1 allowed the marines to get ALL of their research without the need for having MULTIPLE bases set-up, If they played well the marines could have their base supremely defended in one corner of a map getting all the tech they could need to try and fight off the aliens. This feels like such a weird change that they now have to establish multiple command stations to allow higher tier tech.
Ultimately it feels as if these changes were made to make the two teams more identical which <b>in my opinion</b> feels completely different from the original game. The two teams felt great with their distinctive play-styles between them and it added a lot more depth to game choices right from the start, I feel kind of let-down that these changes have happened and stayed in the game.
I don't know if I am the only one that feels this way but with the way the game has changed it basically feels like "Marines vs Marines" from the original game, which whilst cool quickly lost it's glamour simply because the two teams played too identically.
I realize this is way too late into the development process to make any changes but I wanted to voice my opinions and see if others had similar views.
<b>Alien Commander</b> -- This change has brought about 2 (in my opinion) large game-play changes.
The Gorge is almost useless, the life-form is no longer the team's builder (except for the "Offensive Chamber" (Hydra?)), which feels dramatically different because NS1 had 2 distinctive game-play styles.
Marines had a commander and relied on him to do anything, the aliens did <i>not</i> they merely relied on a gorge, this painted a very good differentiation between the two teams which fit the theme of the game. The aliens were a hive-mind and worked as one unit, the Marines were not but worked as a team.
<b>Marine "Tech Points"?</b> -- A rather annoying (but also understandable) game-play change.
NS1 allowed the Marines to get all of their research done from any base anywhere they wanted in the map. They merely required the resources and the prior tech, example; You needed an "Arms Lab" and "Weapons Lv2" to get "Weapons Lv3". You didn't need to have certain parts of the map captured to allow this (except arguably, resource nodes).
<b>Marine "Command Station Bays"</b> -- This change is tied to the first two points and the next point.
This feels like a HUGE step-back in what the original game allowed. In NS1 you were allowed to deploy a command station <i>almost anywhere</i> this allowed a huge depth of re-playability because it allowed the marines to constantly try new strategies and new locations to set-up, defend and attack from. My <b>speculation</b> is that the alien players felt upset they could not build their hives anywhere and subsequently brought this change around.
<b>Multiple Command Stations Needed</b> -- This is a huge peeve of mine (But I also get the reason for the change).
NS1 allowed the marines to get ALL of their research without the need for having MULTIPLE bases set-up, If they played well the marines could have their base supremely defended in one corner of a map getting all the tech they could need to try and fight off the aliens. This feels like such a weird change that they now have to establish multiple command stations to allow higher tier tech.
Ultimately it feels as if these changes were made to make the two teams more identical which <b>in my opinion</b> feels completely different from the original game. The two teams felt great with their distinctive play-styles between them and it added a lot more depth to game choices right from the start, I feel kind of let-down that these changes have happened and stayed in the game.
I don't know if I am the only one that feels this way but with the way the game has changed it basically feels like "Marines vs Marines" from the original game, which whilst cool quickly lost it's glamour simply because the two teams played too identically.
I realize this is way too late into the development process to make any changes but I wanted to voice my opinions and see if others had similar views.
Comments
lol.
You aren't making much of an argument besides "I don't like it because its different". The new requirement for multiple command stations has several reasons:
1) Marines have far far less turtle, so command stations give chance to come back from a loss.
2) Forces aggressive play and thus quicker games. This was an objective of NS2 to make it more attractive to everyone. Less hour long games.
Also while gorge isn't as spectacularly important as NS1, its current state if because aliens need a commander to use the identical res system marines had. Problem with NS1 was that teams became imbalanced based on player count. I do wish the gorge had more things to build though.
That being said, the devs have really worked hard on these changes, and continue to make their point. Gorge players have found an important role for that class, and marine gameplay has evolved to take their new tech/placement requirements into account. (I'm all for forcing marine expansions for tech, though)
Keep playing NS2, and you'll realize over time that it does not have to be exactly like NS1 to be a great game.
You aren't making much of an argument besides "I don't like it because its different". The new requirement for multiple command stations has several reasons:
1) Marines have far far less turtle, so command stations give chance to come back from a loss.
2) Forces aggressive play and thus quicker games. This was an objective of NS2 to make it more attractive to everyone. Less hour long games.
Also while gorge isn't as spectacularly important as NS1, its current state if because aliens need a commander to use the identical res system marines had. Problem with NS1 was that teams became imbalanced based on player count. I do wish the gorge had more things to build though.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I don't like your assumption that I'm ###### just because it's different. I fully accept change for a lot of things. These are just small ones I don't like. Another one I don't like but as of late have grown to tolerate is the flame thrower, it feels cheaply over-powered. If you hadn't had that "QQ" bit which I asked people not to do, I would've enjoyed this response.<!--quoteo(post=1978196:date=Sep 15 2012, 04:05 PM:name=Deadzone)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Deadzone @ Sep 15 2012, 04:05 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1978196"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I had similar feelings about a lot of these things when NS2 was in its early stages. I still think if I could make one change, it would be to restore gorge to its proper glory.
That being said, the devs have really worked hard on these changes, and continue to make their point. Gorge players have found an important role for that class, and marine gameplay has evolved to take their new tech/placement requirements into account. (I'm all for forcing marine expansions for tech, though)
Keep playing NS2, and you'll realize over time that it does not have to be exactly like NS1 to be a great game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I never said they had to be exactly alike, if you do read my initial post. I'm also not saying gorgep layers have no role it's just they are near-worthless. I'm not saying that Flayra and the devs did not put A LOT of work into the game (it's their code-child, of course they did), I'm just saying these particular decisions are ones I'm still uncomfortable with (but I don't doubt over-time will accept)<!--quoteo(post=1978204:date=Sep 15 2012, 04:27 PM:name=Runteh)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Runteh @ Sep 15 2012, 04:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1978204"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Too late buddy. Should have posted 5 years ago!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Useless post.
<!--quoteo(post=1978273:date=Sep 15 2012, 12:39 PM:name=DDRKhat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DDRKhat @ Sep 15 2012, 12:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1978273"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--sizeo:3--><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->flame thrower, it feels cheaply over-powered.<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1978273:date=Sep 15 2012, 12:39 PM:name=DDRKhat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DDRKhat @ Sep 15 2012, 12:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1978273"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--sizeo:4--><span style="font-size:14pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->flame thrower
<i>over-powered. </i><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're going to have to explain this one to me.
Use it for what it's for and you might find it incredibly useful.
It kills cysts quickly. That's it. Cysts are like the only flammable structure and so it's the only thing it does bonus damage against.
For everything else, axing it is much faster.
For everything else, axing it is much faster.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lol. Okay.
Can an axe hit 4-5 structures simultaneously too?
its not to late, many vets posted much of the same years ago. All went ignored, among many many other discussions we had. (ask charlie he was there)
I do agree with much OP has stated. The gorge became useless compared to his former glory, while gameplay itself feels very limited/restricted compared to the freedom marines or aliens had in ns1.
Can an axe hit 4-5 structures simultaneously too?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, but it also doesn't cost 30 pres, give you the slowest move speed of all Marine weapons, and take up the primary weapon slot. Which is pretty much the self-defense slot. It also does horrible damage verses lifeforms and non-flammable structures, which again, is basically everything but the cysts.
And for anti-structure, the Grenade Launcher is better than it, cheaper, AND it's amazing at killing lifeforms on top of that.
That's a whole 'nother issues that needs to be fixed.
Thankfully grenade launchers seem to have taken a back seat in most games lately thanks to exosuits.
Thankfully grenade launchers seem to have taken a back seat in most games lately thanks to exosuits.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Even if the Grenade Launcher is made weak against lifeforms (Which would be the logical choice, considering that it's supposed to be an anti-structure siege weapon), it would still be better than the Flamethrower at killing structures. If not only because it's long range as opposed to short range, so you can use it from relative safety instead of having to get up close and personal with the Aliens while using a weapon that can't kill anything bigger than a cyst.