<!--quoteo(post=1955632:date=Aug 1 2012, 02:13 PM:name=GORGEous)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GORGEous @ Aug 1 2012, 02:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955632"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I hear that the commander is always in base.
Perhaps he should get out of the chair for five seconds and defend it?
There are simple answers to a lot of these "problems." We shouldn't be fixing things that aren't broken.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The commander leaving the chair is always very risky because you don't know how many are going to attack so you obviously can't beacon your team back when you leave the comm chair. You also can't support your team anymore with med-/ammopacks and can't drop them buildings.
<!--quoteo(post=1955645:date=Aug 1 2012, 12:48 PM:name=Deity)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Deity @ Aug 1 2012, 12:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955645"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah Comm leaving the char is always a risk; I don't know if I'd advocate that in a pub setting where coordination and communication are pretty low.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Back in my LAN days, one commander would always jump out. And slaughter himself 2-3 Skulks. We even had an in-joke about telling him to get back in the chair.
It should be easily defendable if you got enough Observatories spreaded around the map.
As soon you got enough vision and map awareness, and of course a good commander that recognizes all enemy movement inside his territory, you should be fine and hopefully pretty soon warned.
IMO those attacking Gorges deserve to kill something, because they obivously managed to get to your base. Most of the time they're leaving their team and hives behind trying to get a (few) important kill(s). So they and their team are very vulnerable for this time. You should probably make use of it and force them to retreat by keeping constant pressure on the aliens.
<!--quoteo(post=1955700:date=Aug 1 2012, 03:35 PM:name=cH40z-Lord)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cH40z-Lord @ Aug 1 2012, 03:35 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955700"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->IMO those attacking Gorges deserve to kill something, because they obivously managed to get to your base. Most of the time they're leaving their team and hives behind trying to get a (few) important kill(s). So they and their team are very vulnerable for this time. You should probably make use of it and force them to retreat by keeping constant pressure on the aliens.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not completely true IMO. They should necessitate a RESPONSE, but don't deserve to destroy structures. Unless you're a moron and let them.
It's like a lone SKulk muinching in the base. If you're a moron he gets free buildings. But it still requires a response that drains attention/manpower/resources from elsewhere, and is therefore worth it when done right. An Onos or Fade are the same, except they likely will escape.
I will say that Alien static base defense is significantly better than base defense for Marines, so maybe that aspect needs more focus than how powerful BB is. Excepting maybe one game, the only times I've seen a BB rush that powerful and indefensible was when the Aliens already controlled more than half the map. I don't see how scouting more effectively can hurt -- but in the event that a beacon or other form of rapid response isn't on the table, Marines do need a bit of a better way to defend their base that's comparable to the deterrent effect of whips and hydras. But that's really the issue, not so much BB.
EDIT: To put it another way, Marines do get significantly slowed trying to rush an alien hive, by static defense. Aliens can run right in and start hitting the CC. Whether it's BB or a group of skulks doesn't matter so much. That's my take on it anyway.
Gorges die in one lmg clip???? BAHAHAHAHA The hell game are you guys playing???? They take huge efforts to kill. I love it. Either dieing to or not being able to be killed is so fun as gorge.
OK though this thread was badly, BADLY, explained, I do agree with him. Why? Because ive done exactly what he said. Many times. It really isnt hard to wait for marine's to leave the base and start rambo-ing their base. Simply wait for a skulk team mate to start munching the next res node over. 2 Marines should go running by shortly. As for just killing the gorge, it is actually hard when hes running in circles around your structures out of your line of sight. You can do huge damage, and yeah sure you usually don't kill their base on the first run, but as he stated you rinse and repeat.
I actually do this most games now. Go gorge at start, block off a tunnel near their base to gain map control, wait for bilebomb, start ramboing their base. OR hit and run sliding on my fat arse back to my wall now set up right outside their base. It's really, really FUN! And actually quite hard to stop. The point I think he was trying to make was just like back in what ever patch commander's having to be forced to beacon all the time to stop rambo gorges.
But as most people have said, the way to stop it is commander awareness and directing his team to the problem spot. Obs and guns is the solution. Im more interested in this post by people just flaming the new guy for being bad and asking a question.
AurOn2COOKIES! FREEDOM, AND BISCUITS!AustraliaJoin Date: 2012-01-13Member: 140224Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Forum staff
Theres only one tactic to defending vs bile Kill the gorge Though that can be quite hard. contrary to the belief of these 'uber gamars' As god said, Gorges don't die in an lmg clip, unless dimwitted, slow to respond, or don't know how to dodge and heal at the same time. Heal is far too effective to the self, marines can't heal themselves, why should the gorgie? Or at least limit his self healing abilities so marines have a chance vs rambo gorges biling their bases. i've destroyed whole bases by myself and my pet bile versus almost whole teams of marines (5-6) just by dodging around buildings and keeping my hp in good regions, That said, the base was poorly designed and let me do said thing. instead of buildings hugging walls, they were in pretty good proximity and relatively spaced enough for me to strafe them but. seriously. even so. up gorge evolve price to at least 15, and/or reduce self healing. gorges should be support, not even remotely ramboable.
I can't see how a gorge can repeatedly attack from the same path. Why are there not two marines that move exactly this path and kill incoming gorges / skulks? How can he come this near to your base without getting stopped by marines? In most maps there are only 3 paths to a room. When all your marines only moving through one path away from your base, you don't need to wonder that your other front line is open for gorges.
The real problem as Narkorson said, is when you got 2 or more gorges entrenched near to your base. They can hold of a whole marine team, when half of them are shooting the hydras. Also 6 or 9 hydras can kill you really fast. The com needs to go early GL in this cases.
But back to topic. If a slow gorge can make its way to your base (evolving near base is dangerous to the same degree.) than you need to order troops to this front line. You can't expect that nobody is coming in, when you let your gates open.
<!--quoteo(post=1955608:date=Aug 1 2012, 05:51 PM:name=spellman23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (spellman23 @ Aug 1 2012, 05:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955608"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Major difference. Since BB is now DoT, you can spread your BB shots at 1/sec around the base and still do the full amount of damage. Unlike in NS1 where you focused down a region. So, yeah, it's significantly buffed over NS1.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The damage over time should probably be removed, it was introduced for the lerk bilebomb, but makes much less sense on the gorge. The gorge should require some assistance (like a fade covering) to do an effective bilebomb attack.
<!--quoteo(post=1955832:date=Aug 2 2012, 12:15 AM:name=Yuuki)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yuuki @ Aug 2 2012, 12:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955832"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->it was introduced for the lerk bilebomb, but makes much less sense on the gorge.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like that the gorge is the multi-skilled Alien. Look at his teeth, he's the most passive looking alien out of them all, as if his evolution is for more brains to handle those complex skills because he's NOT meant to be mindlessly biting anything. It does make sense to me, but I'm gonna read the wiki on the gorge so I know I'm talking about if I'm wrong hehehehe :)
Comments
Perhaps he should get out of the chair for five seconds and defend it?
There are simple answers to a lot of these "problems." We shouldn't be fixing things that aren't broken.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The commander leaving the chair is always very risky because you don't know how many are going to attack so you obviously can't beacon your team back when you leave the comm chair. You also can't support your team anymore with med-/ammopacks and can't drop them buildings.
The best replies I've seen so far have been to stop being bad and to scout your base and the paths approaching it.
"commando! drop umbrellors!"</div>
Back in my LAN days, one commander would always jump out. And slaughter himself 2-3 Skulks. We even had an in-joke about telling him to get back in the chair.
As soon you got enough vision and map awareness, and of course a good commander that recognizes all enemy movement inside his territory, you should be fine and hopefully pretty soon warned.
IMO those attacking Gorges deserve to kill something, because they obivously managed to get to your base. Most of the time they're leaving their team and hives behind trying to get a (few) important kill(s). So they and their team are very vulnerable for this time. You should probably make use of it and force them to retreat by keeping constant pressure on the aliens.
Not completely true IMO. They should necessitate a RESPONSE, but don't deserve to destroy structures. Unless you're a moron and let them.
It's like a lone SKulk muinching in the base. If you're a moron he gets free buildings. But it still requires a response that drains attention/manpower/resources from elsewhere, and is therefore worth it when done right. An Onos or Fade are the same, except they likely will escape.
EDIT: To put it another way, Marines do get significantly slowed trying to rush an alien hive, by static defense. Aliens can run right in and start hitting the CC. Whether it's BB or a group of skulks doesn't matter so much. That's my take on it anyway.
OK though this thread was badly, BADLY, explained, I do agree with him. Why? Because ive done exactly what he said. Many times. It really isnt hard to wait for marine's to leave the base and start rambo-ing their base. Simply wait for a skulk team mate to start munching the next res node over. 2 Marines should go running by shortly. As for just killing the gorge, it is actually hard when hes running in circles around your structures out of your line of sight. You can do huge damage, and yeah sure you usually don't kill their base on the first run, but as he stated you rinse and repeat.
I actually do this most games now. Go gorge at start, block off a tunnel near their base to gain map control, wait for bilebomb, start ramboing their base. OR hit and run sliding on my fat arse back to my wall now set up right outside their base. It's really, really FUN! And actually quite hard to stop. The point I think he was trying to make was just like back in what ever patch commander's having to be forced to beacon all the time to stop rambo gorges.
But as most people have said, the way to stop it is commander awareness and directing his team to the problem spot. Obs and guns is the solution. Im more interested in this post by people just flaming the new guy for being bad and asking a question.
Kill the gorge
Though that can be quite hard. contrary to the belief of these 'uber gamars' As god said, Gorges don't die in an lmg clip, unless dimwitted, slow to respond, or don't know how to dodge and heal at the same time. Heal is far too effective to the self, marines can't heal themselves, why should the gorgie? Or at least limit his self healing abilities so marines have a chance vs rambo gorges biling their bases. i've destroyed whole bases by myself and my pet bile versus almost whole teams of marines (5-6) just by dodging around buildings and keeping my hp in good regions, That said, the base was poorly designed and let me do said thing. instead of buildings hugging walls, they were in pretty good proximity and relatively spaced enough for me to strafe them but. seriously. even so. up gorge evolve price to at least 15, and/or reduce self healing. gorges should be support, not even remotely ramboable.
The real problem as Narkorson said, is when you got 2 or more gorges entrenched near to your base. They can hold of a whole marine team, when half of them are shooting the hydras. Also 6 or 9 hydras can kill you really fast. The com needs to go early GL in this cases.
But back to topic. If a slow gorge can make its way to your base (evolving near base is dangerous to the same degree.) than you need to order troops to this front line. You can't expect that nobody is coming in, when you let your gates open.
The damage over time should probably be removed, it was introduced for the lerk bilebomb, but makes much less sense on the gorge. The gorge should require some assistance (like a fade covering) to do an effective bilebomb attack.
I like that the gorge is the multi-skilled Alien. Look at his teeth, he's the most passive looking alien out of them all, as if his evolution is for more brains to handle those complex skills because he's NOT meant to be mindlessly biting anything. It does make sense to me, but I'm gonna read the wiki on the gorge so I know I'm talking about if I'm wrong hehehehe :)