Resource Production on the unconnected Cyst
Classic319
Join Date: 2010-11-06 Member: 74789Members
Join Date: 2010-11-06 Member: 74789Members
<div class="IPBDescription">idea from Company Of Heroes,</div>If you've ever played Company Of Heroes, then you would definately know that you will gain no resources, if the territories are not connected eventually to headquarters. That's the key strategic point of that game.
So why not NS2? Natural Selection 2 is even more territory-based game than COH. Therefore it would be really nice, if aliens get nothing/no resources at all from the harvester, which is not on the cyst, or whose cyst isn't connected. This will give marines more reason to cleverly cut the cyst chain, and super strategic gameplay even more than the best RTS game of all time, Company of Heroes.
p.s. please let cysts cost tres again! cyst by energy is just a joke. why again let them abuse and spam cysts?
So why not NS2? Natural Selection 2 is even more territory-based game than COH. Therefore it would be really nice, if aliens get nothing/no resources at all from the harvester, which is not on the cyst, or whose cyst isn't connected. This will give marines more reason to cleverly cut the cyst chain, and super strategic gameplay even more than the best RTS game of all time, Company of Heroes.
p.s. please let cysts cost tres again! cyst by energy is just a joke. why again let them abuse and spam cysts?
Comments
actually, i'd prefer some more downsides for unconnected buildings e.g. they could stop maturing while unconnected. or something more drastic.
The reason this works in COH is potentially because there it relates to area which you maintain force in, but which is not connected. In NS2, simply because you have a harvester somewhere does not mean you maintain force there. Also, due to the linear fashion of most of the maps in NS2, if the alien team does maintain a force in an area, it is notoriously difficult to get behind that area, meaning you could only ever hope to disconnect 1, and at most 2 locations.
In my opinion, this mechanic would have absolutely no noticeable impact on the game.
I hope you just go and play Company of Heroes again.
News flash: NS2 and COH are similar in no meaningful way.
What you should notice is, that most of ideas of the territory-systems of Natural Selection 2 came from Company Of Heroes. I remember all the prototype of UWE team about territory-based gameplay, and it was all about Company of Heroes.
So if aliens get almost no disadvantage from losing important cyst, then why did UWE made cyst-chain-system? Just to turn those orange light off and really slowly reducing health of next cyst? Then i would say, it's waste of time and effort. They need to add something related to cyst chain.
And considering about too-fast-get-killed cyst, Then how about that manpower-territory of COH, which mostly directly connects the resource territory to the Headquater? Did it ever take 30 sec to be secured by enemy? It does also take only maybe 5 secs to be neutralized. And when neutralized, you gain nothing even though you have 90% of territory. I can't see any big difference then.
Lastly, according to this sentence, which is written by you, i don't think i should explain more. People call such guys really simply as 'noob'. Considering about super-noob cannot be premise.
actually it seems like they are similar from the comparisons he's making<i>!!!!!!</i>
Cutting cyst chains does nothing. Cyst spam.
A marine could kill a harvester in the same time he could kill 5-6 cysts. If he kills cysts, the Khamm can easily replace the cysts at a very cheap Tres cost. They also grow ridiculously fast. If the marine kills the harvester, the Khamm has to spend a lot more res, and the harvester takes longer to finish building. The khamm ALSO has to wait for the marine to move along, or the tower will die right away again.
In fact, if marines want chain cutting to be more effective, it makes more sense for the cysts to cost energy! At least that way there's a limit to how many cysts can be spammed to rebuild the chain.
Marines need to defend 1 extractor/power node to keep the resource coming. But the aliens will need to defend about 4 cysts and the harvester to maintain their resource. And with 1 hive, a cyst chain can sometimes be chained to 2 harvesters.
But perhaps maybe an unconnected harvester should gather at 50%....?
Personally, the only time I ever kill cysts is when I intend to take the entire area, otherwise there simply is no point. In such a case, you cut the deepest viable cyst and work backwards, but you kill everything. You don't leave a non functional harvester behind.
Well, obviously the answer is never because <i>right now</i> as you point out there’s no point on destroying the cyst chain. It’s a high risk maneuver with little reward; you have to control the territory for a very long time for it to have any meaningful effect that can’t be solved by just planting a couple cysts once the marines are gone or dead. With that time virtually anything else you do would be more useful.
Hence the OP (in the sense that in principle agrees with the quoted posts seeing how things are right now) wants to make it a more rewarding tactic, which I can sympathize because instinctively every n00b seems to think that breaking the cyst chain should be useful (and consequently the first thing they get yelled at is to ignore them). I agree however that even if resource generation were stopped for the duration the cyst chain is broken it would be still be better to hunt the RT and ignore the cysts, unless the changes were drastic, in the line of structures down the cyst line dying at a <i>really</i> fast rate.
That would be really nice!! Thanks for giving a example. Then lots of rooms without any techpoints or respoints, but function as junction will be more important. Then marines are gonna set their Phase Gate and Armory on Glass Hallway to prevent Cyst from Data Core hive to be spreaded to Reacter core! Imbalanxd, you are so fantastic, you are contradictionally supporting my idea a lot.
Lastly to say again, there should be NO not-important-room at any RTS game. You should remember that :) Otherwise why did UWE put those silly powernodes at all of corridors without any resnode or techpoint?
And i am not gonna be rude, but i think you are a bit drunk or less-intelligend. You´ve never killed cyst because there is no purpose right now to kill cyst, just like Mr.Rowen said. Haha funny that you said so... be conscious!!
Anyway, that´s why i wrote this topic, in order to say that UWE need some ideas to encourage marines to kill Cyst chains, who currently just walk around infestation and ignore all the cysts. And i really think the idea, to cut res-production by cutting cyst chain, just like cutting Manpower Point of COH is the most suitable one.
It is bad enough when marines start killing cysts as alien comm, I can't imagine how bad it will be playing the whole.
'You kill the cyst, and I place one just as you move on to kill another... and then we have a witty conversation via chat'...
You know what I am talking about!
You would leave reactor core undefended, simply to build in a hipster location? You think that is strategically sound? Killing a cyst takes a single marine 5 seconds to do, defending a location is a permanent thing. Think of it this way; outposts need defence, resources need defence. Solution? Build outposts on resources. This is almost always the approach taken in strategy games, simply because it is obvious and logical. That isn't to say that there aren't exceptions, because there are. For example, a central hub in a map that may provide a way to cut a cyst chain to multiple locations. However, as I stated previously, due to the linear nature of NS2 maps, this is essentially never the case, but of course, there are always exceptions. So yes, no doubt this mechanic would, in certain rare cases, have some affect on the game. Even if it is only the exception to the exception to the rule. Thought I doubt this would be worth the time implementing.
<!--quoteo(post=1938437:date=May 23 2012, 03:53 PM:name=Classic319)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Classic319 @ May 23 2012, 03:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1938437"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And i am not gonna be rude, but i think you are a bit drunk or less-intelligend. You´ve never killed cyst because there is no purpose right now to kill cyst, just like Mr.Rowen said. Haha funny that you said so... be conscious!!
Anyway, that´s why i wrote this topic, in order to say that UWE need some ideas to encourage marines to kill Cyst chains, who currently just walk around infestation and ignore all the cysts. And i really think the idea, to cut res-production by cutting cyst chain, just like cutting Manpower Point of COH is the most suitable one.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You failed to identify the point I was trying to make. I said that, If you are cutting a cyst chain, it is because you want to take possession of the territory it covers. Taking the territory involves killing any present structures, including harvesters. Why implement a mechanic that prevents unconnected harvesters from collecting resources, if unconnected harvesters are simply destroyed seconds after being disconnected.<b> Its simply a wasted mechanic</b>.
This would be the most powerful! It makes killing cysts actually mean something.
As for interrupted resflow, I think the devs wouldn't do this because it is kinda complex.
Personally I like the idea, it puts pressure on kham to be alert and distracts him from other things.
It could be a tactic to maximally deny res to aliens: 1) easily kill one cyst; chain is cut = 0 resflow, 2) proceed to kill the RT (which takes time, during which res would normally flow).
edit: Because of the above, kham could opt to secure important/sensitive locations with extra cysts - tradeoff res for security, but also risk to lose more...
Aliens have to defend not only the RTs but the pathways inbetween too!
(Could maybe become imba...)