Switch Flamethrower to attachment for LMG?
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Join Date: 2003-09-27 Member: 21247Members
Join Date: 2003-09-27 Member: 21247Members
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Flamethrower is for still really good for close combat but as attachment for Rifle it would be also strong for mod/long range too.
I don't know if that would be good for balancing :)
I'm guessing stuff like flashbangs, smoke-grenades and possibly flares but I don't think that's going to work considering the community probably don't want such crowd-control effects available to all marines (thus it's the MACs/Drifters that gets the EMP/Flare-ability).
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/images/8/8f/NS2_marine_mockup.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/images/thumb/8/8f/NS2_marine_mockup.jpg/210px-NS2_marine_mockup.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
A long time ago they did however show us a <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/images/8/8f/NS2_marine_mockup.jpg" target="_blank">mock-up of the buy-menu</a>, which showed for example flechette and armour-piercing rounds (Gorge-suit!). However I don't think that's going to be in (artist could take some liberty of just adding some cool weapon-features while making the mock-up), nor can it possibly be something you can physically put on as an attachment though.
And in all honesty, attachments in general is one of things I'm most doubtful of in NS2. Mostly because the Grenade Launcher which was a role that needed support from other players to pull through, rather became an add-on without any downsides. Although I can understand the reason since it probably saves in a lot of extra work, doing the model and the animations for new weapons will take a lot of money and effort. Just curious what they attachments they can add for that feature to really be worth it in my book.
Aliens - Defined by class.
Marines - Defined by weapon.
If everyone can run around burning buildings, shooting aliens and being 'all round good', then you can't have weapons that are particularly effective at one job. Say DI and structure clearing.
This is what is causing the long stalemates at the moment. When we finally get weapons becoming more 'role specific' like the siege ARC and Onos, things will get better.
I would really like to see this happening with the flame thrower currently, and sentries.
Flamethrower is for still really good for close combat but as attachment for Rifle it would be also strong for mod/long range too.
I don't know if that would be good for balancing :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If it has less ammo and shorter range, i guess its not that op.
Better then the actual very op Flamethrower, which has a very long range and if they realy decrease the range and/or damage, the weapon is to weak.
Sometimes a fade die in a second, sometimes he take like a whole magazine...weird.
So my guess is the best mix is have it like the GL.
Anyway i am wonder what UWE will do...it will be very hard to balance i guess, even if more marines got a flamethrower, its like a massacre.
Flamey starts off relatively weak but with extra investment in time and resources you can beef it up.
I just don't get why people don't see the potential for the flame thrower to be something very powerful, long range, and cinematic.
All that needs to be done is to add a level of realism to it.
You don't see any youtube clips of a guy with a flmethrower running around spining 360 degrees and firing it do you? Or firing it in small spaces? Through team mates?
<b>
Positives:</b>
I really believe the best thing for the flame thrower is to give it that role of DI clearing and structure clearing, and very powerful from the front. Anything in front gets cooked real quick. Even aliens.
<b>
Negatives:</b>
But limit it to teams by upping the cost, and make it very vulnerable from rear attack (through slow aim and movement when firing) or attack without support from at least 2 marines. So if the marines think they can get away with having 4 flame throwers in a hive at a time, they will be much mistaken. As much for friendly fire, as being slow to react.
It would boost team play, and make weapons EFFECTIVE IN SPECIFIC ROLES.
It would actually make the game easier to balance, because when everything is balanced based upon damage everything becomes samey and it is hard to balance. Where as if you consider balance being speed, XYZ movement, aim speed, reload speed, hindering sight, hindering hearing, etc, etc... you can have the weapons you have always dream of - but with the offset of negatives in other ways.
L4D2 did this so well - with zombies having huge strengths, but also huge weaknesses. But as a good team, unstoppable.
But good points Runteh. Hope they'll do it like your suggested.
very good, maybe like the fade second attack, which slows you down too, let me see...
Remember that Onos? He's got rather a lot of armour on it, wouldn't surprise me if he's flame resistant.
people who ask to enhance this weapon further simply out of their minds, or don't bother playing aliens at all. it really does ruin ns2.
Remember that Onos? He's got rather a lot of armour on it, wouldn't surprise me if he's flame resistant.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
kSkulkHealth = 70 kSkulkArmor = 10
kGorgeHealth = 150 kGorgeArmor = 50
kLerkHealth = 125 kLerkArmor = 30
kFadeHealth = 300 kFadeArmor = 100
kOnosHealth = 700 kOnosArmor = 600
We need Harimau to analyze the Flamer take armor thing ^^
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->// Calculate damage absorbed by armor according to damage type
local absorbPercentage = self:GetArmorAbsorbPercentage(damageType)
// Each point of armor blocks a point of health but is only destroyed at half that rate (like NS1)
healthPointsBlocked = math.min(self.armor, absorbPercentage * damage )
armorPointsUsed = healthPointsBlocked / self:GetHealthPerArmor(damageType)
// Anything left over comes off of health
healthPointsUsed = damage - healthPointsBlocked<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->kDamageType.Flame<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Is it in the engine?
I can't find the type, its only in the table of Globals.lua
As of now, adding a flame thrower attachment to the rifle gives WAAAAY too much versatility and ammo to a single marine main weapon.
BTW I tried killing an invisible Onos (cheats 1; spawn onos) with a flame thrower. Boy... Was it tough to cook.
As of now, adding a flame thrower attachment to the rifle gives WAAAAY too much versatility and ammo to a single marine main weapon.
BTW I tried killing an invisible Onos (cheats 1; spawn onos) with a flame thrower. Boy... Was it tough to cook.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
its not invisible, there is just no model "in the beta" yet...there is a model but UWE keeps it ^^
Its beta but the "invisible/not have a model" onos takes like 2 flamethrower magazines until its dead, compared to a fade which takes 2/3 of 1 magazine, a lerk only take 1/2 of 1 magazine.
A skulk need 3 seconds to die...
To empty a whole FT mag. it takes 10 seconds on local server.
Looking at the flamer damage: 35 every 0.5 seconds for 10 seconds. 700 damage, plus any lingering burn effects. Whether someone burns or goes out is 100% to do with chance. Assuming they get set fire to after first taking damage, and go out straight after the flamer runs out of ammo, that's only an extra 10 seconds of burn damage: 100 damage. 800 damage total. Add Weapon3: 800 => 1040 hp (haven't checked this, just guessing). An Onos should be able to tank two "clips" of flamethrowers dealing their full damage.
Also, I'd love to see a late-game "heavy damage" upgrade + larger mag, for the rifle. It would convert the rifle's current 'normal' damage-type to a 'heavy' damage-type (HealthPerArmor from 2 to 1). It wouldn't affect damage too drastically, it'd just halve the effectiveness of armour to block hp. It'd make the rifle more useful in the late-game.