Do you think UWE should not have given us alpha access?
Faskalia
Wechsellichtzeichenanlage Join Date: 2004-09-12 Member: 31651Members, Constellation
Wechsellichtzeichenanlage Join Date: 2004-09-12 Member: 31651Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">Regarding the understanding of alpha and the lack of level-headedness</div>Judging from alot of the post going on in NS2 General Discussion I began to wonder:
How many people actually read a thread or even the first post before replying and how many just quickly throw in one or two sentences after reading the topic title only.
So, feel free to show me that actually read more than the topic title, by citing your favorite quote from any source.
<!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=Caskie Stinnett)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Caskie Stinnett)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that you actually look forward to the trip.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
How many people actually read a thread or even the first post before replying and how many just quickly throw in one or two sentences after reading the topic title only.
So, feel free to show me that actually read more than the topic title, by citing your favorite quote from any source.
<!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=Caskie Stinnett)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Caskie Stinnett)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that you actually look forward to the trip.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Comments
<!--QuoteBegin-Christopher Hitchens+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Christopher Hitchens)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteEBegin-->9/11 was a faith-based initiative<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't want to believe, I want to know<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hopefully they'll be cursing themselves for being so thickheaded and realize the meaning behind the word 'alpha' but who knows.
If it would be any other company with a completely new title I think they'd be in trouble by now, but UWE still have a good following despite all that since they have made their mark with the first game. No need to worry tbh.
LH: "What the hell is that?"
SC: "I don't know but if cats could sing... they'd hate it too."<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In all seriousness if you think this alpha is anything but a positive you are deluding yourself.
1. Cash is king: the pre-order money alone is worth just about any possible hassle an internet forums can generate.
2. Testermers: There is no better QA team then the guys who will be using the final product, believe me no QA team in the world would even conceive of testing half the ###### a customer will try, and this means your QA team is paying you for the privilege of doing testing. This is what they call a win win.
3. Community feedback: This is a good thing even if you community is mostly populated by raging intolerant ###### and 90% of everything they say is complete and utter ###### (which is certainly not the chase here) some of them will still occasionally have a good idea, a good idea which you didn’t have to pay someone a $50,000-$90,000 a year salary to generate.
Why do this all in alpha in place of beta? Simple, the longer a bug or poor design choice stays in code the harder and more costly it gets to get rid of. Add this on to the fact that at some point you will need to give your product to your customers, and that some of them will always be discontent with the product they receive. It makes nothing but sense to start this process early when it is cheap to make changes that make the majority happy.
lol
they really should have put a disclaimer on start-up that defines what "alpha" state means.
Just think- if they hadn't given us alpha access, it's not like they'd magically know that there is a scaling problem with their netcode and with hit registration. Those problems need to be fixed eventually and the game is unplayable until they are, so the sooner the better, right?
Just think- if they hadn't given us alpha access, it's not like they'd magically know that there is a scaling problem with their netcode and with hit registration. Those problems need to be fixed eventually and the game is unplayable until they are, so the sooner the better, right?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ding ding ding.
We have a winner. All the major issues they're fixing now are ones discovered through community testing. They were probably aware that there would be issues but in order for them to track it down quickly you do need a large base to gather data from.
(going off into thoughts) You know, everybody has different paths and lessons in life (that is if you LIVE you life in the first place!) Some people will be very happy with nothing and other just want more. It doesn't really depend on what it is that is actually in their hands. I think the devs know this well and when they hear spoilt brats complaining about theres not this, theres not that, AND its definitely on their to do list, well, they know what that comment is worth.
I dunno, it was interesting to look at the thread with the actual topic in mind. I was a bit reluctant to post though, because people are more likely to look at the latest responses
I was going to post a quote as first post but I can't remember any, which is odd because I own like three or four books full of them.
It is tempting to get cassel's humourous quotations off my bookcase and go through the thread posting witty quotes in response to everything.
As a result of the pre-release updates I bought the alpha.
I don't test much, but I play every patch.
I don't read forums much, I don't think there's much to contribute yet.
So for keeping people interested in NS2, I think the alpha release is fantastic.
It's fair enough saying that an alpha might by definition mean an unplayable/unstable/heavily-bug-ridden version of the game, but only people aware of the software development cycle would know this (as numerous people have pointed out in various threads, the bigger developers/publishers don't do public Alpha's, but then this also means that the average gamer doesn't know what an Alpha is, or know what to expect, as they've never been involved with one). The problem therefore lies in the way in which UWE advertised the Alpha as part of the Special Edition package. It sort of implied that the Alpha would be playable - after all, if a games developer were to try to entice you with "early access to version XXXX", you'd naturally assume version XXXX to be a playable version (even if it were raw/unpolished/etc), otherwise why is he dangling it as a carrot on a stick in front of you? I mean, look at this banner in terms of what UWE advertised:
<img src="http://www.unknownworlds.com/images/banners/banner_alpha.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
It says "Play the Alpha...". Clearly, therefore, there was an [implied] intention on UWE's part that the Alpha would be playable in some shape or form, yet this contradicts those arguements put forward that an Alpha isn't a playable version of the game and that everyone should know this. Yes, "play" may have meant "try" in this instance, but that's hardly clear. Us fanboys will be happy to sit here and understand UWE's development cycle, but that doesn't mean everyone else has to too. This is why markets have to cater towards their customers rather than the other way around (think of financial products for example) - often the customers aren't knowledgable on the intricacies of whatever product they're being offered, so there needs to be more tact to avoid the sort of misunderstanding that might mislead or frustrate/annoy potential customers.
Maybe this version of the game we have should have been released as a "Pre-alpha", with a statement saying that the pre-alpha is not intended to be a fully playable version of the game? UWE still get thousands of us to test their game, they still get our feedback, but they don't have a proprtion of customers unhappy because they've expected something different (even if that's the fault of the layman customer, it's still better for UWE to avoid this sort of disappointment).
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->War is God's way of teaching Americans geography.
- Ambrose Bierce<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sit back and enjoy these early days where features are getting implemented, removed, tweaked, and balanced. It's a very lively phase of the game that passes quickly, and you'll come to miss it a little when we have a stable game that we come to know and love.
If people can't do that, and they fail to appreciate what the NS2 alpha has to share, then that is their loss. Not to make UWE sound like mustache twirling villains, but they've already got the money. They've already explained why they needed to take preorders and why they pushed back the release date, so anyone who is unhappy with the game so far is either ignorant, or dumb enough to pay 50$ for something they had a poor understanding of.
With the amount of bitter and angry people on these forums, it becomes eerily easy to forget that this is a video game. Something intended for fun. An online social interaction. I'm finding myself visiting these forums less and less not because of the game's development, but because of those following it.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->"It's a dangerous business going out of your door. You step into the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there is no knowing where you might be swept off to."<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
My only suggestion, well its too late now, is that it should have been made more clear that this is an alpha. On the load screen menu it could say prominently 'this is alpha' etc etc. That would have mitigated the whining and angry complaints.
NS2 is a game many people have hoped for, and quietly dreamed of, for the better part of a decade. Rumours abounded for a long time. Thanks to the Alpha, people now have proof that NS2 is not vaporware. That in itself is marketing gold.
Of course I may be biased, I wouldn't have been able to have fun making my channel without it!
To answer the thread question, NO. They sold the game with alpha, they delivered and are continuing to deliver on it.
We have already seen that money put to good use with the hiring of a new programmer which will also speed up development.
Also if any of these people have asked for refunds, all I can say is good riddance you sodding cs kiddies your the bain of the internets and I hope you all die in the rotting cess pool that is 4chan :p
As a final and slightly offtopic point the moaning about the game using steam is completly retarded, from a commercial perpective it would be suicide to use anything else.
The vast majority of NS1 players made the jump to steam so it makes more sense to have the new game follow them also valve takes a greatly reduced cut of the profits than a retail approach through a publisher would and at the same time UWE retain there creative control all in all this keeps the game viable and I dont think it would be without it.
something incredibly amusing about a rant like that spelled wrong.
cs is still one of the best (feeling) fps's around. don't even mention source.