I don't really see the point of "marines can only assist with research" unless you mean the comm has to research welders, in which case, sure, we'll throw that in too. I'd assume welders weren't available at the beginning, since they would assist heavies.
<!--quoteo(post=1791213:date=Aug 3 2010, 09:18 PM:name=Harimau)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Harimau @ Aug 3 2010, 09:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1791213"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Is sarcasm REALLY that hard to make out over the internet? I'm a firm believer in the prospects of internet sarcasm.
But really, though. Either way, you've got two groups: You've got a <b>dead weight</b>: the player holding the USE key on a building (NS1), or the MAC moving/building (NS2); and you've got the <b>players protecting the dead weight</b>. At least in the second case you've got +1 players protecting the dead weight. However, you do end up with annoying escort missions, and lack the flexibility of the ninja option. And that's where the MACPack comes in.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well you little "Sarcasm Ninja" What about a pop up game of Zen of Sudoku while you're building a RT tower ? or what about only being able to use a nitendo wii remote, that is Ninja !?
<u>Is sarcasm REALLY that hard to make out over the internet? I'm a firm believer in the prospects of internet sarcasm.</u>
I like the MACs and Drifters for their purpose as such and really I think that they should be reserved for building special buildings like CCs, the Hive, and different chambers/armories etc. The purpose as such: they are a material being transformed into another. This also adds importance to their role.
However, I believe the ability to place and build RTs should be something that players can help with or gorges are able to do. This adds some strategy to the player level and takes away the dependency on a poor commander to properly advice people where to go and what to do. One of the benefits of being a marine with a commander who never really gave any directions is if you had a group of 3 and you could walk out you could usually capture some rooms with RTs and then call on the commander to place them then build. You didn't have to worry about the commander making sure thats where he intended to build.
So I think that marines should be able to build also, but at a definitely slower pace, and only non special structures like RTs, turrets things of that nature. The marines might also require "buying at item" or putting some points into a proficiency tech or something of that nature to be able to build.
<!--coloro:#ffff00--><span style="color:#ffff00"><!--/coloro-->1<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> (one) as in the last poll and in all my previous posts related to the topic of "lets stop having ghost-disputes about gameplay before the blody game is halfway playable'.
QuovatisTeam InversionJoin Date: 2010-01-26Member: 70321Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited August 2010
3:ADE
MACs can only construct within the power grid requirements. Buildings outside the powergrid MUST be built by marines. Marines build slower than MACs and require a welder.
<!--quoteo(post=1791276:date=Aug 3 2010, 05:33 PM:name=IeptBarakat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (IeptBarakat @ Aug 3 2010, 05:33 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1791276"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Look at what these mac/builbots do. They promote lazyness. A marine should always have something to do.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I guess this is the most realistic of choices then? <a href="http://www.theonion.com/video/ultrarealistic-modern-warfare-game-features-awaiti,14382/" target="_blank">http://www.theonion.com/video/ultrarealist...s-awaiti,14382/</a>
2 by far, with A. B and D thrown in. I really really really dont want Ghost buildings being dropped again.
I love the new direction NS2 is going with using MACs to build. But i just dont want it to be the only option in the game. Having marines build should be a backup solution to suicidal kharaa eating MACs. It should take longer to build stuff and be annoying to do so that using MACs is always better. Otherwise the game will turn into an ignore the mac game... who cares about killing a mac if the marines can carry on building just as easily. it would lead to marines being totally focused everytime then killing the MAC afterwards when theres no worries about anybody building at all.
MACs can build faster than marines but will only work on the powergrid. So MACs are like a home-turf advantage and you'll need actual people to do the badass stealth bases outside of hives and such.
My vote (which I posted in the twitter thread) is for a different option.
I think we should make it where the MAC is deployed into a structure by the comm and then the marines build it. It could also serve auxiliary purposes like welding, etc. but as soon as it's deployed and built into an RT, armory, etc. then that's it. It would also be cool if the comm could un-deploy it back into a MAC as long as no one has begun building. (i.e. comm deploys MAC into RT, marine gets killed, comm un-deploys RT into MAC and tries to escape from the skulk, etc.) If the marine starts building, it could no longer be "un-deployed" and would have to be recycled at that point.
I think the ghost should appear for marines no matter what, so they can see what the commander has planned. But it should only be started by a MAC or a marine with a special kit (not a welder)...once started it can be assisted by anyone
Marine building was one of the many aspect that made NS1 my favorite FPS of all time, not only did it force the commander to rely on his marines, but it also gave the marines something to do other than run around and kill random enemies. Maybe its just me, but I was one of the first people to jump on a commanders order to build something, on top of that, I always liked the risk-reward factor of making marines build stuff. in NS1 they had to build things, but they also had to keep an ear open and pay attention to catch any aliens approaching them. A good marine could build and protect himself at the same time (well, not build WHILE he was protecting himself, but you get the point), it expanded gameplay so it wasn't just point and shoot for marines (same with welders).
But, MACs are a good concept too, it means the commander doesn't have to rely on his team as much, while also relying on them more in a sense (he doesn't have to give them an order to go build something, instead he can order them to protect the MAC). That essentially makes it easier to build, as you have more marines watching the building instead of one lookout with a couple building it. But as the MAC is a robot, it should be able to build faster than the marines can, to promote the use of MACs. Also, with the MAC, the commander can build back at the base without having to keep a marine or two there, or jump out of the chair to build.
1, I would like to try the way it is now first, I never really liked building (holding a key for 20 secs), and the speed macs are building marines are outdated anyway..
I don't know if anyone has suggested this, but I've seen it mentioned that people think that "holding e" puts the player in a passive role. While I don't necessarily think that pressing "e" to build a structure makes the marine passive (considering the threat of being attacked), I would like to propose the idea of adding a mini game to building structures that could help the marine build structures faster as well as keep him in an active role.
One aspect from the game Moonbase Alpha by NASA is that when building various equipment instead of it just taking a certain amount of time a player can speed up how long it takes to fix a structure by correctly playing a minigame. Something like this can help players build more efficiently as well as keep them "active" instead of passively just pressing e.
See this video for an example (the video is sped up here but you'll get the idea), <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s</a> (mini game at 1:58 seconds)
<!--quoteo(post=1791362:date=Aug 3 2010, 05:41 PM:name=trendynoise)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (trendynoise @ Aug 3 2010, 05:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1791362"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't know if anyone has suggested this, but I've seen it mentioned that people think that "holding e" puts the player in a passive role. While I don't necessarily think that pressing "e" to build a structure makes the marine passive (considering the threat of being attacked), I would like to propose the idea of adding a mini game to building structures that could help the marine build structures faster as well as keep him in an active role.
One aspect from the game Moonbase Alpha by NASA is that when building various equipment instead of it just taking a certain amount of time a player can speed up how long it takes to fix a structure by correctly playing a minigame. Something like this can help players build more efficiently as well as keep them "active" instead of passively just pressing e.
See this video for an example (the video is sped up here but you'll get the idea), <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s</a> (mini game at 1:58 seconds)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Comments
Regardless, 1 or 2AB.
I don't really see the point of "marines can only assist with research" unless you mean the comm has to research welders, in which case, sure, we'll throw that in too. I'd assume welders weren't available at the beginning, since they would assist heavies.
But really, though. Either way, you've got two groups:
You've got a <b>dead weight</b>: the player holding the USE key on a building (NS1), or the MAC moving/building (NS2); and you've got the <b>players protecting the dead weight</b>.
At least in the second case you've got +1 players protecting the dead weight. However, you do end up with annoying escort missions, and lack the flexibility of the ninja option.
And that's where the MACPack comes in.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well you little "Sarcasm Ninja" What about a pop up game of Zen of Sudoku while you're building a RT tower ? or what about only being able to use a nitendo wii remote, that is Ninja !?
<u>Is sarcasm REALLY that hard to make out over the internet? I'm a firm believer in the prospects of internet sarcasm.</u>
However, I believe the ability to place and build RTs should be something that players can help with or gorges are able to do. This adds some strategy to the player level and takes away the dependency on a poor commander to properly advice people where to go and what to do. One of the benefits of being a marine with a commander who never really gave any directions is if you had a group of 3 and you could walk out you could usually capture some rooms with RTs and then call on the commander to place them then build. You didn't have to worry about the commander making sure thats where he intended to build.
So I think that marines should be able to build also, but at a definitely slower pace, and only non special structures like RTs, turrets things of that nature. The marines might also require "buying at item" or putting some points into a proficiency tech or something of that nature to be able to build.
MACs can only construct within the power grid requirements. Buildings outside the powergrid MUST be built by marines. Marines build slower than MACs and require a welder.
Look at what these mac/builbots do. They promote lazyness. A marine should always have something to do.
Cheers,
Cody
I guess this is the most realistic of choices then?
<a href="http://www.theonion.com/video/ultrarealistic-modern-warfare-game-features-awaiti,14382/" target="_blank">http://www.theonion.com/video/ultrarealist...s-awaiti,14382/</a>
I love the MACs predominately because playing as comm
and having no one building sucks.
this is the biggest problem I think they will solve.
But at the same time if the MAC is the single point of failure as an alien
I would target them ALL the time over the marines.
If a MAC builds 50% of something before an alien makes it go pop...I want to finish it.
1.
I really really really dont want Ghost buildings being dropped again.
I love the new direction NS2 is going with using MACs to build.
But i just dont want it to be the only option in the game.
Having marines build should be a backup solution to suicidal kharaa eating MACs.
It should take longer to build stuff and be annoying to do so that using MACs is always better.
Otherwise the game will turn into an ignore the mac game... who cares about killing a mac if the marines can carry on building just as easily. it would lead to marines being totally focused everytime then killing the MAC afterwards when theres no worries about anybody building at all.
MACs can build faster than marines but will only work on the powergrid. So MACs are like a home-turf advantage and you'll need actual people to do the badass stealth bases outside of hives and such.
I think we should make it where the MAC is deployed into a structure by the comm and then the marines build it. It could also serve auxiliary purposes like welding, etc. but as soon as it's deployed and built into an RT, armory, etc. then that's it. It would also be cool if the comm could un-deploy it back into a MAC as long as no one has begun building. (i.e. comm deploys MAC into RT, marine gets killed, comm un-deploys RT into MAC and tries to escape from the skulk, etc.) If the marine starts building, it could no longer be "un-deployed" and would have to be recycled at that point.
I think the ghost should appear for marines no matter what, so they can see what the commander has planned. But it should only be started by a MAC or a marine with a special kit (not a welder)...once started it can be assisted by anyone
Marine building was one of the many aspect that made NS1 my favorite FPS of all time, not only did it force the commander to rely on his marines, but it also gave the marines something to do other than run around and kill random enemies. Maybe its just me, but I was one of the first people to jump on a commanders order to build something, on top of that, I always liked the risk-reward factor of making marines build stuff. in NS1 they had to build things, but they also had to keep an ear open and pay attention to catch any aliens approaching them. A good marine could build and protect himself at the same time (well, not build WHILE he was protecting himself, but you get the point), it expanded gameplay so it wasn't just point and shoot for marines (same with welders).
But, MACs are a good concept too, it means the commander doesn't have to rely on his team as much, while also relying on them more in a sense (he doesn't have to give them an order to go build something, instead he can order them to protect the MAC). That essentially makes it easier to build, as you have more marines watching the building instead of one lookout with a couple building it. But as the MAC is a robot, it should be able to build faster than the marines can, to promote the use of MACs. Also, with the MAC, the commander can build back at the base without having to keep a marine or two there, or jump out of the chair to build.
I do not want ghost buildings. I can kind of see the point in 2, but I think 1 is still the best.
If marines get to build, it needs to be extremely secondary to MACs building. Slower and costly/limited.
One aspect from the game Moonbase Alpha by NASA is that when building various equipment instead of it just taking a certain amount of time a player can speed up how long it takes to fix a structure by correctly playing a minigame. Something like this can help players build more efficiently as well as keep them "active" instead of passively just pressing e.
See this video for an example (the video is sped up here but you'll get the idea), <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s</a>
(mini game at 1:58 seconds)
One aspect from the game Moonbase Alpha by NASA is that when building various equipment instead of it just taking a certain amount of time a player can speed up how long it takes to fix a structure by correctly playing a minigame. Something like this can help players build more efficiently as well as keep them "active" instead of passively just pressing e.
See this video for an example (the video is sped up here but you'll get the idea), <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmAGNTzpINE#t=1m58s</a>
(mini game at 1:58 seconds)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wrong thread to post this.